Black Market Guns

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Black Market Guns

Post by Anon E Mouse » 05 Jul 2017, 5:47 pm

I've been in a discussion (more of an argument really) with an Australian obnoxiously criticizing us for our guns in the USA, and getting most of her facts wrong in the process. It was an exercise in misinformation and general silliness. She, incredibly, said that the reason Americans don't see the problem with guns is because of deep seated cultural cognitive dissonance. I filed that under the irony heading. Anyway, one thing she claimed is that a black market hand gun in Australia is $15,000. I find this rather hard to believe. It seems to me that if $15,000 was the going price for a handgun people would be knocking themselves out to smuggle them into the country before increased supply undermined these prices. Her claim seems unbelievable to me.

Note that I'm not advocating smuggling guns into Australia or any other illegal activity under Australia's laws. It just seems that this claim of hers as to the price of black market guns is outlandish. Reading the few newspaper accounts I've been able to find on this makes it seem that there is no shortage of illegally imported guns in Sydney and Melbourne.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by dpskipper » 17 Jul 2017, 2:39 pm

Shes a stupid libshit. Can't argue with dumb
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by southwest shooter » 17 Jul 2017, 2:59 pm

Sounds like a fakn idjiit to me .
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by AusTac » 17 Jul 2017, 3:22 pm

Agree to disagree and move on eaither to another topic or just walk away, shes not worth your time or breath
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Daddybang » 17 Jul 2017, 4:07 pm

15,000 for a black market hand gun. :lol: :lol: :lol: maybe 1500 but I'm not in the illegal gun game so that's just a guess. Some people are really not worth wasting ya breath on. :drinks:
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Tinked » 17 Jul 2017, 4:33 pm

Daddybang wrote:15,000 for a black market hand gun. :lol: :lol: :lol: maybe 1500 but I'm not in the illegal gun game so that's just a guess. Some people are really not worth wasting ya breath on. :drinks:


The cops have quoted prices in several articles over the years when they've found them and it's never anything like $15k.

Hundreds or low thousands for something particular/rare.

I guess she's trying to paint the picture that all us LAFO are going to struggle with the temptation not to sell our firearms on the black market.

I'm super keen to sell my guns that are registered with the state police and due to be inspected. Fool proof money maker, right? :sarcasm:

She's talking nonsense.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by 9line » 17 Jul 2017, 4:43 pm

...and tonight on A Current Affair, the gun-nut website openly discussing black market weapons, how to keep your kids safe from them coming up next!
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Wombat » 17 Jul 2017, 11:02 pm

A long time ago I ran out of fuel in Clifton Hill on a Motorbike and had a Motorcycle courier stop and help. It must have been just after the Hoddle St Shootings, because the conversation turned to the coming changes to Victorian Firearms laws.Turns out he had come over from WA after serving time for thieving a dozen or so L1A1's, he said that he had gotten $2500 ea for them back then. $2500 in the 1980's isn't that far off $15000 now.
Only met the bloke once, never wanted anything to do with dodgy types, he may have just been full of it.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by pete1 » 17 Jul 2017, 11:13 pm

Maybe if it was a Automatic pistol 15000 I've heard figgers of 5000 on the black market for a handgun, In life there is lots of people who know little but think the know it all.
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Post by GLS_1956 » 17 Jul 2017, 11:43 pm

Well the only "Black Market" guns I've heard of, and I'm assuming that they were stolen, were going for a couple of hundred dollars.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by pomemax » 18 Jul 2017, 12:28 am

Never argue with an idiot, People watching won’t be able to tell the difference.
Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Just two of the many quote ,s from history
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by gregcka » 20 Jul 2017, 4:16 pm

Thing is if you really wanted one,you could get one.
I have heard between 3-5k.
P.S Dont know were I heard that. :crazy:
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Heckler303 » 21 Jul 2017, 8:43 am

I'm sure we have all heard in passing of black market firearms, and with that, I've not heard of any of them being anywhere near that price. She's obviously making that up on the spot.

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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Osty » 21 Jul 2017, 2:28 pm

Although $15k sounds a little ludicrous, I'd be fairly confident in assuming a black market handgun here would be significantly more expensive than the legal equivalent in the US. Significant enough to encourage these guys to break the law trying to smuggle them in:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-05-15/f ... wn/8526592

The substance of the argument is sound though the numbers she claims may be exaggerated. I wouldn't write her off as a 'stupid libtard' on this point.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by sungazer » 21 Jul 2017, 2:34 pm

Im sure that smuggling in dope would be easier and more profitable on a weight and size basis. I would rekon that most illegal guns would be from Australian legal stock once upon a time.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Gwion » 21 Jul 2017, 4:20 pm

sungazer wrote:Im sure that smuggling in dope would be easier and more profitable on a weight and size basis. I would rekon that most illegal guns would be from Australian legal stock once upon a time.


I hope you are wearing your asbestos suit because that is a very unpopular and questionable view point. Kind'a makes you sound like a anti gun activist. :problem:
In fact, there were submissions to the resent senate inquiry from state police services that actually dispute this point. When it comes to illicit hand guns; and let's face it, drug lords aren't interested in target rifles as a tool of trade; the problem is by far and away our porous boarders and ease of smuggling.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by bladeracer » 21 Jul 2017, 7:31 pm

sungazer wrote:Im sure that smuggling in dope would be easier and more profitable on a weight and size basis. I would rekon that most illegal guns would be from Australian legal stock once upon a time.



I would agree that most illegal guns by far were legally owned here, if you accept that they're illegal simply because they've never been registered. There are probably way more than a million "illegal" firearms still around. We know they were imported by the container load, they were sold to the public in the hundreds of thousands, they have never been handed in, so unless we accept that the owners themselves destroyed all these firearms or shipped them overseas then they do still exist out there somewhere.

But these firearms are not showing up in criminal activity or even in criminal hands. They aren't showing up at all. I'm talking about all the M1 Carbines, SKS rifles, AG42's, Mini-14's and such that many, many shooters owned in the eighties. In my book though, these firearms cannot be considered in the same analysis as criminally-owned firearms. They were made illegal by an act of the government, and may well be made legal again if we can fix our stupid laws. They clearly don't do any harm within society and it would be a immense waste of resources to go looking for them. Criminally-owned guns are generally not old legally-owned guns that went rogue. They simply import whatever they want when they want it.

We like to think ourselves isolated from the nasties on our little "island", but PNG is only 150kms away (David Walliams _swam_ further than that), the longest stretch of water is under 50km. Pulau Yamenda is 320kms and Timor is 450kms away. Boats or seaplanes would consider it a mere hop and well worth the slight risk. And I'm sure these places have literally tons of firearms lying around, and no problem getting more of the same.
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Re: Black Market Guns

Post by Daddybang » 21 Jul 2017, 7:41 pm

bladeracer wrote:
sungazer wrote:Im sure that smuggling in dope would be easier and more profitable on a weight and size basis. I would rekon that most illegal guns would be from Australian legal stock once upon a time.



I would agree that most illegal guns by far were legally owned here, if you accept that they're illegal simply because they've never been registered. There are probably way more than a million "illegal" firearms still around. We know they were imported by the container load, they were sold to the public in the hundreds of thousands, they have never been handed in, so unless we accept that the owners themselves destroyed all these firearms or shipped them overseas then they do still exist out there somewhere.

But these firearms are not showing up in criminal activity or even in criminal hands. They aren't showing up at all. I'm talking about all the M1 Carbines, SKS rifles, AG42's, Mini-14's and such that many, many shooters owned in the eighties. In my book though, these firearms cannot be considered in the same analysis as criminally-owned firearms. They were made illegal by an act of the government, and may well be made legal again if we can fix our stupid laws. They clearly don't do any harm within society and it would be a immense waste of resources to go looking for them. Criminally-owned guns are generally not old legally-owned guns that went rogue. They simply import whatever they want when they want it.

We like to think ourselves isolated from the nasties on our little "island", but PNG is only 150kms away (David Walliams _swam_ further than that), the longest stretch of water is under 50km. Pulau Yamenda is 320kms and Timor is 450kms away. Boats or seaplanes would consider it a mere hop and well worth the slight risk. And I'm sure these places have literally tons of firearms lying around, and no problem getting more of the same.



Yep saibai is only 13km from png (you can see the png coast flying in) Noone really knows how much contraband comes in from the Torres straits thru the Cape and gulf country. :unknown:
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