Such thing as too much velocity?

[schink]

Hi guys,

I'm doing some reading on reloading and ballistics and the rest of it. One blog was discussing max and hot loads, and said there are problems with "excessive velocity" ?

Is there such a thing?

As long as it's accurate, why wouldn't you take extra velocity for flatter shooting?

[Hardcast]

Some projectiles are very lightly jacketed, and therefore in a hunting situation, disintegrate on contact with almost anything.
Bush, skin etc.

Not sure what the target shooters do as far as velocity goes, but have heard the term, 'over stabilize'

Hopefully we get some technical answers.

[SendIt]

Hardcast is on the money for hunting problems. Too fast and when the bullet his it can turn into a miny grenade and just ends up being a ball of shrapnel in the target instead of a penetrating solid round.

Another issue too... Hopefully this isn't too crappy of a description...

As you know, a bullet typically move in an arc.

To shoot at distance your rifle barrel is actually pointed up fractionally and the bullet goes out and upwards tip first, then levels out, then descends tip down - Like the arc of throwing a javelin.

If you're shooting at super velocities, the problem can occur that the tip of the bullet doesn't come down and the line of the bullet doesn't follow the arc. The bullet still moves in an arc, but it's at an angle so the tip is always higher than the bottom. It just sails forward at that upward angle.

One this wrecks your accuracy, and two when the bullet hits it doesn't penetrate cleanly as intended and tumbled into the target causing inconsistent results.

[BBJ]

How fast your bullet is spinning is also related to velocity.

A thin jacket bullet spinning too fast can literally come apart as soon as it exits the muzzle and your just throwing shrapnel down range.

[Blackened]

You'd need to be firing very hot loads for this to be a factor, won't be an issue for you if you're starting out schink.

Or ever for that matter if you're not pushing the envelope on your loads.

[Lorgar]

and two when the bullet hits it doesn't penetrate cleanly as intended and tumbled into the target causing inconsistent results.

I vaguely remember something about the US army intentionally aiming for this for a while?

They wanted it because a tumbling full metal jacket did more damage or something...

[schink]

You'd need to be firing very hot loads for this to be a factor, won't be an issue for you if you're starting out schink.

Yeah, it hasn't been.

I've managed to retrieve a few of my bullets from the dirt and wherever, and they've held together as well as can be expected.

No suggestions of any problems, just the deformation you'd expect.

[Dirtdart89]

I vaguely remember something about the US army intentionally aiming for this for a while?

They wanted it because a tumbling full metal jacket did more damage or something...

Armies still do it with the 5.56 projectiles from memory they actually use a small air bubble just inside the casing to;

A) Semi simulate a hollow point.
B) Assist in the tumbling effect so an entry wound can be in the chest or shoulder and an exit wound will appear in an odd place like the knee or neck.

A good example of this is the Kennedy assassination, the bullet that entered his head actually exited through his elbow. But from memory I think 5.56 rounds actually do this normally.

[Guliver]

Target pistol shooters prefer lower velocity rounds to minimize recoil. The slowest ammunition that will still cycle the pistol is what is needed.

There are some specialist rifle rounds designed to open like a flower that need low velocities to avoid opening out before reaching the target.

[Monty]

A good example of this is the Kennedy assassination, the bullet that entered his head actually exited through his elbow. But from memory I think 5.56 rounds actually do this normally.

It's been too long since I learned anything about this and I forget the particulars, but the various wounds were the key arguments of the conspiracy theorists weren't they?

He had wounds through the neck, ribs and heads or something didn't he?

A ricocheting or 3 shooters depending on which argument you believe.

[Dirtdart89]

Admittedly I don't know much about it either but I doubt conspiracy theorists really know that much either. But I'd guess all his wounds would have been from the tumbling effect.

[Bark]

It was a conspiracy.

The old guy in Tennessee in the movie Shooter said so

Proof IMO.

[Monty]

I doubt conspiracy theorists really know that much either. But I'd guess all his wounds would have been from the tumbling effect.

I'm not saying they're right

Just saying that's what some think, or so I've read.

[Dirtdart89]

Haha the old guy in shooter did seem to know his stuff.

[Mark TAC]

Tumbling = crap. It was simply that the first AR rifles like XM177 and early M16s used 1:14 and it didn't stabilise. Nothing intentional and soon became faster twist (up to 1:7 now).
Now the matter of legend and apparently deliberate projectile design for increased lethality......? Nup.


Kennedy analogy = crap. Would not be too hard to find an example of chest entry and ass exit on pretty much every animal ever shot....... just due to a bone deflection.
Geez I have seen a foot of deflection over a few meters just due to light scrub.

[Joom]

I'm a bit rust on my Kennedy assassination history, but...

The folks who don't believe the bone deflection thing reckon he was shot 3 times right? As they're were 3 wound angles?

That alone wrecks the conspiracy theory for me. As if the secret service and whoever else of the hundreds of security people there for that thing couldn't have caught someone if there were 3 people firing off rifles surrounding the motorcade.

[Deco]

Be right back... Need to go to Coles for more tin foil.

Running out of protective hats...