A new cartridge.

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A new cartridge.

Post by bladeracer » 22 Jan 2019, 11:07 pm

https://woodburyoutfitters.com/the-trailblazer/breaking-news-winchester-introduces-worlds-fastest-straightwalled-cartridge/?fbclid=IwAR1iJGBo4Ze74Ew-RZOhbLagszht6S3FeSd454ZNrlb9EadYGyZYR0qPDSA

"Ohio Deer Hunters take note. Winchester announced today they will be releasing the Winchester 350 Legend Cartridge and rifles this year. The 350 Legend will be the fastest shooting straight-walled cartridge on the market.

350 Legend Cartridge Features

More ENERGY than 30-30 Win, 300 Blackout and 223 Rem
World’s fastest straight-walled cartridge
Approximately 20% LESS RECOIL than 243 Win with 20% more PENETRATION
LESS RECOIL than 450 Bushmaster
With an effective deer hunting range up to 250 yards, it deposits more energy than 5.56mm, 300 Blackout, and .30-30 Win.
Utilizes modified straight-walled .223 Rem shellcase and a .357 diameter bullet
Compliant in states that allow straight wall cartridges for deer hunting **
2019 350 Legend Ammunition Offerings:
Symbol Sub Brand Bullet Description
X350DS Deer Season XP® 150 grain Extreme Point
X3501 Super X® 180 grain Power-Point
X3501H Hog Special 180 grain Power-Point
USA3501 USA White Box 145 grain FMJ Flat Nose
X3501BP Power Max Bonded® 160 grain Bonded JHP
SUP350 Super Suppressed™ 265 grain Open Tip
Stay tuned....as we learn more we will keep you informed!"
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350 Legend.JPG
350 Legend.JPG (90.39 KiB) Viewed 3572 times
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by wrenchman » 23 Jan 2019, 4:11 am

it might do ok becouse its a a.r round but i dont see the guys give up there 300 or458 guns but it wll the hot girl for a little while.
If they do make one in a single shot or a bolt action we will see becouse the hand loaders should make it shine.
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigrich » 23 Jan 2019, 4:38 am

Very interesting. I just bought a 357 marlin and was thinking a little more punch would be good but with better ballistics than 44 mag. This sounds like it could be a very useful practical round. I think in a round about way it’s another crack at a 375 win . Hope it does better this time
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by southeast varmiter » 23 Jan 2019, 5:03 am

Again. Useless in an Australian context. These cartridges only apply to US states that legislate straight walled cartridges.
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by No1Mk3 » 23 Jan 2019, 5:25 am

Not so useless, southeast varmiter, usable on pig, goat, wallaby etc. or any other application where a smaller cartridge then 308 can be used. I do love the Marketing Dept hype though, lots of claims "more this, less that, oodles of the other!" but no actual data to compare. I think bigrich has it, another go at getting a 375 Win clone into the marketplace. Cheers.
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigpete » 23 Jan 2019, 5:38 am

How can any cartridge be useless ? As long as they shoot a bullet they're useful for something !
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by southeast varmiter » 23 Jan 2019, 5:44 am

It’s useless in the sense that this cartridge is already more than covered by existing ones.
But hey, marketing gets your wallet.
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigpete » 23 Jan 2019, 6:45 am

Not my wallet lol
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigpete » 23 Jan 2019, 6:45 am

Not my wallet lol
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Bill » 23 Jan 2019, 7:05 am

I like it, would be a fantastic compact thumper in a howa mini, 10shot mag for mega bomb ups
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bladeracer » 23 Jan 2019, 7:31 am

The "Super Suppressed" 265gn sounds interesting.

Scaling makes the case roughly 4.5 times the .223Rem case head diameter, so about 43mm long. That's only 2mm longer than .357 Maximum, which moves a 200gn jacketed bullet at about 1450fps in a handgun. .30-30 pushes a 160gn bullet at about 2200fps. So this must be pushing a 160gn faster than that to be able to say it makes more energy than the .30-30. The thing is, I've seen discussions saying the .357 Maximum already hits harder than .30-30 anyway, in rifle barrels 2400fps with 160gn bullets seems easily achievable. So I'm wondering if this "350 Legend" actually offers something new. And having a rifle chambered in .357Max also allows shooting .357 Mag and .38 Special. This does offer a possible advantage to handloaders getting free .223Rem brass and necking in up, but that would be a negative to a company hoping to sell factory ammo.
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by in2anity » 23 Jan 2019, 7:59 am

Yes my reaction “umm, isn’t this just a reskinned 357max?”
At what point does a lack of maintenance become "patena"?
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigrich » 23 Jan 2019, 8:10 am

How I’m viewing this fellas, is this would be a great mid range lever gun cartridge more punch than a 30-30 , but not as bad ass as a 45-70 , possibly better ballistics than both of those for its size. I reckon it’s another crack at a medium bore, everything the 375 Winchester should have been. The fact it’ll fit the AR platform means it has a lot of flexibility in marketing as well as in the field. I don’t get worked up over new cartridges, but I think this could be a good thing
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by SCJ429 » 23 Jan 2019, 5:30 pm

It is amazing what they shoot out of an AR15. Is it faster than a 500 MDM?
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Oldbloke » 23 Jan 2019, 5:57 pm

southeast varmiter wrote:It’s useless in the sense that this cartridge is already more than covered by existing ones.
But hey, marketing gets your wallet.


Agree 100% just buy a 308 lol

The reality is you could buy a 308 or 30-06 and shoot everything from foxes to deer with it. Fox skins arnt worth anything so doesnt matter if you gut them with 1 shot. Would be a lot cheaper in the long run rather than having 2 or 3 specialised rifles.

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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Stoney » 23 Jan 2019, 7:43 pm

.357 Maximum anyone? :roll:
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 23 Jan 2019, 7:45 pm

Hmm can I take down a deer with a 22lr?
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Harrynsw » 23 Jan 2019, 8:48 pm

Ziad wrote:Hmm can I take down a deer with a 22lr?


Only if you shoot it behind the ear :D
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by wrenchman » 23 Jan 2019, 11:23 pm

its like when the ultra mags and the short mags were the hot new girls at least this time brass will be a lot cheaper.
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Bill » 24 Jan 2019, 7:37 am

southeast varmiter wrote:It’s useless in the sense that this cartridge is already more than covered by existing ones.
But hey, marketing gets your wallet.


feel free to put up whats in your gun safe LOL

Im a big believer in choice, this round seems to offer a cheap light recoiling 35 cal with enough grunt to get the job done 95% of the time, would bang
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigrich » 24 Jan 2019, 8:29 am

Would be a great lever gun cartridge
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Gamerancher » 24 Jan 2019, 9:52 am

"Utilizes modified straight-walled .223 Rem shellcase and a .357 diameter bullet"

Do some of you blokes even read before posting? :unknown:

So, not an attempt at re-hashing the .375 Win. ( Which, as well as the .30-30 Win, is based on the .38-55 case, which has been around since 1884.)

Like Wrenchman says, directed at the U.S AR-15 platform market to get around certain states deer hunting laws that don't allow .223 rem.
Quick barrel change and you're in business.

Don't reckon it will ever be chambered in a lever-gun, pointed bullets and rimless case.
Plenty of cartridges in the + .30 cal that can beat the .30-30 for down-range energy already available in lever guns anyway. ( .38-55, .375 Win, .307 Win, .356 Win, .35 Rem, .308 Marlin express, .338 Marlin Express.........., the list goes on.) :allegedly:
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigpete » 24 Jan 2019, 9:57 am

Apparently they don't lol
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by bigrich » 24 Jan 2019, 3:24 pm

Gamerancher wrote:"Utilizes modified straight-walled .223 Rem shellcase and a .357 diameter bullet"

Do some of you blokes even read before posting? :unknown:

So, not an attempt at re-hashing the .375 Win. ( Which, as well as the .30-30 Win, is based on the .38-55 case, which has been around since 1884.)

Like Wrenchman says, directed at the U.S AR-15 platform market to get around certain states deer hunting laws that don't allow .223 rem.
Quick barrel change and you're in business.

Don't reckon it will ever be chambered in a lever-gun, pointed bullets and rimless case.
Plenty of cartridges in the + .30 cal that can beat the .30-30 for down-range energy already available in lever guns anyway. ( .38-55, .375 Win, .307 Win, .356 Win, .35 Rem, .308 Marlin express, .338 Marlin Express.........., the list goes on.) :allegedly:


wouldn't be hard to use different bullets , 450 marlin is rimless in a lever gun. just saying it would be a interesting idea . ballistic figures are very close to 375 win. just saying,,,, :unknown:

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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by wrenchman » 25 Jan 2019, 12:42 am

i see that there is a bolt action and a a.r 15 for this i was watching some shot show stuff i dont no if there would be a lever gun for this becouse it has no rim
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Gamerancher » 25 Jan 2019, 10:41 am

So the advertised 350 Legend, 150 gr load has figures of MV = 2325 and ME = 1800, @ 200yds these are V = 1647 and E = 903

A 200gr load in the .375 Win has a MV = 2480 and ME of 2731 and down range @ 200yds retains a V = 1702 and E = 1287

Tell me again how they are similar. :unknown: I know which one I'd prefer for poking holes in game in scrub. :thumbsup:

P.S. The .35 Rem is also a rimless case and has basically the same ballistics as those advertised for this 350 Legend.

Don't get me wrong, it would be a great little round. As with all cases based on the .222 Rem .375" base diameter case, they are efficient and tend to work well. :drinks:
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by wrenchman » 25 Jan 2019, 12:17 pm

I won't be buying one they have not made a 458 in a lever yet so if they do it will be a little while they have been trying to talk them to chamber a 500 to.
You are right gamerancher I for got about the 35 rem I was told buy my son right after I made the post
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Bill » 25 Jan 2019, 5:27 pm

Gamerancher wrote:So the advertised 350 Legend, 150 gr load has figures of MV = 2325 and ME = 1800, @ 200yds these are V = 1647 and E = 903

A 200gr load in the .375 Win has a MV = 2480 and ME of 2731 and down range @ 200yds retains a V = 1702 and E = 1287

Tell me again how they are similar. :unknown: I know which one I'd prefer for poking holes in game in scrub. :thumbsup:

P.S. The .35 Rem is also a rimless case and has basically the same ballistics as those advertised for this 350 Legend.

Don't get me wrong, it would be a great little round. As with all cases based on the .222 Rem .375" base diameter case, they are efficient and tend to work well. :drinks:



I seen what ya done there....

Factory ammo against handloads lol

375 Winchester factory 200grs do 2200fps
When a guy is digging his own grave, you don’t fight him for the shovel.

Success leaves clues, Fools follow failure !

20 Hornet, 218 Bee, 256 WM, 6mm ARC, 6.5 Grendel, 6.5x55 Scan, 270 Win, 357 Mag, 358 Win, 9.3x62, 500 A Square
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Bill » 25 Jan 2019, 5:36 pm

I've been collecting bits and pieces to build a 41 rem mag martini, got the brass, dies and projectiles was just waiting on a thick frame martini cadet...

However I can see this 350 doing a similar if not better job....
When a guy is digging his own grave, you don’t fight him for the shovel.

Success leaves clues, Fools follow failure !

20 Hornet, 218 Bee, 256 WM, 6mm ARC, 6.5 Grendel, 6.5x55 Scan, 270 Win, 357 Mag, 358 Win, 9.3x62, 500 A Square
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Re: A new cartridge.

Post by Stoney » 25 Jan 2019, 8:40 pm

It's literally a rimless .357 Maximum. Wow...….. who would have thought. :roll: Not exactly re-inventing the wheel. Does anyone know what happened to the WSSM? :lol:
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