How far is too far?

Double barrel, side by side, over-under, semi-automatic, straight-pull and lever action shotguns.

How far is too far?

Post by S O K A R » 07 Sep 2022, 9:19 pm

Seen quite a few extreme tube magazine extensions over the years, but how far is too far?
I get most of the extreme ones are for competition, but for practical use what's the accepted limit?
Personally I don't like anything that sticks out further then my barrel.
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by bladeracer » 07 Sep 2022, 10:12 pm

S O K A R wrote:Seen quite a few extreme tube magazine extensions over the years, but how far is too far?
I get most of the extreme ones are for competition, but for practical use what's the accepted limit?
Personally I don't like anything that sticks out further then my barrel.


My 20" pump gun was eight shot.
If you had a 26" barrel 10rds would probably fit, a 30" barrel would likely hold 11rds without being longer than the muzzle. But if you put an extended choke in then you could go to 12rds in the mag.

But the legal limit is likely to be 5rds in most states.

It may be more practical to simply run 5+1 and carry some 5rd speed loader tubes.
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by S O K A R » 08 Sep 2022, 3:59 am

bladeracer wrote:
S O K A R wrote:Seen quite a few extreme tube magazine extensions over the years, but how far is too far?
I get most of the extreme ones are for competition, but for practical use what's the accepted limit?
Personally I don't like anything that sticks out further then my barrel.


My 20" pump gun was eight shot.
If you had a 26" barrel 10rds would probably fit, a 30" barrel would likely hold 11rds without being longer than the muzzle. But if you put an extended choke in then you could go to 12rds in the mag.

But the legal limit is likely to be 5rds in most states.

It may be more practical to simply run 5+1 and carry some 5rd speed loader tubes.

My buckmaster is a 5+1 (20in), perfect for what I use it for

bladeracer wrote:
S O K A R wrote:But the legal limit is likely to be 5rds in most states.

I am curious, where does this 5 round limit come from?
For example in tas there is technically no limit for cat A rifles/shotguns, but there is a tas pol policy in place that limits it to 25 rounds.
So I just assumed that is the upper limit and anything below that is acceptable, is that not the case?
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by Boundry Rider » 08 Sep 2022, 8:45 am

I think cat B and shotguns here in WA must be SOLD as 5 shot mag. As far as I know there isn’t a law against your dealer making mods to increase that once you own it.
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by bladeracer » 08 Sep 2022, 10:28 am

S O K A R wrote:I am curious, where does this 5 round limit come from?
For example in tas there is technically no limit for cat A rifles/shotguns, but there is a tas pol policy in place that limits it to 25 rounds.
So I just assumed that is the upper limit and anything below that is acceptable, is that not the case?


I think it started with the Adler and then extended to all lever guns (not rifles). I think most states moved the lever guns to CatB or even C. In Victoria lever-guns are CatB now, but only up to 5rd capacity. Lever guns over 5rds are CatD.

In Victoria I don't think there is a capacity restriction on any tube magazines except for lever guns. If there is no limit in Tas then you can go as long as you like I guess, just extend the tube and the spring.

For detachable mags the limit here is 15rds in CatA and10rds in CatB.
Last edited by bladeracer on 08 Sep 2022, 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by geoff » 08 Sep 2022, 12:58 pm

Boundry Rider wrote:I think cat B and shotguns here in WA must be SOLD as 5 shot mag. As far as I know there isn’t a law against your dealer making mods to increase that once you own it.


This is bad advice in the context of a Cat B shotgun specifically, which is defined in Schedule 3, Division 2 of the WA Firearms Regulations as:

"B2.4 a repeating shotgun (lever action) with a magazine capacity of no more than 5 rounds"

https://www.legislation.wa.gov.au/legis ... epage.html

Anyone considering making any functional mods to a gun which concern it's magazine capacity should first read Section 23(5)(c)(ii) of the WA Firearms Act and make sure it does not apply:

"A person who, without lawful excuse, alters a firearm so that its calibre, character or kind differs from what it was when any current licence or permit relating to it was issued, commits a crime and is liable —

(d) if the firearm concerned was a handgun or was modified
in a prescribed manner, on conviction, to imprisonment
for 7 years; or
(e) otherwise, on conviction to imprisonment for 4 years or
a fine of $16 000"

https://www.legislation.wa.gov.au/legis ... epage.html

Now go back to the Regs, where Schedule 3, Division 4 defines Category D firearms and describes:

"D5.1 a repeating shotgun (lever action) with a magazine capacity more than 5 rounds"

I'm not going to quote the part where you'll see how completely inaccessible a Category D firearm is for a sporting shooter. You'll figure that bit out.

Don't make broad statements about what is or is not, or may or may not be, illegal or legal in WA when it's quite clear you've never read the law. Our legislation is really stupid and arachane and ineffectual and people, for whatever reason, still trust what some random stranger on the internet tells them...

As a fun little exercise, walk yourself into a gun shop and ask them to convert your Cat B shotgun into a Cat D for you and see how that goes down, especially once you tell them that "As far as I know there isn’t a law against your dealer making mods to increase that once you own it".
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by Boundry Rider » 08 Sep 2022, 3:35 pm

geoff wrote:
Boundry Rider wrote:I think cat B and shotguns here in WA must be SOLD as 5 shot mag. As far as I know there isn’t a law against your dealer making mods to increase that once you own it.


This is bad advice in the context of a Cat B shotgun specifically, which is defined in Schedule 3, Division 2 of the WA Firearms Regulations as:

"B2.4 a repeating shotgun (lever action) with a magazine capacity of no more than 5 rounds"

https://www.legislation.wa.gov.au/legis ... epage.html

Anyone considering making any functional mods to a gun which concern it's magazine capacity should first read Section 23(5)(c)(ii) of the WA Firearms Act and make sure it does not apply:

"A person who, without lawful excuse, alters a firearm so that its calibre, character or kind differs from what it was when any current licence or permit relating to it was issued, commits a crime and is liable —

(d) if the firearm concerned was a handgun or was modified
in a prescribed manner, on conviction, to imprisonment
for 7 years; or
(e) otherwise, on conviction to imprisonment for 4 years or
a fine of $16 000"

https://www.legislation.wa.gov.au/legis ... epage.html

Now go back to the Regs, where Schedule 3, Division 4 defines Category D firearms and describes:

"D5.1 a repeating shotgun (lever action) with a magazine capacity more than 5 rounds"

I'm not going to quote the part where you'll see how completely inaccessible a Category D firearm is for a sporting shooter. You'll figure that bit out.

Don't make broad statements about what is or is not, or may or may not be, illegal or legal in WA when it's quite clear you've never read the law. Our legislation is really stupid and arachane and ineffectual and people, for whatever reason, still trust what some random stranger on the internet tells them...

As a fun little exercise, walk yourself into a gun shop and ask them to convert your Cat B shotgun into a Cat D for you and see how that goes down, especially once you tell them that "As far as I know there isn’t a law against your dealer making mods to increase that once you own it".


Phhht, advice doesn’t start with “I think”. Sentences that start this way are an observation, leading to my next point. Probably at lease a couple of years ago my local dealership/smiths were actively increasing Adler levers into 7 shot and that what I posted was the basic explanation, I wasn’t all that interested their offering so I don’t remember the exact detail. So glossing over your post, (that means not really paying attention to detail), at that point I surmised that repeating shotgun magazines at that point in time were able to be increased.

Remember the forum is a place where fact, ideas, ideals and questions are thrown around for discussion. Don’t go about demonstering members for their input, if you are in fact a grown up then behave like one.

Anyone taking information from the interwebby as gospel without fact checking might as well be shooting someone else’s reloads.
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by bladeracer » 08 Sep 2022, 4:26 pm

Boundry Rider wrote:Phhht, advice doesn’t start with “I think”. Sentences that start this way are an observation, leading to my next point. Probably at lease a couple of years ago my local dealership/smiths were actively increasing Adler levers into 7 shot and that what I posted was the basic explanation, I wasn’t all that interested their offering so I don’t remember the exact detail. So glossing over your post, (that means not really paying attention to detail), at that point I surmised that repeating shotgun magazines at that point in time were able to be increased.

Remember the forum is a place where fact, ideas, ideals and questions are thrown around for discussion. Don’t go about demonstering members for their input, if you are in fact a grown up then behave like one.

Anyone taking information from the interwebby as gospel without fact checking might as well be shooting someone else’s reloads.


They were doing the extended mag tubes here as well early on, before the reclassifications.
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by on_one_wheel » 08 Sep 2022, 6:05 pm

I know (that part was for you boundary rider) that ICE (ignition custom engineering) were doing extended tube mass here in SA, they went as far as to work our exactly how far past the muzzle they could extend before the tube interfered with the shot pattern. There's bound to be something on the internet about that experiment they did.

People might recall that initially the Adler was to be imported as a 7 + 1 until someone watched the hyped up advertising campaign and decided that at that capacity the "rapid fire, ground breaking technology shotgun" would turn us shooters into instant mass murders, then the Adler quickly became a political bargaining chip.

But now as already said, they've been reclassified to Cat B the maximum in SA is now a 5 shot mag. :cry:
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by S O K A R » 08 Sep 2022, 8:39 pm

bladeracer wrote:
They were doing the extended mag tubes here as well early on, before the reclassifications.

Funnily enough the Adler was never reclassified here, as far as I'm aware you can have a higher capacity on them here.
Always thought it was strange it wasn't inline with other states, but I'm not going to whinge about it :lol:
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Re: How far is too far?

Post by bladeracer » 08 Sep 2022, 8:53 pm

S O K A R wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
They were doing the extended mag tubes here as well early on, before the reclassifications.

Funnily enough the Adler was never reclassified here, as far as I'm aware you can have a higher capacity on them here.
Always thought it was strange it wasn't inline with other states, but I'm not going to whinge about it :lol:


Yep, can't see anything in Tas regs about lever guns so it looks like you're golden.
https://fas.police.tas.gov.au/obtaining-a-licence/categories-firearms-licence/
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