best 20 inch or shorter cals?

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best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Goshawk » 26 Dec 2014, 8:59 pm

Hi all,
I'm hunting out a new toy. After walking countless kilometres through mountains chasing fallow for years with a 24 inch heavy barrel Howa in 243w with a 3-9x50 Metro and bipod my arms, legs and back have had enough.

I'm looking for a rifle in a fairly large cal with no more than 20 inches of barrel. I'm looking for a bigger cal because I have seen some big sambar and reds while out but didn't take the shot due to the 243 feeling really small when you have one of these in your sights.

I read about the 300 and 338 RCM 's but don't know if they still or will exist much longer.

Can a 338 win mag work in a 20 inch barrel?

The 375 ruger seems great but the ammunition is pretty bloody expensive, then again, nothing will stand after being hit with it.

Ideas?
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by handofcod » 26 Dec 2014, 9:11 pm

9.3x62?
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by cruze82 » 26 Dec 2014, 9:24 pm

You might need to chat to westy but a 300 blackout might do the job , I think you can get a 16 inch barrel and a good hard hitting round for short range

Iv never shot one but I hear good things, chat to westy he might give some more info
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by wrenchman » 27 Dec 2014, 3:11 am

i have seen the 308 kill moose and elk as well as bear you would not be under gunned with it .
I dont see to many guns chambered in them larg rounds with a 20 inch barrel
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Goshawk » 27 Dec 2014, 5:02 am

wrenchman wrote:i have seen the 308 kill moose and elk as well as bear you would not be under gunned with it .
I dont see to many guns chambered in them larg rounds with a 20 inch barrel


What length barrel were the 308w's? I'm worried that a short barrel on a 308 will reduce its hitting power too much for shots out to 250 m.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by yoshie » 27 Dec 2014, 5:54 am

handofcod wrote:9.3x62?


I'll second this.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Oldbloke » 27 Dec 2014, 7:00 am

Plenty of 22 inch options out there. 3006, 308, 270 some weigh in at 61/2 lb or less. All ok if the shot is well placed
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by 1290 » 27 Dec 2014, 7:08 am

needs and wants ....... you dont need but you want, no problem with that.
The winmag will 'work' just lose a bit of velocity with a shorty.
The 375Ruger was designed to replicate H&H balistics with a compact rifle (20inch barrel) - Savage used to chamber the H&H (works well in their standard length action, but know chamber the 375 Ruger in a compact setup known as the model 116 Alaskan Brush hunter, this one has your name on it, 7.6pounds;
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only change I'd make is a peep sight at the rear....
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Westy » 27 Dec 2014, 8:27 am

cruze82 wrote:You might need to chat to westy but a 300 blackout might do the job , I think you can get a 16 inch barrel and a good hard hitting round for short range

Iv never shot one but I hear good things, chat to westy he might give some more info

Definitely a no go on the 300 AAC for samba deer, might do the job but not effective enough for my liking ^^^^^^^^^^^ try what 1290 said sounds good to me!!!! :D :) :D or the 308 plenty of gun IMHO ;) :) ;)
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by bigfellascott » 27 Dec 2014, 9:18 am

243 running one of the ACP projectiles should do the trick, bloody hell I even know of Sambar being rolled with a 204 so surely the 243 should do the job with right projectile and shot placement? ;)
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by 1290 » 27 Dec 2014, 10:45 am

come on big fella, stop promoting your mates product....and whats the the micro-calibre, yes, you could shoot anything with a 22 rimfire too, with the right shot - but I say go hard or go home! 375 minimum.... ;)

Yes, in Vic the revised minimum for Sambar has removed the case minimum, so a 310 cadet is now legal....So even Westy can come to vic with his (I love the way they renamed it) 300AAC or Advanced Armament Cadet rifle :D

There's an interesting 375 Ruger Ruger m77II on abused guns at the mo.....
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by bigfellascott » 27 Dec 2014, 11:09 am

1290 wrote:come on big fella, stop promoting your mates product....and whats the the micro-calibre, yes, you could shoot anything with a 22 rimfire too, with the right shot - but I say go hard or go home! 375 minimum.... ;)

Yes, in Vic the revised minimum for Sambar has removed the case minimum, so a 310 cadet is now legal....So even Westy can come to vic with his (I love the way they renamed it) 300AAC or Advanced Armament Cadet rifle :D

There's an interesting 375 Ruger Ruger m77II on abused guns at the mo.....


I don't know who makes em, all I know is they smash all other projies out of the park in the same weight range, some of the pics of damage made from em is just awesome! :lol:

I haven't tried them as yet but might get a few one day for a bit of fun. ;) I'm not sure what ol mate used on the Sambar, might have been a 39gn SBK I think.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by RoginaJack » 27 Dec 2014, 12:02 pm

Have you thought about a TIKKA - in Battue Lite, barrel 500mm (19" ), weight 2.8kg or 6.1lb or TIKKA LITE, barrel 570mm (22") and weight 6.4lb or 6lb depending on calibre. The choice of calibre is vast.

IMO to go into a magnum caliber with a 18" barrel just basically defeats well, everything.

A 300 Blackout is only any good if you can get close enough to stick it in a Sambar's ear and only them you might just give it a headache.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by brett1868 » 27 Dec 2014, 7:49 pm

I'm pretty biased towards bull pup rifles cause you can have a shorter overall length and still keep your barrel. Check out the SRS from Desert Tech, buy a biathlon sling and you'll be able to grunt it all day long. There's no deer too big for .338 Lap Magnum and you'll be able to extend your reach somewhat more then a .308 can achieve.

http://deserttech.com/guns/dta-srs-sniper-rifle-chassis.html
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Westy » 27 Dec 2014, 7:59 pm

1290 wrote:come on big fella, stop promoting your mates product....and whats the the micro-calibre, yes, you could shoot anything with a 22 rimfire too, with the right shot - but I say go hard or go home! 375 minimum.... ;)

Yes, in Vic the revised minimum for Sambar has removed the case minimum, so a 310 cadet is now legal....So even Westy can come to vic with his (I love the way they renamed it) 300AAC or Advanced Armament Cadet rifle :D

There's an interesting 375 Ruger Ruger m77II on abused guns at the mo.....

Maybe they named it after you A Antagonistic c*** ????? :lol: :D :lol:
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Westy » 27 Dec 2014, 8:01 pm

RoginaJack wrote:Have you thought about a TIKKA - in Battue Lite, barrel 500mm (19" ), weight 2.8kg or 6.1lb or TIKKA LITE, barrel 570mm (22") and weight 6.4lb or 6lb depending on calibre. The choice of calibre is vast.

IMO to go into a magnum caliber with a 18" barrel just basically defeats well, everything.

A 300 Blackout is only any good if you can get close enough to stick it in a Sambar's ear and only them you might just give it a headache.



WANK WANK JACK you obviously don't know shiot from Clay old mate????? :D ;) :o
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by RoginaJack » 27 Dec 2014, 9:34 pm

Westy wrote:
RoginaJack wrote:Have you thought about a TIKKA - in Battue Lite, barrel 500mm (19" ), weight 2.8kg or 6.1lb or TIKKA LITE, barrel 570mm (22") and weight 6.4lb or 6lb depending on calibre. The choice of calibre is vast.

IMO to go into a magnum caliber with a 18" barrel just basically defeats well, everything.

A 300 Blackout is only any good if you can get close enough to stick it in a Sambar's ear and only them you might just give it a headache.



WANK WANK JACK you obviously don't know shiot from Clay old mate????? :D ;) :o



Gee Westy, that's a bit harsh and no need to shout, my hearing's OK.
I was under the impression that the 300Blk (7.62x35mm) was developed to fire a 115gr or 125gr projectile and was based on the AR-15 platform for military use.
Tell me, what range do you shoot Sambar stags at with a 300 Blk?
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by wrenchman » 28 Dec 2014, 4:04 am

the model 7 rem is and i think savge is i think they make a few models
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by wrenchman » 28 Dec 2014, 4:05 am

the model 7 rem is and i think savge is i think they make a few models
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Westy » 28 Dec 2014, 6:30 am

RoginaJack wrote:
Westy wrote:
RoginaJack wrote:Have you thought about a TIKKA - in Battue Lite, barrel 500mm (19" ), weight 2.8kg or 6.1lb or TIKKA LITE, barrel 570mm (22") and weight 6.4lb or 6lb depending on calibre. The choice of calibre is vast.

IMO to go into a magnum caliber with a 18" barrel just basically defeats well, everything.

A 300 Blackout is only any good if you can get close enough to stick it in a Sambar's ear and only them you might just give it a headache.



WANK WANK JACK you obviously don't know shiot from Clay old mate????? :D ;) :o



Gee Westy, that's a bit harsh and no need to shout, my hearing's OK.
I was under the impression that the 300Blk (7.62x35mm) was developed to fire a 115gr or 125gr projectile and was based on the AR-15 platform for military use.
Tell me, what range do you shoot Sambar stags at with a 300 Blk?

GiDay Jack I don't think the 300 Blackout would ever be the first choice of the Sambar deer hunter :lol: :D :lol: I'd grab my 6.5 x 55 Tikka and be using 140-160 Grn pills at 300m,but if push came to shov blackout would work out to a 100m here's a goat with long legs (Fallow) we took earlier this year at 100m
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Goshawk » 28 Dec 2014, 10:50 am

RoginaJack wrote:
A 300 Blackout is only any good if you can get close enough to stick it in a Sambar's ear and only them you might just give it a headache.


Funny, I'm sure it wouldn't need to be that close but I want, ney, NEED, and cal that has the 'hand of God ' effect out to 250 m. Also, I just had a mate move to NT so I'll need a big heavy belter.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Goshawk » 28 Dec 2014, 11:58 am

1290 wrote:needs and wants ....... you dont need but you want, no problem with that.
The winmag will 'work' just lose a bit of velocity with a shorty.
The 375Ruger was designed to replicate H&H balistics with a compact rifle (20inch barrel) - Savage used to chamber the H&H (works well in their standard length action, but know chamber the 375 Ruger in a compact setup known as the model 116 Alaskan Brush hunter, this one has your name on it, 7.6pounds;
Image
only change I'd make is a peep sight at the rear....

This rifle and the ruger Guidegun are the reasons why I was asking if 338 win mag are any good with a 20 inch barrel.
The savage Hog Hunter in 308w looks good so does the new synthetic stock ruger scout with 16.1 in barrel but it only gets 2450 fps with a 168gr projectiles, not sure if that's enough to be really effective at 250 m. I'm sure it will hit hard but I want it to hit really hard.
Asking too much?
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by VICHunter » 30 Dec 2014, 11:06 am

Goshawk wrote:I read about the 300 and 338 RCM 's but don't know if they still or will exist much longer.

Can a 338 win mag work in a 20 inch barrel?

The 375 ruger seems great but the ammunition is pretty bloody expensive, then again, nothing will stand after being hit with it.


338 magnum is overkill for deer.

300 WM fine if that's what you want, that would be about the ceiling for me though.

2c but I'd say 30-06, 300WM or 9.3x62, depending on what the rifle you want comes chambered in, would all be fine.

The Tikka Battue wouldn't be a bad option.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Goshawk » 02 Jan 2015, 7:56 pm

VICHunter,

How many rounds can I expect to get out of a barrel in 300 WM?
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Westy » 03 Jan 2015, 6:57 am

Goshawk wrote:How many rounds can I expect to get out of a barrel in 300 WM?


More than your shoulder can handle would be my answer :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by 1290 » 03 Jan 2015, 7:38 am

Westy wrote:More than your shoulder can handle would be my answer :lol: :lol: :lol:


Absolutely.

Good answer... no matter what they say about you westy, you know what you're saying :D

As far as over kill... come on VH, nowadays if you're carrying a 338winmag, you're almost undergunned.

If the 338winmag is overkill, then whats the '600overkill'
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by RDobber » 04 Jan 2015, 7:14 pm

Goshawk wrote:How many rounds can I expect to get out of a barrel in 300 WM?


Mine would have maybe 1,100 or 1,200 rounds through it now and is still under 1".
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Tiiger » 05 Jan 2015, 2:00 pm

Goshawk wrote:The savage Hog Hunter in 308w looks good so does the new synthetic stock ruger scout with 16.1 in barrel but it only gets 2450 fps with a 168gr projectiles, not sure if that's enough to be really effective at 250 m. I'm sure it will hit hard but I want it to hit really hard.
Asking too much?


Well, you'd be getting 2,700+ fps out of a longer barrel like 23"or 24". Comparing the two, both sighted for 100m...

At 250m the 2,700 fps MV load would be:
10.7" drop, 2,190 fps velocity. 1,790 ft lbs energy.

At 250m the 2,450 fps MV load would be:
13.6" drop, 1,969 fps velocity. 1,446 ft lbs energy.

Still doing more than tickling at that speed with a 168gr pill.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Gwion » 20 Jan 2015, 8:18 am

Here's an article that tests the 300WM with an inch taken off the barrel for each stage of the test. Tested from 25.25" down to 16.25":
http://rifleshooter.com/2013/12/300-win ... 0-win-mag/

Longest barrel (25.25) was shooting 2892fps, at 20.25" it was shooting 2752; one more inch off it shot 2727.

Interesting read. Not every inch off a barrel is equal in effect.

I'd be considering buying what ever rifle i wanted and then getting the barrel shortened. Doesn't cost much and there'd be some advantage to doing this in probable accuracy gains. For instance, in the Howa range, the short/light (508mm/20") barrels have 14.5mm muzzel diameter, the longer 610mm/24" (300WM or 7mm RemMag) barrels have a muzzle diameter of 15.8. Taking 4 inches off that will give you a stiffer & stouter barrel than you will get on a factory shorty; unless you go short varminter, which aren't common to start with. A stouter, stiffer barrel is going to have more repeatable accuracy, as you well know.

Mind you, the bang and the buck (report and recoil) on a short 300wm wouldn't be great fun to shoot, i would have though.

Hope you find what you want.
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Re: best 20 inch or shorter cals?

Post by Gwion » 20 Jan 2015, 8:22 am

PS> here's the same test with the 308win:
http://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308-win ... 8-to-16-5/
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