Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Gaznazdiak » 11 Dec 2018, 5:03 pm

What Blade said +1
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bigrich » 11 Dec 2018, 5:39 pm

GCA australia are unreasonable fanatics in my opinion, as well as some animal welfare oraganisations they would rather see all our native species exterminated by ferals and thousands of kangaroos dyeing of thirst and starvation during drought due to over population than responsable management of 'roo population . all because of their lack of open mindedness to look at facts .GCA is a bit like trying to explain charles darwin's proven theory of evolution to a religeous fanatic . they just don't want to see any other truth than the fairy tales they choose to beleive in :crazy:

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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Ecobogan » 11 Dec 2018, 6:12 pm

Ok thanks. I didn't mean literally impenetrable, I'm a metal fabricator and know this can't be done, I just thought that if we gun owners were seen to be really trying in very reasonable ways.
Fellas I'm just trying to think of every conceivable way around this and my persistence is probably getting frustrating to you crew.... I just think there's gotta be a way.
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bladeracer » 11 Dec 2018, 6:26 pm

Ecobogan wrote:Ok thanks. I didn't mean literally impenetrable, I'm a metal fabricator and know this can't be done, I just thought that if we gun owners were seen to be really trying in very reasonable ways.
Fellas I'm just trying to think of every conceivable way around this and my persistence is probably getting frustrating to you crew.... I just think there's gotta be a way.


We are already doing far more than is necessary from a purely "public safety" point of view.

They forced us to make our cars unstealable...so now the thieves simply steal the keys.
Same with gun safes.
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bigrich » 11 Dec 2018, 7:20 pm

Ecobogan wrote:Ok thanks. I didn't mean literally impenetrable, I'm a metal fabricator and know this can't be done, I just thought that if we gun owners were seen to be really trying in very reasonable ways.
Fellas I'm just trying to think of every conceivable way around this and my persistence is probably getting frustrating to you crew.... I just think there's gotta be a way.


i'm a sheet metal worker myself . on a rural property where noise isn't a issue, you could attack a safe in the right way with a petrol powered demo saw and cut open the sturdiest safe. either that. or in a suburban enviroment you could be subject of a home invasion for the keys. just like blade mentioned about cars being unstealable, so they come after the keys . maybe serious jail time for perpetrators of such crimes. hang on, wait a minute let's increase penalty on all serious crime and actually make crims accountable. nah, can't do that, the revolving door system we got generates too much money for the legal eagles and keeps them in steady employment :sarcasm:
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by grandadbushy » 11 Dec 2018, 8:20 pm

YES, bigrich heaven forbid if we stood our ground and defended ourselves we have to pay for our legals
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Ecobogan » 11 Dec 2018, 10:17 pm

bigrich wrote:
Ecobogan wrote:Ok thanks. I didn't mean literally impenetrable, I'm a metal fabricator and know this can't be done, I just thought that if we gun owners were seen to be really trying in very reasonable ways.
Fellas I'm just trying to think of every conceivable way around this and my persistence is probably getting frustrating to you crew.... I just think there's gotta be a way.


i'm a sheet metal worker myself . on a rural property where noise isn't a issue, you could attack a safe in the right way with a petrol powered demo saw and cut open the sturdiest safe. either that. or in a suburban enviroment you could be subject of a home invasion for the keys. just like blade mentioned about cars being unstealable, so they come after the keys . maybe serious jail time for perpetrators of such crimes. hang on, wait a minute let's increase penalty on all serious crime and actually make crims accountable. nah, can't do that, the revolving door system we got generates too much money for the legal eagles and keeps them in steady employment :sarcasm:


Mate I understand perfectly that given enough time etc a demo saw will have you in anywhere..... that's not the point. The point is brainstorming this sucker.... that's how negotiations work.
GCA is a formidable opponent, true, I just find it hard to imagine that with all the minds here and the wider shooting community that we couldn't put a viable case forward.
They're used to being attacked not undermined and outwitted
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Ecobogan » 11 Dec 2018, 10:22 pm

Blade...you did actually say ' I couldn't agree more' on the mention of a total gun restructuring....how would you see that playing out?
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Baronvonrort » 11 Dec 2018, 10:28 pm

As for this so called redneck image I like to post this video to refute that.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BTET1J5fik
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bladeracer » 12 Dec 2018, 2:29 am

Ecobogan wrote:Blade...you did actually say ' I couldn't agree more' on the mention of a total gun restructuring....how would you see that playing out?


I had to go back to get the context.

I agree that our current firearm laws are a ludicrous adversarial mess driven by the view that the more onerous they make these laws that we comply with the less likely we are to bring new blood into the sport, or stay in the sport ourselves for the longterm. They have made it illegal in almost all states to teach people about firearms in the far more relaxed atmosphere of the home, farm or the bush. And they have made it illegal to hands-on educate kids in almost all states as well.

The penalties for even the most insignificant lapses are vindictive with severe consequences, and zero "public safety" aspect behind them.

The most sensible approach in my view is to scrap the NFA entirely as it has shown no benefit to our society whatsoever. Simply return us to the firearms laws we had pre-'96, laws that had worked just fine for four decades, and that would work just as effectively now. And if still wanted by the anti-gun brigade then new laws can be negotiated among all interested parties, over time, and in completely open discussion - instead of banging us with poorly-thought out and draconian laws overnight as Howard did. The "incidents" that lead to the NFA were not failures of the laws we had, they were failures of enforcement.
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bigrich » 12 Dec 2018, 4:47 am

To even suggest publicly, that we went back to pre John Howard laws would cause a major media storm. GCA would be doing interviews on every morning news show ranting and raving. They’d love it in a demented way. All I say ecobogan is look hard at the facts of port Arthur . There’s a lot of facts and statements from some very respectable people that were ignored or quashed. Makes JFK pale in comparison. The current status qo is not going to change anytime soon. At best we need stronger political representation to protect what rights we have left. JMHO
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Daddybang » 12 Dec 2018, 7:05 am

Baronvonrort wrote:As for this so called redneck image I like to post this video to refute that.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BTET1J5fik


:D :D :D :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :drinks:
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Ecobogan » 12 Dec 2018, 9:39 am

Baronvonrort wrote:As for this so called redneck image I like to post this video to refute that.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BTET1J5fik


Haha! Always been a fan of those two.... though I'm not sure how much use it is refuting it here.... we're not the ones who need convincing.
And thank you blade that's more the direction I was hoping this conversation could head. What shape the new gun laws could take and how we might get there.
Obviously I don't have the answers, I'm purely interested in hearing everyone's thoughts on it
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Ziad » 12 Dec 2018, 1:43 pm

Mate, I am going that you mean well. I am not a psychologist but other moe learned people have researched this issue. The internets is a wonderful place but has made people more dumber and more rigid in their thinking...aka its increasing stereotypes in people minds and even right or wrong ppl are getting their ideologies more ingrained.

In light of that looking at GCA agenda they want nothing but complete disarmament of the oxaliplatin as they feel this will completely stop any chance of gun violence and deaths due to firearms. Any argument and even proof to the contrary will not change their minds. Mind you this is a very small group (fringe) but very vocal with media ib their side.

On the other hand most ppl don't really care. Even some firearm owners don't really care, well they got their guns so what.

Then on the third hand a part of firearm owners who do care but due to vested interests can't agree asking themselves what is in the best interest of all firearm owners, not their turf.

So that's the story, and the story doesn't change. And nothing will get done. You will not get a roll back of the NFA ever, unless you are the only person alive in australia.. actually you can but the chances are as high as me winning 50m on tattslotto, when I only play it 1 or 2 times a year.
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Ecobogan » 12 Dec 2018, 3:12 pm

Hi and yes if course I mean well. I'm not particularly after an NFA rollback, that I think is more Blade and SFF's ideal. Mine would be one that might apease both sides.
I understand fully the points you've just raised however the reason I've kept pushing the 'all ideas on the table' is I've seen well thought through activism and negotiations work here and overseas.
Thanks to all who wrote in, it's a start
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by Daddybang » 12 Dec 2018, 3:25 pm

[quote="Ecobogan"] Mine would be one that might apease both sides.
I/quote]

Appeasement won't work with bullies and that is exactly what gca the greens and other anti firearms mobs are. They are rabbid fanatics that believe their way is the ONLY way. On several different occasions ssaa and other shooters groups have offered the antis a chance to sit down and talk and get a more informed view of shooting and hunting and have been soundly rebuffed.
Also doesn't help when supposed shooters(not directed at you) spout the same uninformed nonsense that alpers , sham lee and other clueless antis dribble.
Just my opinion not having a go at ya at all ecobogan. :thumbsup: :friends: :drinks:
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bigrich » 12 Dec 2018, 3:48 pm

Ziad wrote:Mate, I am going that you mean well. I am not a psychologist but other moe learned people have researched this issue. The internets is a wonderful place but has made people more dumber and more rigid in their thinking...aka its increasing stereotypes in people minds and even right or wrong ppl are getting their ideologies more ingrained.

In light of that looking at GCA agenda they want nothing but complete disarmament of the oxaliplatin as they feel this will completely stop any chance of gun violence and deaths due to firearms. Any argument and even proof to the contrary will not change their minds. Mind you this is a very small group (fringe) but very vocal with media ib their side.

On the other hand most ppl don't really care. Even some firearm owners don't really care, well they got their guns so what.

Then on the third hand a part of firearm owners who do care but due to vested interests can't agree asking themselves what is in the best interest of all firearm owners, not their turf.

So that's the story, and the story doesn't change. And nothing will get done. You will not get a roll back of the NFA ever, unless you are the only person alive in australia.. actually you can but the chances are as high as me winning 50m on tattslotto, when I only play it 1 or 2 times a year.


that's a very accurate assessment from my perspective ziad :drinks: :thumbsup:
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Re: Gun laws, the redneck image, and what we can do

Post by bigrich » 12 Dec 2018, 3:50 pm

Daddybang wrote:
Ecobogan wrote: Mine would be one that might apease both sides.
I/quote]

Appeasement won't work with bullies and that is exactly what gca the greens and other anti firearms mobs are. They are rabbid fanatics that believe their way is the ONLY way. On several different occasions ssaa and other shooters groups have offered the antis a chance to sit down and talk and get a more informed view of shooting and hunting and have been soundly rebuffed.
Also doesn't help when supposed shooters(not directed at you) spout the same uninformed nonsense that alpers , sham lee and other clueless antis dribble.
Just my opinion not having a go at ya at all ecobogan. :thumbsup: :friends: :drinks:


+1 for you too DB . got a bit of wet stuff headed your way soon mate ? :drinks: :thumbsup:
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