Transporting Guns on V/Line Train

[TBJ]

Hi all
Im coming back from the country on a v/line train but i have my shotgun that i need to take with me and was wondering if i could take it on the train with me, Its in a hard case broken up, and i would be taking no ammo with me (shot it all)
if i am allowed to take it what precautions should i take?
according to Firearms Safety Organisation Vic
"On some shooting trips you will need to carry your firearm by public transport.
Similar/in addition to the above-listed precautions relevant to transport by car, always ensure you take precautions when travelling by other forms of transportation such as bus, train or aircraft.
Recent events have demonstrated that transportation of firearms via ‘public transport’ has the potential to arouse fear and alarm amongst other passengers, despite the fact that this was unintended.
Remember to make suitable arrangements when planning your trip, including discussing transport requirements with your travel agent or the carrier."

its a bit unclear
Thanks

[AusTac]

Id probably contact vline and get it directly from them, but i seriously doubt you'd have an issue as long as you don't loose it, a broken up shotty is pretty small and if in a inconspicuous case without Beretta guns are awesome i shoot stuff stickers all over it could be anything, id definitely lock it and have it closs by/ on my lap, better to ask the good people of vline though

[<<Genesis93>>]

No guns on Vline.

Simple as that - it is wrong.
PTV is wrong.
You can do nothing about their policy.

Law concerning dangerous good transport specifically EXcludes firearms but that matters not to PTV as 'they' consider firearms to be 'dangerous goods'...... yeh, you know they could explode at any time

I've had the argument, you can't win....they referred to the 'law' - I advised them the law does not relate to firearms....end of story.

I would suggest you break down the SG, lock it in a case and disguise the case so it doesnt look like a shottie..... you'll be contravening policy.... not law (my opinion) carry on.................

You shot all your ammo - bless your heart

[<<Genesis93>>]

Don't waste your time contacting them; they have their policy.

[AusTac]

Wow i was wrong lol thats a pretty crap policy!

[RealNick]

Well you were right in that you should be able to take your firearm on public transport legally (in locked case, not causing drama, blah blah blah) but their policy buggers it >:(

[happyhunter]

Dress like a musician, tell them it's a clarinet.

[<<Genesis93>>]

Just say you DID happen to carry on a shotgun or rifle....correct me if i'm wrong but the worse that could happen is they escort you off the station property.... policy isnt necessarily 'law'...

[adam]

Just say you DID happen to carry on a shotgun or rifle....correct me if i'm wrong but the worse that could happen is they escort you off the station property.... policy isnt necessarily 'law'...

I'm no lawyer - so take this with a grain of salt, but as I understand it things such as no smoking on planes, firearm carriage, etc are federal law - and not just the policy of the airliner.

Firearms on trains however a different matter. I can't see how a companies policy can end up resulting in someone breaking the law. Privatization and companies don't have that power.... (yet). However - it wouldn't surprise me if they had the power to permanently ban you from using them again...

[<<Genesis93>>]

Just say you DID happen to carry on a shotgun or rifle....correct me if i'm wrong but the worse that could happen is they escort you off the station property.... policy isnt necessarily 'law'...

I'm no lawyer - so take this with a grain of salt, but as I understand it things such as no smoking on planes, firearm carriage, etc are federal law - and not just the policy of the airliner.

Firearms on trains however a different matter. I can't see how a companies policy can end up resulting in someone breaking the law. Privatization and companies don't have that power.... (yet). However - it wouldn't surprise me if they had the power to permanently ban you from using them again...

NOT the BAN!!!!
How would I survive...?? Oh, forget, havent used Vline...... ever, met.....15yrs perhaps, this might call for a train ride

[happyhunter]

Same as super market bag search policy. I have never complied and when refusing to allow some greasy checkout nerd to rumage through my personal belongings they couldn't do a thing about it.

[Rocker]

Firearms on trains however a different matter. I can't see how a companies policy can end up resulting in someone breaking the law. Privatization and companies don't have that power.... (yet). However - it wouldn't surprise me if they had the power to permanently ban you from using them again...

Probably get done under one of the "causing fear" type laws, even though you got there round about via the private companies rules.

[JimmyS]

I'm gonna revive this, but just an FYI - I just called PTV and Mr. Enquiries officer didn't know the answer so spoke to his senior and it is okay to carry your rifle on a VLINE service.

Just don't go showing it to interested parties or taking it out of it's case as the Scary long machine gun automatic bolted rifle smg action fast shooting killer military rifle might start going off like a popcorn machine left right and centre.

Thank you.

[duncan61]

I have flown and caught interstate trains with my firearms in a case and just duct taped the crap out of the case and did not have any gun related stickers on it.At the airport the security may put a sniffer on it for gunpowder but if its clean and empty no problem.If your shotty breaks down just suitcase it

[Oldbloke]

I have flown and caught interstate trains with my firearms in a case and just duct taped the crap out of the case and did not have any gun related stickers on it.At the airport the security may put a sniffer on it for gunpowder but if its clean and empty no problem.If your shotty breaks down just suitcase it

Didn't it go though the X-ray type machine?

PS. I reckon an old guitar case would be the go. No point upsetting the other train travelers.

[bones-350]

I work in Rail in S.A and am a prescribed officer in revenue protection my advice is firearms are dangerous goods. Don't chance taking a firearm on public transport because Once Police get involved it's good bye guns & license. I suggest email the relevant firearms branch and wait for their written reply.

[Oldbloke]

I work in Rail in S.A and am a prescribed officer in revenue protection my advice is firearms are dangerous goods. Don't chance taking a firearm on public transport because Once Police get involved it's good bye guns & license. I suggest email the relevant firearms branch and wait for their written reply.

Bones350, Not under the Australian Dangerous Goods Transport Code. (this is about the transport of potentially dangerous substances) Soooo, under what legislation are you referring?

[bones-350]

Version: 16.5.2017
[22.5.2017] This version is not published under the Legislation Revision and Publication Act 2002 1
South Australia
Passenger Transport Regulations 2009
117—Carriage of dangerous objects etc on vehicle
(1) A person must not, without the permission of an authorised person—
(a) carry a dangerous or offensive object or substance on a regular passenger service vehicle; or
(b) cause a dangerous or offensive object or substance to be carried on a regular passenger service vehicle.
Maximum penalty: $1 250.
Expiation fee: $160.
(2) If an authorised person has reasonable cause to suspect that a parcel or bag that is being, or is to be, transported on a regular passenger service vehicle may contain a dangerous or offensive object or substance, the authorised person may—
(a) require the person in possession of the parcel or bag to open the parcel or bag for examination of its contents; or
(b) open the parcel or bag and examine its contents.
(3) A person to whom a requirement is addressed under subregulation (2) must comply with the requirement.
Maximum penalty: $1 250.
Expiation fee: $160.
We have had a persons carrying knifes & firearms on trains and police have been called and become involved.
There is a difference between the law and what one perceives they are doing the right thing as to carry an offensive item of dangerous goods on public transport. Not worth risking your firearms & license over or giving authorities the opportunity to prosecute you.

[southwest shooter]

Just carry it down your pants .

[Daddybang]

I have flown and caught interstate trains with my firearms in a case and just duct taped the crap out of the case and did not have any gun related stickers on it.At the airport the security may put a sniffer on it for gunpowder but if its clean and empty no problem.If your shotty breaks down just suitcase it

Didn't it go though the X-ray type machine?

PS. I reckon an old guitar case would be the go. No point upsetting the other train travelers.

I've never flown with firearms. Don't you have to notify the airline and get a permit?

[duncan61]

No.I flew to Darwin and just turned up at the Perth luggage put down area and told them it was my rifle and it was put in the luggage same as my suitcase with knifes fishing gear and 50 rounds of 7mm.On the way back at Darwin I had a bit of a wait and the security ran a sniffer over the case and as they said unless there is a reasonable amount of raw powder it wont go off.At Perth I collected my luggage and went home.When I get the Integrity bus to Carnarvon I just hand my rifles in bags and the 7mm in its case and they load them in the luggage compartment.I tell them what they are so my scopes dont get smashed by them throwing a pushbike or something on them.I contacted Indian pacific for the hell of it and they have a no firearms at all policy.Not allowed in baggage at all

[Oldbloke]

"(b) cause a dangerous or offensive object or substance to be carried on a regular passenger service vehicle."

And here lies the problem. From a legal perspective a firearm is NOT dangerous goods.
In every state in this country and many others throughout the western world it has a very special meaning in law. It is a general term for chemicals that can have an immediate reaction causing a high risk to the safety of people in the vicinity.
Example, explosives, petrol, LPG gas, acids, radioactive materials etc. The chemical if released in to our environment can in large quantities, particularly in cities cause havoc or many casualties, including fatalities.

A knife or firearm if used incorrectly is a dangerous OBJECT there is a huge difference.

People need to be careful sometimes when choosing their words. Clearly there is a need for more education in this area.

In any case it would appear that in SA at least you can't transport Firearms on the trains. Or dangerous goods.

Sorry if it looks like I'm lecturing.

[Oldbloke]

PS. To above post.
As there is no mention of quantities of dangerous "substances" aka goods in the regulations quoted. All matches and gas cigeratte lighters should be banned also as they are classified as "dangerous goods"
Yet an unloaded piece of water pipe aka shotgun is considered dangerous. Next it will be walking sticks. Aka clubs.

[Daddybang]

Well that changes things. Was planning on driving up to darwin to see my brother next year. If it's that simple will look at flights instead

[bones-350]

Also in my firearm training I recall the instructor saying if you take your firearm out of your house be it innocently putting it in your car or cleaning it in your backyard and anyone sights it they just need to feel offended or threaten expect a call from the boys in blue if they report it and I don't need to say any more on what may happen.
Be careful guys is all I can say.
Your only friend when it comes to firearms is fellow FIREARM OWNER.

[duncan61]

Heres a true story.I was at the tourist resort 40 K away and I had a gun safe bolted in my room at the Remote Aboriginal station where I worked.Some darlings turned up in town over the weekend and thought it would be fun to jump the fence and ransack my living quarters where they used my plumbing tools to remove the safe from the wall and take it to the tip and bend it open with the tools they took from the tyre shed.Oldest was about 16 youngest 10.The fun part was I fueled them up at the resort before they went back to Meekatharra and my gear was probably under the blanket they were sprawled out on.I did not recognise any of them from the community.Police get involved cut a deal return my firearms problem goes away.I go the 450 Km to Meekatharra and get my 3 firearms which were my lever .17HMR minus mag.My bolt action 36 inch barrel goose gun 12g minus mag and my H/R single shot hornet.As the female senior constable carries 2 of them out the police station she puts one on each hip no bags and swaggers out to my Nissan Patrol.I had a gun safe holding up the rack and a bit of roof sheeting tecked to the top to stop rain getting in and as a bit of cover from view.I had no time to open anything and get ready she just took off and stood at the back of my ute.It was court day in town and 200 blackfellas are watching this rock show.I went berserk and she tried to threaten me but we went back in the station where I explained I could never come back in this town every one of them now knows I have firearms in my box.The Senior Sergeant got it and I hoped chatted her later perhaps she was new and did not understand where we were.Bottom line bag box or do something in public to avoid attention but you are allowed to have your stuff its why you are licensed.

[southwest shooter]

Did you put it down your pants ? How did you go ?