Rumour police seized firearms from unlocked cars at range

[bladeracer]

This SSAA article is interesting. https://ssaa.org.au/news-resources/fire ... h-firearms

As is this article in Sporting Shooter. http://www.sportingshooter.com.au/gun-l ... ose-cannon

The key points in the articles are that Police in each jurisdiction have been give wide powers when it comes to firearms. Also all license holders must adequately secure their guns. As law abiding firearms owners we all need to make sure we comply with the laws of the state or territory we are in with our guns. The first step with complying with the law is establishing what the laws are. We can all argue about whether the police have the power to check unlocked cars or not. But at the end of the day if you have inadequately stored your guns, you have no one else to blame for your legal difficulty.

This might be an unpopular view, but I can’t blame a police force for doing this. The criminally inclined seeking guns are going to target the places where they know the guns are. I think a gun club is a pretty obvious target for a crim. What is at all unreasonable about the police targeting a high risk area to ensure compliance with the law? Especially when they get a positive reinforcement that their concerns about a lackadaisical attitude to security are well founded?

I don't think anybody is disputing the results, and that anybody doing should have the book thrown at them. But I do not for one second believe their doing this prevents any crime or protects anybody from violence. While they're burning up hours doing this they could be out investigating actual criminal activity.

But I have a serious concern that Police are becoming immune to our laws.
How far are we from having them driving around the suburbs checking that houses are locked up, and stealing anything they find that might constitute a crime?

[Gaznazdiak]

f we bring more than one gun to my pistol club, you cannot leave it unattended in a LOCKED car, but must leave it with the duty officer (having more than one gun on the range at a time is strictly verboten)
When i go to the range my Range trolley has at least 3 rifles and a my pistol box may have up to 5 pistols, where in NSW approx is this range so i do not go there.

For what it's worth, if you go to Silverwater SSAA range (or at least it used to be that way, I haven't been to that range in a year or more, good people but single shot benchrest bores me stupid....) you can't take your rifle from your car until you've signed in. That means you have to leave them in your car while you sign in, and only then do you go get it. And they're pretty strict about it too. Had a couple of mates get a bollocking for walking in with their guns in gunbags on their way to sign in.

Similar situation at Goulburn range, it's a fair drive from home but it's the closest.
I went a couple of times before it was closed, and with the idea of security in mind, carried my rifle with the bolt and magazine removed, slung on my shoulder muzzle down when waiting my turn.
The president actually told me to just put it on the ground or leave it in the car as "some of the members objected" to my keeping it with me.

When I said I thought I was doing the right thing by not leaving it unattended, he scoffed at that idea as though I'd suggested I hold the bloody targets for them to shoot at.

They weren't all that way but there are some truly special people in the Goulburn target shooting community. I gave up the idea of pistol shooting because that club has some fvcking purlers, and several people I know who have enquired about joining were put off by the insular hostility towards newcomers.

[Patriot]

This SSAA article is interesting. https://ssaa.org.au/news-resources/fire ... h-firearms

As is this article in Sporting Shooter. http://www.sportingshooter.com.au/gun-l ... ose-cannon

The key points in the articles are that Police in each jurisdiction have been give wide powers when it comes to firearms. Also all license holders must adequately secure their guns. As law abiding firearms owners we all need to make sure we comply with the laws of the state or territory we are in with our guns. The first step with complying with the law is establishing what the laws are. We can all argue about whether the police have the power to check unlocked cars or not. But at the end of the day if you have inadequately stored your guns, you have no one else to blame for your legal difficulty.

This might be an unpopular view, but I can’t blame a police force for doing this. The criminally inclined seeking guns are going to target the places where they know the guns are. I think a gun club is a pretty obvious target for a crim. What is at all unreasonable about the police targeting a high risk area to ensure compliance with the law? Especially when they get a positive reinforcement that their concerns about a lackadaisical attitude to security are well founded?

I don't think anybody is disputing the results, and that anybody doing should have the book thrown at them. But I do not for one second believe their doing this prevents any crime or protects anybody from violence. While they're burning up hours doing this they could be out investigating actual criminal activity.

But I have a serious concern that Police are becoming immune to our laws.
How far are we from having them driving around the suburbs checking that houses are locked up, and stealing anything they find that might constitute a crime?

Police are becoming immune because citizens have allowed it.
Australians have a very poor attitude when comes holding governments to account we are complicit in our own fall into tyranny.

[Daddybang]

I think people would be very unpleasantly surprised if they took the time to read the police powers and responsibilities act for the different states regarding the searches section.

[marksman]

I have not been to little river, eagle park ssaa range for a couple of years now but when I did frequent that range this rumour was one of the made up rumour's that came up all the time, spread by the RO's created by the little river little d!ck chief range officer

can anyone say that they have been at a range anywhere in Australia and witnessed the police doing a carpark check

I do believe that you should lock up your firearms and ammo when being stored but don't believe this story to be fact

eagle park range need to get there security in order eg... secure the range so you have to sign in before you can enter the range
and stop these silly rumours

[Bruiser64]

I have not been to little river, eagle park ssaa range for a couple of years now but when I did frequent that range this rumour was one of the made up rumour's that came up all the time, spread by the RO's created by the little river little d!ck chief range officer

can anyone say that they have been at a range anywhere in Australia and witnessed the police doing a carpark check

I do believe that you should lock up your firearms and ammo when being stored but don't believe this story to be fact

eagle park range need to get there security in order eg... secure the range so you have to sign in before you can enter the range
and stop these silly rumours

I was wondering if anyone has actually experienced what this thread is about? I has a quick search on the NSW Police website and there are no press releases about searches at rifle ranges revealing widespread problems with unsecured firearms. If this event happened l have no doubt the police would publicise it.

The interesting thing about this discussion is people’s perceptions about the police not obeying the law. This link is very interesting to me. https://www.turnbullhill.com.au/article ... your-home/

Basically if the police suspect on reasonable grounds that there is something dangerous in a car, they have the RIGHT to search it. This right is given to them by the NSW Parliament. Just because a person doesn’t like them having that right doesn’t prevent the right existing.

You would be hard pressed to argue that an unsecured firearm wasn’t a dangerous item. The facts are that if I don’t meet my obligations to adequately secure my firearm, I am committing an offence. This means I am engaged in offending behaviour. This means I am an offender. The police have done their job to detect my offending and bring me to justice. Doesn’t sound too flash does it?

[zhuk]

If we bring more than one gun to my pistol club, you cannot leave it unattended in a LOCKED car, but must leave it with the duty officer (having more than one gun on the range at a time is strictly verboten)

So what would I do if I came with 35 rifles?

Well it's a pistol club so that's unlikely heh

But at my rifle club we park on the actual range just behind the mound/firing line, and no matter that we would see anyone else appearing from a mile off, regardless of how many rifles all cars are locked at all times.

[Bruiser64]

If we bring more than one gun to my pistol club, you cannot leave it unattended in a LOCKED car, but must leave it with the duty officer (having more than one gun on the range at a time is strictly verboten)

So what would I do if I came with 35 rifles?

Well it's a pistol club so that's unlikely heh

But at my rifle club we park on the actual range just behind the mound/firing line, and no matter that we would see anyone else appearing from a mile off, regardless of how many rifles all cars are locked at all times.

To me that sounds like you are a member of clubs that take their responsibilities seriously and the members hold each other to account. I would be very surprised if the overwhelming majority of clubs weren’t the same. Which is why I doubt that the police have conducted this operation. It wouldn’t achieve much. Here in WA they did an operation to check that gun owners were storing their firearms correctly. The police concluded that yes, they do.

[zhuk]

If we bring more than one gun to my pistol club, you cannot leave it unattended in a LOCKED car, but must leave it with the duty officer (having more than one gun on the range at a time is strictly verboten)

So what would I do if I came with 35 rifles?

Well it's a pistol club so that's unlikely heh

But at my rifle club we park on the actual range just behind the mound/firing line, and no matter that we would see anyone else appearing from a mile off, regardless of how many rifles all cars are locked at all times.

To me that sounds like you are a member of clubs that take their responsibilities seriously and the members hold each other to account. I would be very surprised if the overwhelming majority of clubs weren’t the same. Which is why I doubt that the police have conducted this operation. It wouldn’t achieve much. Here in WA they did an operation to check that gun owners were storing their firearms correctly. The police concluded that yes, they do.

Well FAR in NSW has been closing or attempting to close so many ranges in recent years that in general clubs are pretty adamant about being stickers for safe storage rules. And I have heard from club committee members that plain clothes officers patrolling shooters' cars is or has indeed been a thing here