Moving to Vic from NSW

[Patty93]

G'day lads,

moving to Vic (well likely moving), currently have a NSW A and B licence and am on a probationary H licence. My A and B are for hunting and pest/varmint control on private property. With the move what can I expect to have to go through with changing? As I haven't yet done my 12 months with the pistol (but have gotten my IPSC pistol cert and all that sorted) will I have to redo my probationary time or are they likely to just make me wait out the remaining few months? As pistols have been expensive to get in with regard to licensing I am hoping to avoid too much running around.

Also is anyone aware of what I will need to prove genuine reasons for holding the A and B? I have a game licence for Vic, and will still travel to NSW to shoot. Anyone know of any well priced ISPC pistol clubs in melbourne or surrounding?

Cheers in advance for the advice, I know it will be on point.


Patty

[bladeracer]

G'day lads,

moving to Vic (well likely moving), currently have a NSW A and B licence and am on a probationary H licence. My A and B are for hunting and pest/varmint control on private property. With the move what can I expect to have to go through with changing? As I haven't yet done my 12 months with the pistol (but have gotten my IPSC pistol cert and all that sorted) will I have to redo my probationary time or are they likely to just make me wait out the remaining few months? As pistols have been expensive to get in with regard to licensing I am hoping to avoid too much running around.

Also is anyone aware of what I will need to prove genuine reasons for holding the A and B? I have a game licence for Vic, and will still travel to NSW to shoot. Anyone know of any well priced ISPC pistol clubs in melbourne or surrounding?

Cheers in advance for the advice, I know it will be on point.


Patty

Can't comment on the handguns as I'm not doing those currently.
http://www.gma.vic.gov.au/hunting/pest-animals
Go to GMA and get a "Registration of interest to hunt pest animals on Crown land" for $14.50. That is all you need to own Cat A/B firearms in Vic. For game animals (deer and duck primarily) you will need a game licence. There is no permit for hunting pest animals.

[Wobble]

"hunting" is all the genuine reason you need for vic.

The reg of interest to hunt pest animals docu is one bit of supporting documentation. Game license would be another.

Very straight forward in VIC.

[<<Genesis93>>]

ALL you need for you A&B is your VIC Game Licence... nuffin more.

The only thing you CAN'T do with only a hunting endorsement is target shooting on private property on a non-approved (but legislation conforming) Range; for that you'll need Target/sporting endorsement and therefore approved Gun club (eg SSAA) membership.....

[Patty93]

ALL you need for you A&B is your VIC Game Licence... nuffin more.

The only thing you CAN'T do with only a hunting endorsement is target shooting on private property on a non-approved (but legislation conforming) Range; for that you'll need Target/sporting endorsement and therefore approved Gun club (eg SSAA) membership.....

This means I can still rock up to a public range ie. an SSAA range, pay the visitors feels and get range time in order to maintain my shooting standards and fine tune my rifle and play around with loads, etc?

Or do I need to join SSAA (something I have been avoiding) haha

[<<Genesis93>>]

ALL you need for you A&B is your VIC Game Licence... nuffin more.

The only thing you CAN'T do with only a hunting endorsement is target shooting on private property on a non-approved (but legislation conforming) Range; for that you'll need Target/sporting endorsement and therefore approved Gun club (eg SSAA) membership.....

This means I can still rock up to a public range ie. an SSAA range, pay the visitors feels and get range time in order to maintain my shooting standards and fine tune my rifle and play around with loads, etc?

Or do I need to join SSAA (something I have been avoiding) haha

You can shoot at any approved range with ANY endorsement ....

[bladeracer]

The only thing you CAN'T do with only a hunting endorsement is target shooting on private property on a non-approved (but legislation conforming) Range; for that you'll need Target/sporting endorsement and therefore approved Gun club (eg SSAA) membership.....

What is a non-approved private property range?

[Grated]

AFAIK for VIC it's anything you've created that is deemed to be "a range".

You're allowed to sight in on private property, e.g. stick up a paper target, dial in a dozen rounds. Obviously that's not a range.

Making up a very obvious example but say you had a fixed bench installed and a permanent target mount 100m away, the powers would view that as "a range" for target shooting which would not be allowed.

[bladeracer]

AFAIK for VIC it's anything you've created that is deemed to be "a range".

You're allowed to sight in on private property, e.g. stick up a paper target, dial in a dozen rounds. Obviously that's not a range.

Making up a very obvious example but say you had a fixed bench installed and a permanent target mount 100m away, the powers would view that as "a range" for target shooting which would not be allowed.

In Victoria we actually are allowed to target shoot on private property.

Victoria target shooting on private property.JPG (166.36 KiB) Viewed 5510 times

But Genesis93 is saying that you can't do this unless you are a member of a gun club and have "target" on your licence?

[Bourt]

the activity must not be advertised or formally organised or formally scheduled

Guys, I'll be doing some target shooting on my property for fun, you're all invited but I can't give you any details or give you a date to do it

[juststarting]

There's a activity vs licence genuine reason table, on vicpol website. You can target shoot on private property, if your licence sates target shooting as one of the genuine reasons. If it's just hunting, then no. Being a member of Shooters Union, SSAA or any shooting club should qualify you for that reason here.

[bladeracer]

There's a activity vs licence genuine reason table, on vicpol website. You can target shoot on private property, if your licence sates target shooting as one of the genuine reasons. If it's just hunting, then no. Being a member of Shooters Union, SSAA or any shooting club should qualify you for that reason here.

Thanks for that JS.

[bladeracer]

There's a activity vs licence genuine reason table, on vicpol website. You can target shoot on private property, if your licence sates target shooting as one of the genuine reasons. If it's just hunting, then no. Being a member of Shooters Union, SSAA or any shooting club should qualify you for that reason here.

http://www.police.vic.gov.au/retrievemedia.asp?media_id=77456
Looking at the chart you referenced it specifies that a Hunting only licence does not allow "Sport/target shooting on private land (in accordance with the Reg 22)", which to me means it does allow informal target practice and target shooting that does not meet the Reg 22 requirements - ie. less than six participants AND for less than three continuous hours.

[juststarting]

Bladeracer, just going on what's in that doc.

[bladeracer]

Bladeracer, just going on what's in that doc.

I know, I'm just asking if your interpretation is the same as mine

[<<Genesis93>>]

The only thing you CAN'T do with only a hunting endorsement is target shooting on private property on a non-approved (but legislation conforming) Range; for that you'll need Target/sporting endorsement and therefore approved Gun club (eg SSAA) membership.....

What is a non-approved private property range?

I think you're question has been answered; there are 'approved ranges' under the FA, formal ranges, inspected, approved, certified, THEN there are the non-approved however otherwise in accordance with the 'target shooting on private property' provisions...... where you can carry on any target shooting that you could do on a commercial range - however not charge your mates for the privilege...

[<<Genesis93>>]

There's a activity vs licence genuine reason table, on vicpol website. You can target shoot on private property, if your licence sates target shooting as one of the genuine reasons. If it's just hunting, then no. Being a member of Shooters Union, SSAA or any shooting club should qualify you for that reason here.

http://www.police.vic.gov.au/retrievemedia.asp?media_id=77456
Looking at the chart you referenced it specifies that a Hunting only licence does not allow "Sport/target shooting on private land (in accordance with the Reg 22)", which to me means it does allow informal target practice and target shooting that does not meet the Reg 22 requirements - ie. less than six participants AND for less than three continuous hours.

thats why you should tick ALL the boxes when applying or renewing your longarm licence.

[juststarting]

Next renewal, OMFG I am going to tick them boxes so hard, so long.

[<<Genesis93>>]

Next renewal, OMFG I am going to tick them boxes so hard, so long.

or you could drop Licensing services a quick email, with attached 'evidence' which they may already have (say club membership)... and be instantly (would you believe soonishly) be additionally endorsed...

[juststarting]

Next renewal, OMFG I am going to tick them boxes so hard, so long.

or you could drop Licensing services a quick email, with attached 'evidence' which they may already have (say club membership)... and be instantly (would you believe soonishly) be additionally endorsed...

Good advise, I've actually done that But that does not preclude me from my previous statement lol

[bladeracer]

thats why you should tick ALL the boxes when applying or renewing your longarm licence.

I agree there's no reason not to do both.
But the only reason I can see that I would ever need "Target Shooting" on my licence would be if I ever wanted to have a huge shooting session with more than five people and for more than three hours, until that point I can't see a reason to have it.

[bladeracer]

thats why you should tick ALL the boxes when applying or renewing your longarm licence.

I agree there's no reason not to do both.
But the only reason I can see that I would ever need "Target Shooting" on my licence would be if I ever wanted to have a huge shooting session with more than five people and for more than three hours, until that point I can't see a reason to have it.

I emailed Firearms yesterday to clarify this, and just received a phone call.
For somebody that only has "Hunting" listed on their licence that wants to add "Target" you simply email a copy of your SSAA membership card (or any other target shooting organisation) to them at licensingregulation@police.vic.gov.au including your licence details. They'll update your licence and send you a bill in the mail. I think he said $20?
However, he agreed with me that there is no need for "Target" unless you are intending to partake of large shooting sessions on private property - ie. fitting the requirements of Reg 22. He says the most common situation in his experience is a group getting together to shoot clays. Everything else you're likely to want to do with your Cat A/B firearms in Victoria only requires "Hunting" on your licence.

[<<Genesis93>>]

....However, he agreed with me that there is no need for "Target" unless you are intending to partake of large shooting sessions on private property - ie. fitting the requirements of Reg 22. He says the most common situation in his experience is a group getting together to shoot clays. Everything else you're likely to want to do with your Cat A/B firearms in Victoria only requires "Hunting" on your licence.

Doesnt make sense....large shooting sessions??..... if you EVER wish to partake in ANY target shooting on ANY private property..... you MUST have target endorsement..... if of course you want to operate by the book....

I think there are thousands of licence holder in VIC.... who are very far from a formal approved club range.... probably have PP and/or hunting only on their licence, might operate or own hundreds of acres of farm or more yet are NOT PERMITTED (legally) to shoot at anything other than fur/feather. So even these guys NEED target/sport....

Unfortunately.... I feel that if licensing services say you DO need something, then you probably DON'T... and vice versa.

[bladeracer]

Doesnt make sense....large shooting sessions??..... if you EVER wish to partake in ANY target shooting on ANY private property..... you MUST have target endorsement..... if of course you want to operate by the book....

I think there are thousands of licence holder in VIC.... who are very far from a formal approved club range.... probably have PP and/or hunting only on their licence, might operate or own hundreds of acres of farm or more yet are NOT PERMITTED (legally) to shoot at anything other than fur/feather. So even these guys NEED target/sport....

Unfortunately.... I feel that if licensing services say you DO need something, then you probably DON'T... and vice versa.

The website indicates that you only need "Target" if your shooting enters the requirements of Reg 22, until then it is not "target shooting", just recreational shooting from what I can make out.

I guess it comes down to a definition of "target shooting", but you can definitely shoot at targets on private property with just "Hunting" on your licence, that is specified in numerous places. It annoys me when official departments respond by phone rather than provide answers in writing though.

[bladeracer]

Doesnt make sense....large shooting sessions??..... if you EVER wish to partake in ANY target shooting on ANY private property..... you MUST have target endorsement..... if of course you want to operate by the book....

I think there are thousands of licence holder in VIC.... who are very far from a formal approved club range.... probably have PP and/or hunting only on their licence, might operate or own hundreds of acres of farm or more yet are NOT PERMITTED (legally) to shoot at anything other than fur/feather. So even these guys NEED target/sport....

Unfortunately.... I feel that if licensing services say you DO need something, then you probably DON'T... and vice versa.

Can you offer a link to the law that prevents people from shooting on private property unless they have "Target" as a reason on their licence?
I know that for Cat C firearms for pest control you cannot take them to a range to practice and the law specifically states you can only practice your marksmanship on the property for which that firearm is licenced for use.

[<<Genesis93>>]

....The website indicates that you only need "Target" if your shooting enters the requirements of Reg 22, until then it is not "target shooting", just recreational shooting from what I can make out.

I guess it comes down to a definition of "target shooting", but you can definitely shoot at targets on private property with just "Hunting" on your licence, that is specified in numerous places. It annoys me when official departments respond by phone rather than provide answers in writing though.

Reg 22 relates to target shooting on private property.... period..... the 5people/duration bit relate to whether or not you must advise the closest police station...

So, 'technically' 1 bloke shooting 1 single 22 round at a target must comply with reg 22 fully, distance, backstop etc

sport = target = recreation...
Hunting = recreation BUT NOT target....

Hunting endorsement DOES NOT ALLOW target shooting on private property.

[bladeracer]

Reg 22 relates to target shooting on private property.... period..... the 5people/duration bit relate to whether or not you must advise the closest police station...

So, 'technically' 1 bloke shooting 1 single 22 round at a target must comply with reg 22 fully, distance, backstop etc

sport = target = recreation...
Hunting = recreation BUT NOT target....

Hunting endorsement DOES NOT ALLOW target shooting on private property.

That is not how I read the table, and not how the officer at Vic Firearms reads it either, and it contradicts numerous instances where it is specifically allowed to shoot on private land without having to be hunting. The first part of a sentence cannot be read without the last part. I would expect that if Reg 22 covers all non-hunting on private property, the long list of requirements would include "All participants must hold a firearms licence with "Target" as their genuine reason.".
As I asked already, can you offer any parts of the law that agree with your interpretation?
Can you refer me to the penalty for target shooting on private property?

[Gwion]

What is the down side of having target on your licence?

[bladeracer]

What is the down side of having target on your licence?

None that I'm aware of.

[Gwion]

My point exactly.... Why not!?!