Dumb 12G slug ammo question

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Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by SteamedHam » 24 Oct 2016, 11:31 am

I'm new to using shotguns - only ever used Rifles. So I recently bought the baby-killing automatic Adler shottie, and since I'm going into pig country this week, I want to play with some slugs.

But I always get conflicting information with what slugs I can and cannot use. I've being told rifled slugs are ok, yet Sabot slugs will destroy your barrel, and vice versa.

So for clarification once and for all, what would be ideal:

http://gunco.com.au/shop/product/29482
or
http://gunco.com.au/shop/product/29408
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by AusTac » 24 Oct 2016, 11:40 am

Screw your cylinder choke in and enjoy, sabot slugs are practically useless beyond 15m in a smooth bore but will by no means destroy anything most shells are wrapped in plastic as they go down your bore, not to sure about slugs though anyway get yourself some foster slugs, the normal rifled ones, they are compleatly safe and put big holes in stuff at close range, i shoot fosters through a 3/4 choke in my single barrel for as long as my shoulder can take it not to mention my wallet, the're made to conform to whatever choke your shooting ideally not a full
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 24 Oct 2016, 2:34 pm

SteamedHam wrote:I'm new to using shotguns - only ever used Rifles. So I recently bought the baby-killing automatic Adler shottie, and since I'm going into pig country this week, I want to play with some slugs.

But I always get conflicting information with what slugs I can and cannot use. I've being told rifled slugs are ok, yet Sabot slugs will destroy your barrel, and vice versa.

So for clarification once and for all, what would be ideal:

http://gunco.com.au/shop/product/29482
or
http://gunco.com.au/shop/product/29408



Rifled slugs for smoothbore barrels, sabot slugs for rifled barrels.
Make sure your choke is not too restrictive.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by Carter » 24 Oct 2016, 3:42 pm

Hopefully this isn't a completely stupid bit of input but isn't it often on the side of the barrels?

I don't know much about shotties but could have sworn I've often seen it there saying what you can / can't shoot?
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 24 Oct 2016, 3:44 pm

Carter wrote:Hopefully this isn't a completely stupid bit of input but isn't it often on the side of the barrels?

I don't know much about shotties but could have sworn I've often seen it there saying what you can / can't shoot?



I've never seen that but I guess some manufacturers might put a sticker on a new firearm.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by GLS_1956 » 24 Oct 2016, 4:43 pm

Carter wrote:Hopefully this isn't a completely stupid bit of input but isn't it often on the side of the barrels?

I don't know much about shotties but could have sworn I've often seen it there saying what you can / can't shoot?


Only information I've got on the shotgun barrels is chamber size and what choke the gun has, many of my shotguns were made before interchangeable chokes.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by AusTac » 24 Oct 2016, 4:50 pm

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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by SteamedHam » 25 Oct 2016, 10:57 am

So provided I have the least restrictive choke (I think the factory installed one in the adler) I can shoot both, but would get better results with Rifled slugs?
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 25 Oct 2016, 11:30 am

Has anybody tried the rifled choke tubes?
They're supposed to be an option for temporarily "rifling" a smooth bore, but I have no idea how effective they are.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by SteamedHam » 25 Oct 2016, 11:34 am

Thanks for the help fella's. Let's hope I get to use them on something other then targets! :thumbsup:
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by brett1868 » 25 Oct 2016, 12:05 pm

Carter wrote:Hopefully this isn't a completely stupid bit of input but isn't it often on the side of the barrels?

I don't know much about shotties but could have sworn I've often seen it there saying what you can / can't shoot?


On rifles you should see on the barrel near the action the calibre and the chambering such as .308 Winchester, .204 Ruger, 22-250 Remington etc etc. Shotguns should list the gauge and chamber length something like 12ga 3" but one of the differences in shotguns is that with a 3" chamber you can shoot not only the 3" shells but any shell that's shorter such as the 2.25" and 2.75" varieties. It adds a degree of flexibility when choosing the appropriate shell for the job.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by brett1868 » 25 Oct 2016, 12:16 pm

I was mad keen to buy a "Slug gun" a while back, a Browning A Bolt to be precise. They have a rifled barrel and require either sabot or slug ammo of reasonable quality to perform at their best. Once I started checking the prices for good quality shells I quickly shelved the idea and bought another Adler and feed it Federal Slugs if I feel the urge to pummel my shoulder into submission. I'm no pussy when it comes to recoil but slugs in either my Mossburg 20" or Adler tend to leave a bigger bruise after 10 rounds then the BMG does after 50+

Just a heads up that if you go the rifled barrel path then you'll be restricted to slugs only which can be expensive and will leave a bruise where as a smooth bore you're good to go for anything.

http://www.browning.com/products/firearms/shotguns/a-bolt/current-production.html
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by Grated » 27 Oct 2016, 10:06 am

brett1868 wrote:They have a rifled barrel and require either sabot or slug ammo of reasonable quality to perform at their best


With a sabot you say, thought they were basically a synonym for reduced accuracy.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by brett1868 » 27 Oct 2016, 10:44 am

Grated wrote:
brett1868 wrote:They have a rifled barrel and require either sabot or slug ammo of reasonable quality to perform at their best


With a sabot you say, thought they were basically a synonym for reduced accuracy.


May have been the case in the early days but it's not unreasonable to now expect groups of 2.5" @ 100yds with the A-Bolt and sabot slugs. They actually have a benchrest comp in the U.S for 12ga slug shooting with the record currently standing at 5 shots, 0.787" @ 100yds. Tanks have been hitting targets way off in the distance with sabot armour piercing shells for years. I'm not sure of the legalities of using sabot rifle ammo in NSW so haven't worried about playing with it.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by Medic » 30 Nov 2016, 7:35 am

No you wont ruin your barrel. Personally, I empty out bronze wing skeet shells (dirt cheap 28 gram) and dump in Lee 7/8th ounce slugs. Deadly accurate up to 70 odd meters and smashes things. Cast em with pure lead or 10/15% wheel weight. Here piggy piggy... Works well out of a 20 inch baby hating Adler scrub gun.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by wrenchman » 30 Nov 2016, 1:47 pm

i have hunted lot of deer with shot guns and have used every round sabots work best from rifled guns foster slugs work best from smoth bore open or improved choke but
if you are under 50 yards 00 buck is hard to beat.
keep in mind every gun and ever round might not shoot the way you think shoot them even if you just shoot a card board box my shot gun shoots rem foster 1 once slugs much better then winchester.
a shot gun is hard to beat as a hunting gun when you no there is a real good chance the animal will be moveing fast and close.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by Prettybird » 01 Dec 2016, 1:14 pm

Grated wrote:With a sabot you say, thought they were basically a synonym for reduced accuracy.


Check out some of the prototype rail guns for impressive sabot action :thumbsup:
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by Polehammer » 10 Feb 2022, 5:09 pm

From all I've read/been told.

In a smooth bore barrel shoot rifled slugs or solid slugs. Expect to hit a dinner plate at 50m tops.

In a rifled barrel ONLY use sabot slugs or you'll wreck your barrel. Expect to get 3" groups at 100+m. (Yet to hear definitively maximum accuracy). If you want to shoot buckshot or anything other than sabot you need to change your barrel back to smooth or you'll wreck it.

I've got a rifled barrel on order for my Adler straight pull. Didn't realise any of the above when I ordered it or the difficulty/cost ($145 per 50) in buying sabot slugs in Victoria or i wouldn't have bothered. All I dam say is it better be worth it or I'll be sore pissed.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 10 Feb 2022, 5:50 pm

Polehammer wrote:From all I've read/been told.

In a smooth bore barrel shoot rifled slugs or solid slugs. Expect to hit a dinner plate at 50m tops.

In a rifled barrel ONLY use sabot slugs or you'll wreck your barrel. Expect to get 3" groups at 100+m. (Yet to hear definitively maximum accuracy). If you want to shoot buckshot or anything other than sabot you need to change your barrel back to smooth or you'll wreck it.

I've got a rifled barrel on order for my Adler straight pull. Didn't realise any of the above when I ordered it or the difficulty/cost ($145 per 50) in buying sabot slugs in Victoria or i wouldn't have bothered. All I dam say is it better be worth it or I'll be sore pissed.


I don't recall what sort of groups I was getting with Lee's 7/8-ounce, but I was pleased with them out to 50m. Not sure I've ever grouped them further than that. My shoulder really doesn't like playing with them. They're a sabot slug as they fit into a standard shot cup. Cast from recovered .22LR bullets makes them virtually free as well.

I ordered a rifled choke a few years ago but it never came in. I'm interested in your results, but I would only be using a rifled choke, I have plenty of rifles to do whatever I might want to do with slugs, but with better accuracy and far cheaper.

I might have to hurt myself shooting some groups I think :-)
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bigpete » 10 Feb 2022, 5:50 pm

You can shoot any 12g slugs in any 12g barrel and you won't wreck it,plenty of folks have and do shoot full bore lead slugs through rifled barrels and sabot slugs in smooth,results may vary though. You can even shoot shot in a rifled barrel and do no damage aside from a bit of leading.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by MontyShooter » 10 Feb 2022, 5:51 pm

I just use rifled target slugs. Cost under a buck and maybe 3 or 4 inch group at 100
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 10 Feb 2022, 6:56 pm

bigpete wrote:You can shoot any 12g slugs in any 12g barrel and you won't wreck it,plenty of folks have and do shoot full bore lead slugs through rifled barrels and sabot slugs in smooth,results may vary though. You can even shoot shot in a rifled barrel and do no damage aside from a bit of leading.


Copper, brass or steel slugs probably shouldn't be squeezed though a turkey choke, but I don't know if they'd actually damage anything other than the choke tube. My turkey choke is .640", I think the Lee slug is .685", plus the shot cup petals around it. The Lee is somewhat hollow so I'm sure it will swage down, if it's soft lead.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by boingk » 11 Feb 2022, 12:37 am

Unpick cheap target shells, replace the shot with cast slugs from the Lee mould, recrimp (i find a light trim helps) and enjoy.

I can easily hit a beer-carton-sized target at 75m with one. And if you're interested, its still 1oz of lead travelling at 1200fps... so the pressure remains the same, no barrel bulging or ruptures or any other weird mythes. Just use a cylinder choke preferably, or certainly no more than improved cylinder.

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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bigpete » 11 Feb 2022, 1:56 am

boingk wrote:Unpick cheap target shells, replace the shot with cast slugs from the Lee mould, recrimp (i find a light trim helps) and enjoy.

I can easily hit a beer-carton-sized target at 75m with one. And if you're interested, its still 1oz of lead travelling at 1200fps... so the pressure remains the same, no barrel bulging or ruptures or any other weird mythes. Just use a cylinder choke preferably, or certainly no more than improved cylinder.

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Actually pressure is less due to liquid dynamics
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 11 Feb 2022, 8:24 am

boingk wrote:Unpick cheap target shells, replace the shot with cast slugs from the Lee mould, recrimp (i find a light trim helps) and enjoy.

I can easily hit a beer-carton-sized target at 75m with one. And if you're interested, its still 1oz of lead travelling at 1200fps... so the pressure remains the same, no barrel bulging or ruptures or any other weird mythes. Just use a cylinder choke preferably, or certainly no more than improved cylinder.

- boingk


Have you chronographed them? I think they're slower than the shot load was rated at.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by Oldbloke » 11 Feb 2022, 8:34 am

bigpete wrote:
boingk wrote:Unpick cheap target shells, replace the shot with cast slugs from the Lee mould, recrimp (i find a light trim helps) and enjoy.

I can easily hit a beer-carton-sized target at 75m with one. And if you're interested, its still 1oz of lead travelling at 1200fps... so the pressure remains the same, no barrel bulging or ruptures or any other weird mythes. Just use a cylinder choke preferably, or certainly no more than improved cylinder.

- boingk


Actually pressure is less due to liquid dynamics


Please explain.jpeg
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bigpete » 11 Feb 2022, 10:39 am

Oldbloke wrote:
bigpete wrote:
boingk wrote:Unpick cheap target shells, replace the shot with cast slugs from the Lee mould, recrimp (i find a light trim helps) and enjoy.

I can easily hit a beer-carton-sized target at 75m with one. And if you're interested, its still 1oz of lead travelling at 1200fps... so the pressure remains the same, no barrel bulging or ruptures or any other weird mythes. Just use a cylinder choke preferably, or certainly no more than improved cylinder.

- boingk


Actually pressure is less due to liquid dynamics


Please explain.jpeg


As a load of shot is propelled forward,because its not solid,it is also forced outwards into the barrel,thereby creating more pressure than an equally weighted solid projectile. The term is actually fluid dynamics ,not liquid dynamics.
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Re: Dumb 12G slug ammo question

Post by bladeracer » 11 Feb 2022, 11:14 am

bigpete wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:
bigpete wrote:
boingk wrote:Unpick cheap target shells, replace the shot with cast slugs from the Lee mould, recrimp (i find a light trim helps) and enjoy.

I can easily hit a beer-carton-sized target at 75m with one. And if you're interested, its still 1oz of lead travelling at 1200fps... so the pressure remains the same, no barrel bulging or ruptures or any other weird mythes. Just use a cylinder choke preferably, or certainly no more than improved cylinder.

- boingk


Actually pressure is less due to liquid dynamics


Please explain.jpeg


As a load of shot is propelled forward,because its not solid,it is also forced outwards into the barrel,thereby creating more pressure than an equally weighted solid projectile. The term is actually fluid dynamics ,not liquid dynamics.


Similar effect occurs with soft lead bullets as well. Even heavy jacketed bullets with very long bearing surface can benefit from this effect to obturate to fill an over-size bore, as with the .264" 160gn RN in .267" Carcano and Steyr rifles.
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