25-45 sharps

Calibres, cartridges, ballistics tables and ammunition information.

25-45 sharps

Post by bigrich » 26 Jul 2020, 9:55 am

hey fellas, i'm contemplating "what ifs" and wildcat cartridges on a rainy sunday morning , and was thinking about a general purpose cartridge for australia that would shoot projectiles in the 75-87gn range .

yes i know the 243 is more than capable and readily available , but i was thinking along the lines of moderate velocity , 2750 - 3000 fps , to preserve barrel life and keep barrel heat under control with sporter weight barrels . i remembered a article on the 223 case necked up to 25 cal , the 25-45 sharps . used 223 cases can be had for next to nothing for resizing, and this could be set up in handy light rifles with true short actions like the cz 527 , howa , rem7 ,ect. a rifle that would way close to 7 pounds or less with scope , be very pointy and compact, with decent "punch" and range . 7'62x39 rifles are sort of similar in concept i suppose , but the 25/223 hybrid would have better ballistics on light game and much better projectile choice

this post is intended as a discusion for a project rifle ,for those that love ballistics . i'm not trying to reinvent the wheel or replace the 243 as a "working" cartridge
i think some of you have played around with various wildcats like 6.5 grendal , 6mm br and such . i'm thinking the 25 sharps has some merit due to the case/neck relation of not being "overbore"

so, any opinions fellas :unknown:

:drinks: :drinks: :thumbsup:
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by COLLECTOR 1 » 26 Jul 2020, 11:32 am

Morning bigrich...

it's a very do able build these days and well worth it. If you google 25 copperhead that's your 25-223 and has a good following here and huge one in USA. Also the 25 Myra which is 25-222 it was popular here in the 60,s and 70,s with the pro roo shooters, mainly on sake actions....just neck them up and away you go. Not being an expert I was with the impression that a 25-45 sharps was infact a 25-20 with an altered shoulder angle, but I could be wrong

Stay safe hunt long
More Brno's than you can poke a stick at..!!!!
COLLECTOR 1
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 216
New South Wales

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by COLLECTOR 1 » 26 Jul 2020, 11:40 am

My blu.....223 necked up not 25-20 with altered shoulders ..lol
More Brno's than you can poke a stick at..!!!!
COLLECTOR 1
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 216
New South Wales

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by Gamerancher » 26 Jul 2020, 12:56 pm

The trouble with the .25-45 Sharps is that it tends to relate back to ( or basically be confused with ), the original Sharps rifles and the habit of naming black powder cartridges with a two-number nomenclature. The original numbers used to define calibre - powder charge ( .45 - 70 ) or calibre - case length ( .45 - 2 & 1/10").
The .25-45 Sharps is .25 cal - 45mm case. ( .223 Rem ) The "new" Sharps Rifle Company ( USA ), manufacture AR type rifles and hence their development of the round, no need for standard bolt head or magazine mods.
User avatar
Gamerancher
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1596
New South Wales

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by bigrich » 26 Jul 2020, 2:20 pm

Yeah GR , the “sharps “ name tends to cause some confusion. The “copperhead “ collector, I read up on and was based on the 222 case . I didn’t realise it had been around for that long and is a old Australian wildcat. Definitely puts a new perspective on things. I’ll have to check the specs but it think the 25-223 sharps has a little more case capacity. Built up in a sako L461 it would be a sweet rifle I reckon. The only other thing I’ve considered is magazine length, especially with longer projectiles. The more I look into this, the more interesting a concept it sounds
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by COLLECTOR 1 » 26 Jul 2020, 6:03 pm

The magazine length has always been an issue... many years ago I built one based on an m55 tikka action and struck issues with projectile weight and length... the Sako or even a Remington short action would be more suitable. The 25 Myra as I knew it was a great little all rounder. I saw a lot of the old roo shooters in the 70's pull off some incredible shots with it, and the extra bullet weight in the 25 cal was always handy on pigs. I'd love to build another one today with more modern components and a bigger array of projectiles, like a 257 Roberts scaled down a bit ..lol

Collector 1
More Brno's than you can poke a stick at..!!!!
COLLECTOR 1
Lance Corporal
Lance Corporal
 
Posts: 216
New South Wales

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by Gamerancher » 26 Jul 2020, 7:06 pm

They, ( .25-45 ), are only a bit behind a .250 Savage with 87gr projectiles. The 25Myra was based on the .222 case.
I re-chambered an M55 Tikka from .222 to 5.6 x 50 magnum, ( longest case with .222 head-size ), some years ago. Just removed the block from the front of the magazine and had no worries. I have a 7mm TCU barrel in it now and can load 120 gr pills and run rounds through the magazine. ( 168 grainers have to be single loaded.)
User avatar
Gamerancher
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1596
New South Wales

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by bigrich » 26 Jul 2020, 7:24 pm

COLLECTOR 1 wrote:The magazine length has always been an issue... many years ago I built one based on an m55 tikka action and struck issues with projectile weight and length... the Sako or even a Remington short action would be more suitable. The 25 Myra as I knew it was a great little all rounder. I saw a lot of the old roo shooters in the 70's pull off some incredible shots with it, and the extra bullet weight in the 25 cal was always handy on pigs. I'd love to build another one today with more modern components and a bigger array of projectiles, like a 257 Roberts scaled down a bit ..lol

Collector 1


mate, i think it's a brilliant idea , and i think i would use a 308 length action that has been scaled down for 223 , like the howa 1500/ weatherby VG . as you can modify the spacer at the back of the magazine to get some more mag length . i have a few push feed model 70 winchesters and the metal mag spacers would be easy to modify and so is the bolt stop/release lever for bolt travel .it's definately food for thought . i'd have to get the sammi specs and see what's what . it might be a case of stopping a reamer a bit short in a 25 cal barrel for the chamber and getting the smith to modify a set of 223 dies at the same time with a off the shelf .25 expander ball thrown in

just checked , pacific tool and gauge have reamers for 25-222 copperhead and 25-223 . i'm thinking i would need to talk to a smith before taking this idea any further as it could quickly turn into a money pit . it's still a good idea but
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by Strikey » 26 Jul 2020, 8:00 pm

Why not go with a 250/3000 build ? It will handle projectiles up to 120grn and brass is easily formed from 22/250, just run them through a 25cal necksize die.
Strikey
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 316
Queensland

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by boingk » 26 Jul 2020, 9:14 pm

303-25? Lets add another cartidge here. Plenty of Enfields floating around still.

- boingk
Nil
boingk
Sergeant
Sergeant
 
Posts: 682
Other

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by bigrich » 26 Jul 2020, 9:59 pm

all good 25 calibers fellas. the 303-25 seems to be having a resurgance of late , and why not . it's a great medium game all rounder for this country . back to my project , i was trying to get a light weight ,short action on the readily available 223 case as a basis for something different . the other thing i was trying to acheive was getting projectile velocity in 75-87gn projectiles under 3000fps . the 250 myra sounds like a blast from the past that's already well proven . the 25-45 sharps version gets 3000fps with a 87gn speer for 1739lbs of energy . that pretty good for a compact package that could be built on most common 223 rifles
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by bigpete » 27 Jul 2020, 5:00 am

I think its a great idea tbh
bigpete
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3577
South Australia

Re: 25-45 sharps

Post by Gamerancher » 27 Jul 2020, 8:50 am

There's also the .257 Raptor, based on the 204 Ruger case necked up with a 40 degree shoulder. ( think Ackley )
User avatar
Gamerancher
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1596
New South Wales


Back to top
 
Return to Calibres, cartridges and ballistics