Making .223 bullets from .22LR cases

[chicachicka]

Hi guys,

I've seen a few Youtube videos and read the comments etc. with people making .223 bullets out of spent .22LR cases which seemed cool.

Making good use of the left overs for some cheap as chips ammo

The videos though are "Here's how you make it" then nothing about how it shoots...

I realise it won't be a competition winning bullet, but does anyone shoot these?

How do they go?

[Spooner]

I think you'll find they're a plinking round only.

As you say, mashing up old brass doesn't make for ultra accuracy.

[Rippah]

I think you'll find they're a plinking round only.

Yeah.

I remember seeing pics of groups from this, they weren't great...

[Octane]

For how much .223 ammo costs, who could be bothered

[Hardcast]

Not sure what's happening here,..............

Are people casting bullets useing spent .22 lr cases as a mould. ?

[Carter]

Yep.

They're trimmed then filled in a mold to create 40-60gr projectiles.

Haven't done it myself, looks ghetto as IMO.

[Wes]

Haven't done it myself, looks ghetto as IMO.

No kidding :/

Looks halfway back to being a musket ball.

[Bills Shed]

OK gents let's get every body on the right track here.

Just up front, I swage my own .224 pills out of .22LR cases. If you thought reloading a brass case was time consuming and required a bit of patience to get excellent results try building the projectile!

It is true it will set you back a wad of cash and if you shoot the hundred rounds or so a year or even 300, It would not be worth the outlay of time or cash.

On the other hand if you want the flexibility to try a different weight, length, centre go gravity, tip type etc. then you swage your own.

If you think you will save a dollar or two , maybe in the long run. You just shoot more, experiment heaps and are rewarded with something you built yourself. The cases are very thin and are on par with a ballistic tip for terminal effects.

I got into swaging because I could. I like the detail and the learning curve did not disappoint.

The ranges I shoot are about 200m. I shoot a .22 Khornet which I feed my home swagged .224, 40 grn pills. I can shoot MOA with these. Please note they are not BR jackets. If you want BR quality, you buy the jackets then swage them. BR jackets are just a bit more consistent. Some of the best BR shooters swage their own projectiles.

To swage a 40 grn pill cost about 3.5 cents, if I buy the lead wire from the factory. If I swage my own wire (hopefully not In the too distant future) the cost will be less than a cent per pill. This does not take into account time and initial out lay for dies and press.

The process,
De- rim the .22LR case (straighten it out to form a cup), think of the case now as a jacket.
Cut jacket to length, if making light pills. Jacket can be left at full length if making 50-60 grn pills.
Cut lead wire to length, +2 gns
Swage the lead core to exact weight, less jacket weight
Seat core into jacket and swage to just under target diameter
Point form and swage to final diameter

There is lots of cleaning, annealing and lubing between steps just like reloading. The press is also heavy duty as the force required to derim a .22LR is more than you think. A standard press is more than enough for the rest of the steps though generally not as accurate. You can use a swaging press for normal reloading as well. Also swaging just like reloading, has its own sets of tools that you build, modify and collect. Space for said equipment is also another matter.

Swaging projectiles is not for everyone and you can easily make junk, just like reloading. Making quality, consistently ---is the hard part.

Bill

[Techc]

If you thought reloading a brass case was time consuming and required a bit of patience to get excellent results try building the projectile!

I appreciate the write up, but that's waaay to time consuming for me

[Bills Shed]

Gents just to demonstrate effectiveness of these hand swaged projectiles.
Here is one I pulled out of a wallaby, ( under permit ). Range was just over 150m. It was recovered from just under the skin on the opposite side of entry.
They were fired out of a K-Hornet at about 2900f/s
The jacket was made out of Federal cases .22LR cases as they have a slightly thicker wall thickness but can be a bugger to swage. Federal .22LR cases tend to vary in initial case weight and therefore the new jackets need to be checked for weight after trimming to length. More expensive brands of .22 ammo do not vary as much but have thinner cases. There always seems to be a trade off somewhere!
The cores were not bonded to the jacket. If you look closely at the last pic you can see the firing pin indent at 1 o'clock on the new projectile.

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[BBJ]

I gotta say, I'm impressed with the weight retention in that.

That last photo could be from a bullet magazine advertisement.

[Chronos]

Excellent write up bills shed.

I understand the interest but if you work out the cost of a big press, dies, lead wire, etc. then price the .22 cal bullets by the 1000 I couldn't justify it.

There were .22 cal bullets around going for 11c each, it would take a lot of time to recover your costs

Chronos.

[Bills Shed]

You are right Chronos,

A long time ago I told myself that reloading would save me money. One day that will happen... Maybe.

I tend to shoot more. Reloading was a step to making better ammunition, not necessarily to save money.

Recovering the cost is a long way off if ever. I got into swaging because I could. The $$ outlay took me a long time to get together but I can build any .224 weight pill that I could want to think of.

I love the preparation and the learning curve that comes with building something - anything yourself. Making my own projectiles is just another step.

If I want to swage for another calibre it will ONLY cost me another set of dies. Mind you those dies are in the vicinity of $700.00. It would not be a decision to be taken lightly.

My next aim is to make my own dies but that is another project - one day.

[veep]

A long time ago I told myself that reloading would save me money. One day that will happen... Maybe.

I tend to shoot more. Reloading was a step to making better ammunition, not necessarily to save money.

Everyone needs a hobby. If it passes the hours and costs a few bucks, what does it matter?

You only live once

[bunnybuster]

You are right Chronos,

A long time ago I told myself that reloading would save me money. One day that will happen... Maybe.

I tend to shoot more. Reloading was a step to making better ammunition, not necessarily to save money.

Recovering the cost is a long way off if ever. I got into swaging because I could. The $$ outlay took me a long time to get together but I can build any .224 weight pill that I could want to think of.

I love the preparation and the learning curve that comes with building something - anything yourself. Making my own projectiles is just another step.

If I want to swage for another calibre it will ONLY cost me another set of dies. Mind you those dies are in the vicinity of $700.00. It would not be a decision to be taken lightly.

My next aim is to make my own dies but that is another project - one day.

I admire your skill and dedication,but I am a down to the store guy when it comes to jacketed pils,but--- I cast for the 45/70,58 and have

a mould for the 303,

Be safe, BB.

[Bills Shed]

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Just to revive an old thread, I have just received a 1E point form die in .224. I was eager to see how the 40 grain projectile would turn out as so I grabed some derimmed and trimmed .22 LR cases and put them through the press. I did not anneal the jackets before I seated the core and point formed. The end result shows the dimples and rings along the body from uneven hardness of the brass jackets. I also folded up about 40% of the tips and they turned out junk.

Interestedly enough the ones that did point form up OK shot very well at 100m with the same load that I use the 40 grain 6S projectile.

The 1E has a much greater bearing surface (with these light projectiles) and I do not have to seat the projectile way down in the case so that the loaded round will fit into the short Sako magazine.

It is a evil looking projectile with that huge open tip and the terminal effects leave nothing to be desired.

Next time I will anneal the jackets and that will make for a far prettier projectile but this experiment has proved that it does not need to be pretty to be accurate.

Bill

[ployer]

Polish the surface a little and they'd look Pro

[Gwion]

Got 1000 40gn bullets for my 223 made from recycled 22lr brass. They shoot sub MOA with a little basic load development and terminal performance is very good. Mine were bought from a pro maker, though; not home made.

[bigfellascott]

I still haven't tried the ones you sent me G - I will though, I reckon they should go well.

[Bills Shed]

Got 1000 40gn bullets for my 223 made from recycled 22lr brass. They shoot sub MOA with a little basic load development and terminal performance is very good. Mine were bought from a pro maker, though; not home made.

Not to sure what you mean by "pro maker". I gather it is someone who makes projectiles for a living and makes his own dies. Most of us projectile builders think of swaging as an extension to shooting. I did not make my own dies but they are very good and MOA is the norm. Any projectile made with a recycled .22L case could be classed as home made, we just chose not to buy factory jackets.

Bill

[Seconds]

I still haven't tried the ones you sent me G - I will though, I reckon they should go well.

C'mon bludger, stop bragging about your Howa and start shooting

[bigfellascott]

I still haven't tried the ones you sent me G - I will though, I reckon they should go well.

C'mon bludger, stop bragging about your Howa and start shooting

Yeah I must get back out and smash up a few more foxes - been a bit slack in that department lately (I'd better check the ammo situation too) been smashing up a heap of bunnies in the last few sessions so will more than likely have to load a few up. Still haven't put those 26gn Barnes VG's on paper to see what they are doing (just loaded up a 100 and went shooting) seem to shoot ok in the Howso going by all the exploded bunnies but probably not a bad idea to check to see what they are doing I guess and fine tune if needed (honestly though I don't care so long as they are hitting what they have to, that's good enough for me.

I really don't like load testing and reloading much these days - I find it tedious and bloody boring to be honest.

[Lorgar]

I really don't like load testing and reloading much these days - I find it tedious and bloody boring to be honest.

It's boring as bat s**t.

I seriously hope to never have to do it again. Need to keep my Tikka forever now so I never have to develop another load

[Gwion]

I still haven't tried the ones you sent me G - I will though, I reckon they should go well.

Hey Scott. Those 55 grainers should do well!

Bills Shed. not digging at anyone, just saying that i haven't made them myself. The guy i get them from makes bullets for a living. They do go well.

[grainweight]

C'mon bludger, stop bragging about your Howa and start shooting

There's bunnies need busting!

[fox]

bill shed ,
interesting post I have just purchased some swaging gear to make the .223 projectiles but im also interested in swaging some projectiles for the hornet as well, I just wanted to know if you still had the details of where you purchased the hornet point forming dies from, any info would be great. Thanks

[Chronos]

Got 1000 40gn bullets for my 223 made from recycled 22lr brass. They shoot sub MOA with a little basic load development and terminal performance is very good. Mine were bought from a pro maker, though; not home made.

Not to sure what you mean by "pro maker". I gather it is someone who makes projectiles for a living and makes his own dies. Most of us projectile builders think of swaging as an extension to shooting. I did not make my own dies but they are very good and MOA is the norm. Any projectile made with a recycled .22L case could be classed as home made, we just chose not to buy factory jackets.

Bill

I'm not sure either but I know there was one bloke asking shooters to send him their .22LR brass for swaging. I believe he was offering some swaged bullets in return but from memory his finished "varmint" pills were around 30c each, about 2-3 times the price of bulk .224 pills from sierra or hornady. At that price I'd be shooting the proven super roo's every time

Chronos

[Bills Shed]

bill shed ,
interesting post I have just purchased some swaging gear to make the .223 projectiles but im also interested in swaging some projectiles for the hornet as well, I just wanted to know if you still had the details of where you purchased the hornet point forming dies from, any info would be great. Thanks

The .224, 1E point form die I got from Dave Corbin. He had it on the shelf. Unfortunately with the low Aussie dollar, it will not be cheap. His brother is also a maker of dies and there is also Larry Backmon. They are all in the US. Also there may be a wait of Several months if it is a custom order.
Ref the price people charge for the projectiles they make, if you just cost up the basic resourses they are very cheap. If you start to add up you time then it just gets scary. They do take a bit of effort and equipment and it can be time consuming. It all depends on what you want to get out of the whole process. On that note, I notice that there has been a spike in the price of projectiles in the last year or so. They are not going to get any cheaper!
Bill

[Gwion]

Chronos & Bill. I was referring to someone who makes bullets commercially. I got them for the same price as 1000 Hornady Zmax. Arguably better off with Super Roo, etc ( they dont come in 40gn) but i am happy to support a local person trying tp make a living from manufacturing at that price.

[Gamerancher]

Years ago I was buying .22 cal projies that were made from rimfire cases over the counter at a large well known gunshop. I was doing a lot of "pest" control and they worked well in the .222 I used back then.
Can't remember the brand name though.