6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

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6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Cherza » 29 Nov 2017, 8:20 pm

Hi there just woundering what your opinion is on this one.
The 6.5x55 is a great caliber so whats the fuss about with the creedmoor is it that much better?
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bladeracer » 29 Nov 2017, 9:12 pm

Cherza wrote:Hi there just woundering what your opinion is on this one.
The 6.5x55 is a great caliber so whats the fuss about with the creedmoor is it that much better?


I consider them to be essentially identical in performance, but I've heard the Creedmoor possibly works the brass less hard.
And the Creedmoor fits in a short action which is a bonus.
Other than that I don't see what the fuss is about either, probably just advertising hype to sell it.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Cherza » 29 Nov 2017, 9:43 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Cherza wrote:Hi there just woundering what your opinion is on this one.
The 6.5x55 is a great caliber so whats the fuss about with the creedmoor is it that much better?


I consider them to be essentially identical in performance, but I've heard the Creedmoor possibly works the brass less hard.
And the Creedmoor fits in a short action which is a bonus.
Other than that I don't see what the fuss is about either, probably just advertising hype to sell it.

Yeah thats exactly what I thought the ballistics are very close I have seen a few videos of long range shooting thats the advertising hype you mentioned.
They do look nice though :D
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 29 Nov 2017, 10:13 pm

It's in the dynamics of the case. The Creedmoor is basically more efficient. Same velocity achieved for less powder. The shorter case also enables it to be chambered in short actions which are deemed to be stiffer and hence inherently more accurate.
The 6.5 x 55 is an accurate, versatile cartridge but requires a longer action. It has been around since 1894 and is still commercially available, that should say something about it. The Creedmoor was devised a bit over 10 years ago with a specific intended purpose. ( long range target shooting ) It has been shown to excel at that and is also a very handy hunting round as well. Only time will tell if it has the longevity of the "Swede".
By the way, I own and shoot rifles in both chamberings.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Cherza » 29 Nov 2017, 10:52 pm

Gamerancher wrote:It's in the dynamics of the case. The Creedmoor is basically more efficient. Same velocity achieved for less powder. The shorter case also enables it to be chambered in short actions which are deemed to be stiffer and hence inherently more accurate.
The 6.5 x 55 is an accurate, versatile cartridge but requires a longer action. It has been around since 1894 and is still commercially available, that should say something about it. The Creedmoor was devised a bit over 10 years ago with a specific intended purpose. ( long range target shooting ) It has been shown to excel at that and is also a very handy hunting round as well. Only time will tell if it has the longevity of the "Swede".
By the way, I own and shoot rifles in both chamberings.

Well said mate that makes sence now modern technology hey.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Mitch » 30 Nov 2017, 4:57 am

6.5x55 is:
Faster
Flatter
More powder
Long action

6.5cm is:
Less powder
Short action
Latest fad

Both good. I have a 260 remington, which is very similar to the creed
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by straightshooter » 30 Nov 2017, 6:55 am

The 6.5 Creedmoor was designed for optimal use in US style High Power competition rifles and has seen some success.
What is pervasive in all forms of competition is the "monkey see, monkey do" effect. That is, competitors seeing somebody having success with some novelty or innovation immediately attribute that competitor's success to that novelty or innovation so the herd then imitates that novelty or innovation.
So unless you are thinking about taking up High Power shooting or possibly F open then I wouldn't waste another second worrying about it.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 30 Nov 2017, 7:10 am

I built a Creedmoor to shoot in high power silhouette for a number of reasons. None of which were to follow a "fad".

1. Inherent accuracy at longer range. ( an attribute of all 6.5mm rounds )
2. Efficiency ( less powder for same result = longer throat and barrel life, higher velocity 6.5's can really chew up barrels )
3. Reduced felt recoil and muzzle blast ( important to me as I have bung shoulders and an acquired brain injury )

There was a lot of research and discussion that went on before deciding to build my Creedmoor, my decision was based on facts and application,
it certainly wasn't a "monkey see, monkey do".
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Cooper » 30 Nov 2017, 10:06 am

I don't think you can keep calling the 6.5 Creedmoor a "FAD". It has been around for ten years now. The number rifles chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor and factory ammo has increased dramatically. There is a reason why it is so popular. The 6.5x55 versus 6.5 Creedmoor is a simply long versus short action thing for me. I went with the short action of the Creedmoor.
Then there is the 260 Remington which makes a lot of sense. But I already had a 7mm 08 and decided to try something a bit different. Rather than getting a 6.5mm 08(260 Remington).
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by marksman » 30 Nov 2017, 11:05 am

with the available powders and cases ect these days I think the only difference that matters is whether you want a short or a long action :unknown:
if I were to have a creedmore I would rather a log action so I could seat the projectiles longer
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by brett1868 » 01 Dec 2017, 9:55 pm

And the 6.5-300 Weatherby Magnum makes all other 6.5's it's bitches....Not really but I had to throw it in there as another 6.5 variant :)
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gwion » 02 Dec 2017, 7:46 pm

Yeah but do you get more than one pack of ammo out of it for barreel life??? :lol:
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by brett1868 » 02 Dec 2017, 9:44 pm

Gwion wrote:Yeah but do you get more than one pack of ammo out of it for barreel life??? :lol:


100+ rounds through mine and no signs of any throat erosion as yet but I don't load it overly hot anyway. Barrels are reasonably cheap and easy to find for the Mk.V Weatherby's so I'm not concerned about wearing one out.
My Tikka Tac 6.5 Creedmoor is performing way above expectations and I'm impressed with the cartridge. I've got a rifle being made at the moment and I was considering the 6.5x47 & 6.5x55 but ended up choosing 7mm RSAUM, it will be interesting to see how it compares to the 6.5's.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gwion » 03 Dec 2017, 4:02 am

Fair enough, mate.

I'd be willing to bet the creed gets 3x the barrel life of that weatherby, though. ;)
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 03 Dec 2017, 7:06 am

6.5 creedmore is a improvement on the 6.5x55 ( some might argue it's the american marketing machine for "new" products ), but in my opinion,with the european designed cartridges over 100 years ago, they designed things right the first time. powder and projectiles are much improved now. but the same laws of physics still apply. 6.5x55 is well established and supported worldwide with ammo, in general i find european norma ammo shoots real good in my 6.5's, followed by s&b, then rem corelokt. come old calibers refuse to die because they work well for intended purpose. 22 hornet, 30-30, 6.5x55 , 7x57, 30-06. just my humble opinion.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Lumbajak » 04 Jan 2018, 11:37 pm

6.5x55 vote here particularly handed loaded up to modern pressures.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 05 Jan 2018, 6:06 am

6.5 CM has taken the USA by storm and is one of the fastest growing sellers in AR-10 style rifles and bolt action guns. I don't follow high power too closely but it seems to be rapidly wiping out 308/7.62 NATO rifles in competition circles. There is some stuff that is a fad, but I don't think this is one.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bladeracer » 05 Jan 2018, 11:52 am

wanneroo wrote:6.5 CM has taken the USA by storm and is one of the fastest growing sellers in AR-10 style rifles and bolt action guns. I don't follow high power too closely but it seems to be rapidly wiping out 308/7.62 NATO rifles in competition circles. There is some stuff that is a fad, but I don't think this is one.


Because of the Creedmoor cartridge or just because of the 6.5mm bullet though?
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Lumbajak » 05 Jan 2018, 9:50 pm

Swede is faster and flatter than the Creedmoor when loaded up.
Muricans love the ar platform and a short action... always going to be popular.
If I could have an ar I would have one though.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 06 Jan 2018, 1:42 pm

bladeracer wrote:
wanneroo wrote:6.5 CM has taken the USA by storm and is one of the fastest growing sellers in AR-10 style rifles and bolt action guns. I don't follow high power too closely but it seems to be rapidly wiping out 308/7.62 NATO rifles in competition circles. There is some stuff that is a fad, but I don't think this is one.


Because of the Creedmoor cartridge or just because of the 6.5mm bullet though?


The whole package works well performance wise, but also is very compatible with AR-10 rifles and there is commonality in parts such as using the same bolt carrier group and magazines. With home building of AR rifles being very common, it means it doesn't cost a fortune to build up a rifle. Same thing with 300 Blackout and it's rapid acceptance in the marketplace. It uses the same .223/5.56 AR parts so it's easy to build, own and use and as some do they make their own brass from 223 or 5.56 casings.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by sungazer » 06 Jan 2018, 3:45 pm

To put it a bit simpler for us Ausies to understand as I fing the term AR ?? platform to be very vague. How do the different 6.5 mm rounds work in auto feed semi automatic rifles. These would be gas guns I presume. If the do work well I am a little surprised as a 140 Lapua loaded in 6.5 Creedmoor to max length (which I guess is somewhat limited by magazine length rather than throat length and getting close to or on the lands. Hope that makes sense) is pretty long ie the projectile is nearly or at least 2/3 as long as the case.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 07 Jan 2018, 8:53 am

sungazer wrote:To put it a bit simpler for us Ausies to understand as I fing the term AR ?? platform to be very vague. How do the different 6.5 mm rounds work in auto feed semi automatic rifles. These would be gas guns I presume. If the do work well I am a little surprised as a 140 Lapua loaded in 6.5 Creedmoor to max length (which I guess is somewhat limited by magazine length rather than throat length and getting close to or on the lands. Hope that makes sense) is pretty long ie the projectile is nearly or at least 2/3 as long as the case.


Well yes these days the AR platform is very vague as over 50 years of evolution on the civilian market from the original AR-10 and AR-15/M-16 has given us AR rifles chambered in many different calibers and lengths and there are hundreds of manufacturers of parts and complete rifles. Mostly an "AR" rifle is going to have a separate barreled upper receiver complete with bolt carrier group and a lower receiver consisting of the trigger pack, magazine slot, grip and stock. The rifles go together like Legos, so you can pick and choose furniture, bolts, triggers, barrels, gas blocks, etc.

You have two options for gas powered semi auto operation, one is what is known as direct impingement where the gas directly flows through a gas tube off the barrel and forces the bolt carrier backwards and the other is a piston where gas forces a piston back which contacts the bolt carrier and forces it backwards.

The Creedmoor shares the same rear end of a 308 Winchester so it uses the same bolt carrier as a 308 AR-10 rifle and uses the same magazines as well as long as the OAL of the cartridge doesn't exceed 2.83 inches.

Yes they work just fine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVtqpkPBXpA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4CKOra6vig
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by sungazer » 07 Jan 2018, 10:24 am

Thanks a great explanation I can visualize what you are saying without too much actual time spent with or looking at them. I was just curious how the 6.5 held up to rhe rough handling a semi can give the cartridge if contcentricity ever suffered due to a knock. Different manufactures have different chamber dimensions with all factory chambers a bit on the long side to cater for the longest bullet ever expected and then some to keep pressure down should the user load a hot round. Do you find very large chambers in the Ar's I am sure that many people get custom barrels made to help with accuracy as well? just as we do with bolt actions.

After having a quick look at the first Utube I can see that custom barrels long target barrels are fitted.

I cant look at a lot of video due to my internet connection limits.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Smiley » 07 Jan 2018, 7:43 pm

The Creed is a great cartridge, but is kind of a reinvention of the wheel. For a hunting round I'd go with the venerable Swede. Only because I'm sick of hearing about the Creedmoor.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 08 Jan 2018, 11:19 am

sungazer wrote:Thanks a great explanation I can visualize what you are saying without too much actual time spent with or looking at them. I was just curious how the 6.5 held up to rhe rough handling a semi can give the cartridge if contcentricity ever suffered due to a knock. Different manufactures have different chamber dimensions with all factory chambers a bit on the long side to cater for the longest bullet ever expected and then some to keep pressure down should the user load a hot round. Do you find very large chambers in the Ar's I am sure that many people get custom barrels made to help with accuracy as well? just as we do with bolt actions.

After having a quick look at the first Utube I can see that custom barrels long target barrels are fitted.

I cant look at a lot of video due to my internet connection limits.


Yes when loading for a semi auto you should have some consideration for neck tension, so you don't have bullet set back when a round hits the feed ramp or during recoil while the round is in the magazine. Some say it's nothing to worry about, some say it is, for myself when loading 308 for a semi auto, I at least apply a slight crimp. With AR rifles they use a rotating bolt with multiple locking lugs so they are inherently very accurate rifles if you've done everything else right.

With barrels, the AR market is huge so you can get barrels made by a large manufacturer, some from a smaller manufacturer, some made custom from a barrel blank. You have endless choices in length, dimensions, coatings, etc. It's actually a bit overwhelming because there are so many choices and because these rifles are modular you have endless choices for every other bit as well.

For over pressure situations, if you have a well made upper receiver and bolt carrier group, they can usually take it and excessive pressure will usually blow the magazine out of the lower receiver.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Midwestman » 21 Feb 2018, 1:48 pm

can't beat perfection of the humble ol 6.5x55swede.The creedmoor is just some new made yankee round to go into go a short action and the yanks are happy they invented the best round,not so in my book the best round was invented in 1894 the original and best still gaining popularity.Nothing against the creedmoor but i think the ol swede is better,shot my mates creedmor and i think my sporterised carl gustov still better.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 21 Feb 2018, 6:46 pm

Smiley wrote:The Creed is a great cartridge, but is kind of a reinvention of the wheel. For a hunting round I'd go with the venerable Swede. Only because I'm sick of hearing about the Creedmoor.

amen brother smiley. i have a 1909 carl gustav that's shooting 2 inch groups at 100 with open sights and a mod 70 super grade winnie in 6.5 x55. better powders and such exist these days, but basic physics and design is largely unchanged. the europeans were at the cutting edge of technology 100 years ago and many calibres are reinvented for marketing and selling more product by the yanks, 7-08 / 7x57 , 6.5 cm / 6.5 swede are 2 good examples. as for AR rifles for hunting , i'll buy one when pigs and goats start shooting back :lol: 30-30 win is still popular because it's in a handy rifle and it works. big game , 9.3 x62 would do me. 8x57 is probably the most underated calibre out there. the europeans had a metric version of the 22 hornet before the yanks "discovered " it. i'm content to stick with tried and proven stuff, if people want to follow the latest fad, each to their own i guess. JMHO . 6.5 x 55 works for me and actually has slightly more case capacity than 308 win
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 22 Feb 2018, 7:23 am

I suppose we should all be driving around in Model "T" Fords then?
I'm a big fan of "original" chamberings, more than half of my rifles are chambered in pre-1900 designs.
Yes, the Europeans were miles ahead of the Yanks in cartridge design, and yes, the Yanks do pinch a lot of Euro cartridges, tweek them a bit and claim to have "invented" them.
That don't mean that I sh!tcan modern improvements in cartridges. The Creedmoor is just a more efficient cartridge than the Swede, by the way, I own rifles in both.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by slickncghia » 22 Feb 2018, 7:36 am

All the swede owners should at least appreciate the massive influx of superior projectiles that the popularity of the creed has brought along.

Also 55 requires ~44gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2617 ftsec

Creed requires 40gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2660 ftsec.

I'm sure there's results to the contrary but similar performance from less Powder is good.

62000psi Vs 51000psi saami will do that
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bladeracer » 22 Feb 2018, 12:20 pm

slickncghia wrote:All the swede owners should at least appreciate the massive influx of superior projectiles that the popularity of the creed has brought along.

Also 55 requires ~44gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2617 ftsec

Creed requires 40gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2660 ftsec.

I'm sure there's results to the contrary but similar performance from less Powder is good.

62000psi Vs 51000psi saami will do that


True, but similar performance with lower pressures is also a good thing.
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