Stoeger Condor Opinions?

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Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TheFirearmEnthusiast » 10 Aug 2020, 1:45 pm

Hey guys

I hope that everyone is well

Lads,
I would like to get into "clay target shooting"
However,
I do not know the 1st thing about shotguns
(I've only shot rifles so far)

Would you guys recommend the Stoeger Condor?

I'm not gonna lie guys
I don't need anything fancy at all
I just want something that's gonna get the job done and that's it
I just would like to be able to shoot the clay targets down and that's about it
I don't need anything fancy

What do you guys reckon of the;
Stoeger Condor 12G 30" Over and Under?
Would that be a good option for what I wanna do?
Or is there another shotgun that you guys would recommend instead?

Please note; for my 1st shotgun, my budget is around $1,000

I look forward to hearing your recommendations
:drinks:
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TassieTiger » 10 Aug 2020, 3:09 pm

I can’t talk to condor but an akkar Churchill or ATA 686 will suit perfectly and brand new - around $1k with 5 year warranty.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TheFirearmEnthusiast » 10 Aug 2020, 3:29 pm

TassieTiger wrote:I can’t talk to condor but an akkar Churchill or ATA 686 will suit perfectly and brand new - around $1k with 5 year warranty.

Awesome
Thank you for the feedback TassieTiger
I'll look into the Akkar Churchill & ATA 686 right away!
Thanks again
:thumbsup:
Last edited by TheFirearmEnthusiast on 10 Aug 2020, 3:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by Bugman » 10 Aug 2020, 3:45 pm

I have used a 12 gauge Akkar Churchill on a "try shooting" day for clay pigeons and although I didn't hit too many, I found the shotty comfortable to shoot. Mind you the guy that was supervising me used a Perazzi.....way out of my price range.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by Jarhead » 10 Aug 2020, 4:48 pm

TheFirearmEnthusiast,

I am with TassieTiger- an ATA686 is the best entry level value for money I have seen.

I was looking at getting a Churchill for my first (australian) shotgun, but the 5 year warranty and mechanical triggers on the ATA impressed me. I bought an ATA686SE as my entry level gun, and found out later that it had a smooth forcing cone and backbored barrel- even better!

I had it for 5 years and then sold it to upgrade to a Beretta. The only problems I had were wearing out the cams that operated the ejectors (the top barrel would not eject the spent shell) and the spring that held tension on the safety selector switch snapped- both were fixed under warranty. I shot the hell outta that gun and I am surprised it held up. I put about 10,000 rounds through it over that 5 years.
Regards,

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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TheFirearmEnthusiast » 10 Aug 2020, 5:17 pm

Bugman;
Mm
Makes me wonder if maybe I should spend a bit more to get a miroku or something
I wonder if there's a "big difference" when you go to the next brands up in terms of results
If there isn't a big difference with the next brands up, then I may as well stick with the entry level shotguns
I just want something basic that just gets the job done and that's it

Jarhead;
Okay
Thank you for your feedback
I will be sure to check out the ATA686 tonight!
I’m glad that you had a good experience with it
I look forward to checking it out!
:)
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by Bugman » 10 Aug 2020, 5:36 pm

Just a bit more info that may help. The guys who were supervising, were seasoned shotgunners, probably hence the high shotties they had. Now in saying that, my mate who went with me was using a Miroku, and a better shot than me, and his shotty also performed well. Other people at the time had a mixed bag of shotguns.
Start out with what you can afford and feel comfortable with and go from there.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TheFirearmEnthusiast » 10 Aug 2020, 5:51 pm

Bugman wrote:Just a bit more info that may help. The guys who were supervising, were seasoned shotgunners, probably hence the high shotties they had. Now in saying that, my mate who went with me was using a Miroku, and a better shot than me, and his shotty also performed well. Other people at the time had a mixed bag of shotguns.
Start out with what you can afford and feel comfortable with and go from there.

Mm
The Stoeger Condor is very tempting in the sense that it's just so affordable..
$800, to me that's a really good price..
It seems to be good value for money..
If the Stoeger Condor will allow me to take down clays without too much trouble
If the Stoeger Condor will do the job just fine
Then, I'm almost ready to buy right now

But then again
As the others have recommended also
The ATA 686 sells for around $1000 I think
If the ATA 686 is definitely better than the Stoeger Condor (in terms of accuracy)
Then I may as well go for the ATA 686

I guess the question now is;
Stoeger Condor v/s ATA 686
(Which one is better in terms of accuracy)
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by mchughcb » 10 Aug 2020, 8:26 pm

I'd spend more and get a secondhand miroku or beretta sporter with multi-chokes.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by boingk » 10 Aug 2020, 8:35 pm

Hi mate, 'accuracy' isn't something so much you're looking for with a shotgun.

Look for fit to your body, feel, ability to 'point' it (ie bring up to shoulder and get a line down the sights quickly) and the all important 'spread pattern'. Ideally you want a comfortable, well fitting stock which allows a nice quick & accurate point to deliver a good, even spread once fired.

Honestly though I'd look strongly at the Churchill udner/over combo. They come in a kit with both 20 and 30" barrels so you can use the longer ones for sporting and the shorter for the scrub if you wish to go bush. Check it out here: LINK TO NIOA

I've used one in the black synthetic stock and 20" barrels, I actually quite liked it and if I was after one I'd probably get it.

Cheers - boingk
Long time shooter, beginner reloader.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TassieTiger » 10 Aug 2020, 8:37 pm

mchughcb wrote:I'd spend more and get a secondhand miroku or beretta sporter with multi-chokes.


Why do you say that?
I thought similar - and bought a decent second hand miroku with a vision to getting rid of my ATA, however the miroku is long gone...it became loose : floppy in action and was heavier than the ATA.

When I first joined the clay club, I tried every shottie going - even had a DTL round with a $15k Dt - I’m ashamed to say I didn’t hit a clay with it...a few months later, I’m hitting 20’s with my old grandads baikal side by side and better with my U/O - you grow into your gun your using...
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by scoot » 10 Aug 2020, 8:47 pm

I've got the akkar combo with 20 and 30" barrels. I don't shoot a lot but it hasn't missed a beat in 6 yrs, even in rain and dirt. Its not what I would call "refined" at all but it shoots stuff just fine. It is chunkier in the foreend than the ata so I would try both and run with what you feel fits nicer. You can always sell and trade up later without loosing too much once you learn whats what.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by bladeracer » 10 Aug 2020, 9:02 pm

When they let you out of the "Covid Cauldron" we have to get together and you can try my Condor.
I opted for it due to 30" barrels with 3" chambers, and the ridiculous price - I think I paid $550 for it, I'll have to check the logbook. I really like the gun, the way it fits and handles just make it fun to shoot. If my body could handle the recoil I'd be popping a few clays every day with it, which is why I'm getting into shotshell reloading, to see if I can build a reduced load that will me shoot 12ga. a lot more.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by mchughcb » 10 Aug 2020, 9:23 pm

TassieTiger wrote:
mchughcb wrote:I'd spend more and get a secondhand miroku or beretta sporter with multi-chokes.


Why do you say that?
I thought similar - and bought a decent second hand miroku with a vision to getting rid of my ATA, however the miroku is long gone...it became loose : floppy in action and was heavier than the ATA.

When I first joined the clay club, I tried every shottie going - even had a DTL round with a $15k Dt - I’m ashamed to say I didn’t hit a clay with it...a few months later, I’m hitting 20’s with my old grandads baikal side by side and better with my U/O - you grow into your gun your using...


Because generally these guns fit people better and last longer and for that reason people shoot better. Especially the beretta silver pigeon.

I know there is always exceptions to the rules and their will always be somebody who's pop's baikal fits better but that's what I've seen.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by Jarhead » 10 Aug 2020, 9:34 pm

TheFirearmEnthusiast wrote:
Bugman wrote:Just a bit more info that may help. The guys who were supervising, were seasoned shotgunners, probably hence the high shotties they had. Now in saying that, my mate who went with me was using a Miroku, and a better shot than me, and his shotty also performed well. Other people at the time had a mixed bag of shotguns.
Start out with what you can afford and feel comfortable with and go from there.

Mm
The Stoeger Condor is very tempting in the sense that it's just so affordable..
$800, to me that's a really good price..
It seems to be good value for money..
If the Stoeger Condor will allow me to take down clays without too much trouble
If the Stoeger Condor will do the job just fine
Then, I'm almost ready to buy right now

But then again
As the others have recommended also
The ATA 686 sells for around $1000 I think
If the ATA 686 is definitely better than the Stoeger Condor (in terms of accuracy)
Then I may as well go for the ATA 686

I guess the question now is;
Stoeger Condor v/s ATA 686
(Which one is better in terms of accuracy)


If you measure accuracy as "patterning well" (shotguns are quite different to rifles and pistols in the accuracy regard....)

Then the ATA686SE with the factory extended and polished forcing cone patterned much better than other guns I have fired with a standard 45deg transition between chamber and barrel (aka forcing cone). This was based on firing #9 shot at a pattern board and looking at consistency of the shot spread and counting the fliers outside the bulk of the shot. I can't recall the numbers, but those in attendance all agreed I had the best pattern. The other 2 guns were a Churchill and an older Beretta- both did not have the extended polished forcing cone that the ATA came with. I can't comment on the Stoeger Condor but I doubt it will have a polished forcing cone. The ATA had some advanced features found only on guns in the >$3k range, like the forcing cone and the mechanical triggers-most guns under $3k have intertial triggers.
Regards,

Jarhead
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by bladeracer » 11 Aug 2020, 4:56 pm

Jarhead wrote:...and the mechanical triggers-most guns under $3k have intertial triggers.


My Condor is supposed to have inertial triggers, but it will fire both barrels even if you don't load the bottom one - it dry-fires the bottom one then fires the top one. In fact, if you only want to shoot the top barrel, just open the barrels that far to load the top barrel and it will only cock the top hammer (you can hear the hammers cocking as you open it past each barrel), then it doesn't dry-fire the bottom barrel, it just fires the top barrel.

Is there any downside to inertial triggers?

These are the choke styles for the Dickinson T1000 and the Stoeger.
Dickinson on the left, Stoeger on the right - different thread pitches.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TheFirearmEnthusiast » 11 Aug 2020, 5:54 pm

Mchughcb;
Yeah I don’t know
When it comes to firearms
I prefer to buy brand new
However, it does seem that the Miroku’s do have a great reputation
I have a friend who swears by his Miroku
I have heard a lot of good things about the Miroku’s
I wonder if it’s worth me spending a bit more just to get a brand new miroku
Mm...

Boingk;
Awesome
Thank you for your advices man
It makes sense what you said about finding a shotgun that fits my body well, that feels more comfortable etc
Okay I will look into the Churchill shotguns as well!
However, honestly, I really think that I’ll be using my shotgun for clay target shooting only
I really don’t think I’ll be using the shotgun for hunting
So just a 30” standard shotgun should be fine
I don't think I'll need the shorter barrel option

TassieTiger;
Interesting story about “growing into your shotgun”
I really like that
Hopefully I’m gonna grow into my shotgun too!
Whichever one it is that I will choose

Scoot;
Thank you for your feedback
So you had a great experience with both the Akkar Churchill and the ATA
That’s good to hear
Thank you
And awesome
I will definitely do that
I’ll definitely go down to the fun store and see which shotgun feels better to handle
It sounds like that’s the logical thing to do

Bladeracer;
$550 for the Stoeger Condor, that’s outstanding!
If it was available today for that price, I would honestly just buy it right away
No questions asked lol
For that price, why not, it's like an impulse buy haha
Why not

Jarhead;
Mm
Thank you so much for your advices man
The ATA686SE does sound really good
I'm leaning towards it a fair bit at the moment to be honest
I will definitely look into the ATA also, that's for sure...

Okay
Thank you so much for your help everyone

So we’ve narrowed the list down to;
- Stoeger Condor ($800 approx)
- Akkar Churchill ($1200 approx)
- ATA 686 ($1300 approx)
- Miroku MK70 ($1600 approx)

Awesome
Thank you so much everyone for helping me narrow it down
I will do a bit more digging
And I will see how I go
I can't wait to own my 1st shotgun
:drinks:

Sidenote;
I just found out that the Stoeger Condor, Akkar Churchill and ATA 686 are all made in Turkey
Interesting
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by bladeracer » 11 Aug 2020, 6:14 pm

TheFirearmEnthusiast wrote:Bladeracer;
$550 for the Stoeger Condor, that’s outstanding!
If it was available today for that price, I would honestly just buy it right away
No questions asked lol
For that price, why not, it's like an impulse buy haha
Why not


I checked my log, July 2016 I paid $575 for it.
Like you I just wanted a gun for shooting some clay and having some fun, and it does the job perfectly for me.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by bladeracer » 11 Aug 2020, 6:17 pm

TheFirearmEnthusiast wrote:I just found out that the Stoeger Condor, Akkar Churchill and ATA 686 are all made in Turkey
Interesting


Stoeger is made in Brazil I think, the others, including the Adler and Dickinson are Turkish.
Stoeger is part of Benelli and based in the US.
https://www.stoegerindustries.com/about
Yep, made in Brazil.
https://www.stoegerindustries.com/sites/default/files/originals/product-manuals/condor_single_trigger_extractor_model_and_defense.pdf
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by mchughcb » 12 Aug 2020, 12:04 am

There are some nice SKB around and also Ice shot some webley and scott 912.

Ive got a W&S 2020k which was made in Turkey and nicest handling little 20G for only $995. They still got a few at Claytons. I also shot a turkish yildiz and that was nice.


This issue is until you shoot a bit you won't really know what's good and fits you best.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by Jarhead » 12 Aug 2020, 7:45 am

bladeracer wrote:
Jarhead wrote:...and the mechanical triggers-most guns under $3k have intertial triggers.


My Condor is supposed to have inertial triggers, but it will fire both barrels even if you don't load the bottom one - it dry-fires the bottom one then fires the top one. In fact, if you only want to shoot the top barrel, just open the barrels that far to load the top barrel and it will only cock the top hammer (you can hear the hammers cocking as you open it past each barrel), then it doesn't dry-fire the bottom barrel, it just fires the top barrel.

Is there any downside to inertial triggers?

These are the choke styles for the Dickinson T1000 and the Stoeger.
Dickinson on the left, Stoeger on the right - different thread pitches.


Bladeracer,

I can think of three downsides.....

Quail hunting- if your first shot is a dud you cannot easily fire the 2nd.
Skeet- if you use sub-gauge tubes (20, 28 or .410) in a 12g the recoil will not set the 2nd trigger.
Very light 12g loads will not set the 2nd trigger. (I usually keep a box of light loads for small or young try shooters)

Some inertial triggers are adjusted down so light that the empty chamber trigger action recoil will set the 2nd trigger. Your Condor may be one of these....
Regards,

Jarhead
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by snag » 19 Aug 2020, 9:22 pm

I don't know anything about clay target shooting, but I bought a Stoeger Condor Outback 20" U/O as a farm gun 10 - 12 years ago and we have flogged the guts out of it without a single problem. Very tight lock-up at first, but slicked up after a few hundred rounds. Has shot literally thousands of rounds since and is 100% reliable. I was so impressed that I bought a Stoeger 410 sxs for the wife and it is just as good. Good guns mate.
The pen may be mightier than the sword, but personally I prefer the .30/30 Winchester.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by marksman » 20 Aug 2020, 9:44 am

reading through this thread the only thing l can add that may be useful is that the expectation would be that if you pay more you should get a better quality made shotgun, quality in materials and workmanship, this is plausible
most cheaper made shotguns are fine for occasional shooting but apparently would not hold up with weekly shoots becoming loose and being flogged out
l have shot clays but never seriously, what l am writing is basically what has been said to me, l have seen some expensive shotguns loose :unknown:
as has been said, "you will grow into the gun you are using"
and lastly IMHO its easier to point a shotgun than aim, l thought of myself being a decent shot with a shotgun till l met the old shotgun guru @ little river John who gave me some pointers that l share when l can, eg... when standing ready hold the gun across your chest and quickly point the gun when the clay comes out instead of holding the gun at your shoulder ready
also to see if a gun fits you put pegs on the vent rib stand in front of a mirror with closed eyes and point the gun opening your eyes, you should be looking through the holes between the open pegs along the rib, the idea of using the mirror is the gun should be pointing straight at your eyes
shotgunning is a lot of fun you will think the same l think :drinks:

l should also say that my daughter got a beautiful stoeger 410 double barrel for her 12th birthday, the last time l ever went to little river :lol:


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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by bignose88 » 25 Aug 2020, 10:45 am

I have an ATA 686 amazing shotgun for the money, I highly recommend it.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by TheFirearmEnthusiast » 25 Aug 2020, 1:21 pm

Snag;
Thanks for your feedback man
I’m very happy to hear that you love your Stoeger Condor!
That’s making me re-considering it

Marksman;
Thank you for your advices man
I will definitely put your advices into practice!
I’m still tossing it up between the Stoeger Condor v/s Miroku MK70 (primarily)
I will let you know which one I end up with!

Bignose88;
Yeah
I have heard a lot of great things about the ATA 686 as well
I don't think I have heard bad feedback about the ATA actually
I will have to check it out too before making a final decision
That’s for sure
Thank you for your feedback!
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by Ausgunner » 07 Nov 2020, 7:25 pm

How did you go did you find your first shotgun?

Fit and feel is the primary thing, forget brands go shoulder or even better shoot as many as you can until you find the one that feels best to you.
Hitting clays is 99% in the ability to mount and swing the gun smoothly and consistently.
A perazzi or a high end beretta etc does not make you a better shot, its like learning to drive, a ferrari will not make you a great driver, a great driver makes the car look good.
The ata is the pick of what you mentioned in terms of what you get for the money, great entry level gun, but as i said what feels best and fits best to you is most important.
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Re: Stoeger Condor Opinions?

Post by GojiraSteve » 09 Nov 2020, 8:50 am

No experience with the Stoeger, but if you do end up tossing between the Akkar and the ATA definitely have a feel of both first. The ATA has a very pronounced palm swell which seems to be a bit of a love it or hate it thing. The Akkar has one too but not nearly as chunky.
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