6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Lumbajak » 05 Jan 2018, 9:50 pm

Swede is faster and flatter than the Creedmoor when loaded up.
Muricans love the ar platform and a short action... always going to be popular.
If I could have an ar I would have one though.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 06 Jan 2018, 1:42 pm

bladeracer wrote:
wanneroo wrote:6.5 CM has taken the USA by storm and is one of the fastest growing sellers in AR-10 style rifles and bolt action guns. I don't follow high power too closely but it seems to be rapidly wiping out 308/7.62 NATO rifles in competition circles. There is some stuff that is a fad, but I don't think this is one.


Because of the Creedmoor cartridge or just because of the 6.5mm bullet though?


The whole package works well performance wise, but also is very compatible with AR-10 rifles and there is commonality in parts such as using the same bolt carrier group and magazines. With home building of AR rifles being very common, it means it doesn't cost a fortune to build up a rifle. Same thing with 300 Blackout and it's rapid acceptance in the marketplace. It uses the same .223/5.56 AR parts so it's easy to build, own and use and as some do they make their own brass from 223 or 5.56 casings.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by sungazer » 06 Jan 2018, 3:45 pm

To put it a bit simpler for us Ausies to understand as I fing the term AR ?? platform to be very vague. How do the different 6.5 mm rounds work in auto feed semi automatic rifles. These would be gas guns I presume. If the do work well I am a little surprised as a 140 Lapua loaded in 6.5 Creedmoor to max length (which I guess is somewhat limited by magazine length rather than throat length and getting close to or on the lands. Hope that makes sense) is pretty long ie the projectile is nearly or at least 2/3 as long as the case.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 07 Jan 2018, 8:53 am

sungazer wrote:To put it a bit simpler for us Ausies to understand as I fing the term AR ?? platform to be very vague. How do the different 6.5 mm rounds work in auto feed semi automatic rifles. These would be gas guns I presume. If the do work well I am a little surprised as a 140 Lapua loaded in 6.5 Creedmoor to max length (which I guess is somewhat limited by magazine length rather than throat length and getting close to or on the lands. Hope that makes sense) is pretty long ie the projectile is nearly or at least 2/3 as long as the case.


Well yes these days the AR platform is very vague as over 50 years of evolution on the civilian market from the original AR-10 and AR-15/M-16 has given us AR rifles chambered in many different calibers and lengths and there are hundreds of manufacturers of parts and complete rifles. Mostly an "AR" rifle is going to have a separate barreled upper receiver complete with bolt carrier group and a lower receiver consisting of the trigger pack, magazine slot, grip and stock. The rifles go together like Legos, so you can pick and choose furniture, bolts, triggers, barrels, gas blocks, etc.

You have two options for gas powered semi auto operation, one is what is known as direct impingement where the gas directly flows through a gas tube off the barrel and forces the bolt carrier backwards and the other is a piston where gas forces a piston back which contacts the bolt carrier and forces it backwards.

The Creedmoor shares the same rear end of a 308 Winchester so it uses the same bolt carrier as a 308 AR-10 rifle and uses the same magazines as well as long as the OAL of the cartridge doesn't exceed 2.83 inches.

Yes they work just fine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVtqpkPBXpA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4CKOra6vig
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by sungazer » 07 Jan 2018, 10:24 am

Thanks a great explanation I can visualize what you are saying without too much actual time spent with or looking at them. I was just curious how the 6.5 held up to rhe rough handling a semi can give the cartridge if contcentricity ever suffered due to a knock. Different manufactures have different chamber dimensions with all factory chambers a bit on the long side to cater for the longest bullet ever expected and then some to keep pressure down should the user load a hot round. Do you find very large chambers in the Ar's I am sure that many people get custom barrels made to help with accuracy as well? just as we do with bolt actions.

After having a quick look at the first Utube I can see that custom barrels long target barrels are fitted.

I cant look at a lot of video due to my internet connection limits.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Smiley » 07 Jan 2018, 7:43 pm

The Creed is a great cartridge, but is kind of a reinvention of the wheel. For a hunting round I'd go with the venerable Swede. Only because I'm sick of hearing about the Creedmoor.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by wanneroo » 08 Jan 2018, 11:19 am

sungazer wrote:Thanks a great explanation I can visualize what you are saying without too much actual time spent with or looking at them. I was just curious how the 6.5 held up to rhe rough handling a semi can give the cartridge if contcentricity ever suffered due to a knock. Different manufactures have different chamber dimensions with all factory chambers a bit on the long side to cater for the longest bullet ever expected and then some to keep pressure down should the user load a hot round. Do you find very large chambers in the Ar's I am sure that many people get custom barrels made to help with accuracy as well? just as we do with bolt actions.

After having a quick look at the first Utube I can see that custom barrels long target barrels are fitted.

I cant look at a lot of video due to my internet connection limits.


Yes when loading for a semi auto you should have some consideration for neck tension, so you don't have bullet set back when a round hits the feed ramp or during recoil while the round is in the magazine. Some say it's nothing to worry about, some say it is, for myself when loading 308 for a semi auto, I at least apply a slight crimp. With AR rifles they use a rotating bolt with multiple locking lugs so they are inherently very accurate rifles if you've done everything else right.

With barrels, the AR market is huge so you can get barrels made by a large manufacturer, some from a smaller manufacturer, some made custom from a barrel blank. You have endless choices in length, dimensions, coatings, etc. It's actually a bit overwhelming because there are so many choices and because these rifles are modular you have endless choices for every other bit as well.

For over pressure situations, if you have a well made upper receiver and bolt carrier group, they can usually take it and excessive pressure will usually blow the magazine out of the lower receiver.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Midwestman » 21 Feb 2018, 1:48 pm

can't beat perfection of the humble ol 6.5x55swede.The creedmoor is just some new made yankee round to go into go a short action and the yanks are happy they invented the best round,not so in my book the best round was invented in 1894 the original and best still gaining popularity.Nothing against the creedmoor but i think the ol swede is better,shot my mates creedmor and i think my sporterised carl gustov still better.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 21 Feb 2018, 6:46 pm

Smiley wrote:The Creed is a great cartridge, but is kind of a reinvention of the wheel. For a hunting round I'd go with the venerable Swede. Only because I'm sick of hearing about the Creedmoor.

amen brother smiley. i have a 1909 carl gustav that's shooting 2 inch groups at 100 with open sights and a mod 70 super grade winnie in 6.5 x55. better powders and such exist these days, but basic physics and design is largely unchanged. the europeans were at the cutting edge of technology 100 years ago and many calibres are reinvented for marketing and selling more product by the yanks, 7-08 / 7x57 , 6.5 cm / 6.5 swede are 2 good examples. as for AR rifles for hunting , i'll buy one when pigs and goats start shooting back :lol: 30-30 win is still popular because it's in a handy rifle and it works. big game , 9.3 x62 would do me. 8x57 is probably the most underated calibre out there. the europeans had a metric version of the 22 hornet before the yanks "discovered " it. i'm content to stick with tried and proven stuff, if people want to follow the latest fad, each to their own i guess. JMHO . 6.5 x 55 works for me and actually has slightly more case capacity than 308 win
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 22 Feb 2018, 7:23 am

I suppose we should all be driving around in Model "T" Fords then?
I'm a big fan of "original" chamberings, more than half of my rifles are chambered in pre-1900 designs.
Yes, the Europeans were miles ahead of the Yanks in cartridge design, and yes, the Yanks do pinch a lot of Euro cartridges, tweek them a bit and claim to have "invented" them.
That don't mean that I sh!tcan modern improvements in cartridges. The Creedmoor is just a more efficient cartridge than the Swede, by the way, I own rifles in both.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by slickncghia » 22 Feb 2018, 7:36 am

All the swede owners should at least appreciate the massive influx of superior projectiles that the popularity of the creed has brought along.

Also 55 requires ~44gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2617 ftsec

Creed requires 40gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2660 ftsec.

I'm sure there's results to the contrary but similar performance from less Powder is good.

62000psi Vs 51000psi saami will do that
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bladeracer » 22 Feb 2018, 12:20 pm

slickncghia wrote:All the swede owners should at least appreciate the massive influx of superior projectiles that the popularity of the creed has brought along.

Also 55 requires ~44gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2617 ftsec

Creed requires 40gn of 2209 to push 140gn @2660 ftsec.

I'm sure there's results to the contrary but similar performance from less Powder is good.

62000psi Vs 51000psi saami will do that


True, but similar performance with lower pressures is also a good thing.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by sungazer » 22 Feb 2018, 12:29 pm

The online barrel life calculator that I have looked at only goes by what type of powder different heating coefficients the qty of powder and the bore size. Pressure doesn't come into the equation as far as I know.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 22 Feb 2018, 3:21 pm

hey GR i didn't mean to "******" modern improvements, but i am a bit cynical about the motivation at times of the american arms industry. if i came off sounding a bit over the top in my humble opinion i appologize. i love old world type stuff and people that know me wouldn't be supprised if i went on a hunt with a muzzle loader. just having a C.O.C.D moment and a couple of beers.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 23 Feb 2018, 7:56 am

It's all good mate, I suffer from the very same thing. In the sh!t at the moment with family 'cause I sent an email basically telling them to pull their heads out of their arse! :lol:

I built a Creedmoor for the reduced recoil and muzzle blast that it produces with the loads that I require for silhouette, the efficiency of the cartridge is what does that.
The inherent accuracy that goes with just about any 6.5mm is also why I chose to build a rifle in the chambering, as well as having thousands of Lapua 6.5mm projectiles on hand.
My choice had nothing to do with wanting to join a fad. The cartridge has now been around for more than 11 years, new in terms of rifle chamberings, but hardly "latest thing".
The cartridge was designed originally for long range, high power National Matches in the U.S. with "off the shelf" competition grade ammo available as well as published data to replicate the factory loadings. It performs very well in that arena, always appearing in the winners circle since its' introduction. :thumbsup:
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 23 Feb 2018, 3:23 pm

yeh GR, have heard 6.5 CM was primarally designed as a target shooters round, and a mate of mine keeps rambling like a relgious nut about the 6mm - 7mm "golden mean" of projectile efficiancy. i think the mauser brothers may have even had something to do with the research behind that. looking at it though, from 243, 6 mm rem, 6.5's, 7mm's with 7mm rem mag as well they are all known for being inherently accurate by design. by the way, C.O.C.D stands for cranky old c@nt disorder ! :lol:
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 24 Feb 2018, 9:33 am

any other 6.5 feed back ? there is a 6.5x57 and a bigger one again i think . opinions anyone ?
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 26 Feb 2018, 8:20 am

Yeah mate, I know what C.O.C.D means, I've had it for a while now. :lol:

I used to use a 6.5 x 57 A.I. in a 1 in 8" twist barrel for silly-wet shooting. I ran it hard and fast and it was a ripper. I used to shoot a 155gr Sierra MK on top of 50gr of 2213 @ 2900f/s that would group 1.5" at 500m. I ran 120 gr bullets for the shorter distances and they were doing about 3000 f/s. Needless to say, she was a throat burner. Had it re-chambered 3 times to overcome the erosion. I still have the barrel and although there's no rifling left in the first 3 inches it still shoots the lighter bullets quite accurately. Good long range hunting round as well. :thumbsup: ( However, the action now sports a 7mm-08 barrel.) :drinks:
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 27 Feb 2018, 4:44 pm

6.5x57 AI sounds like a beast alright GR. another european hot rod is the 5.6x57 RWS . wonder what barrel life is like with that ? one of the reasons i like "older" design calibres, is a lot of them aren't too harsh on barrels and such. having said that i am going to start handloading soon, firstly for 6.5x55. been buying norma vulkan 156 gr at gun world for $43 a box and building up on the good brass. shoots good out of my 70 winchester, has a MAB barrel on it. flattens goats REAL well . got any advice /loads you can recommend for 6.5 ? particularly interested in projectiles. want something that expands well on pigs and goats
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best 3 shot group at 100 out of my 6.5x55 on the weekend at ripley
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 02 Mar 2018, 11:07 am

For hunting with 6.5's I like a 120gr Ballistic tip for soft-skinned critters and the Sierra 140gr Gameking is hard to beat on bigger stuff.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 02 Mar 2018, 1:57 pm

thanks GR, have been told game kings are a good general purpose round. haven't heard any feedback on norma projectiles mate ? cheers
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Gamerancher » 02 Mar 2018, 7:35 pm

Sorry, can't afford Norma factory loads. :lol: :drinks:
As you have previously stated, the Europeans do know their sh!t though. I'd go off what usage Norma recommend :thumbsup: .
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 02 Mar 2018, 8:49 pm

was refering to just the norma projectiles. probably aren't easy to get in oz anyway. cost and accuracy improvement are a reason i'm looking into reloading, i have a rifle in 22 hornet which is ridiculously expensive on factory ammo, but real cheap to reload. thanks for advice on the projectiles but , :thumbsup:
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Flyer » 06 Apr 2018, 4:33 am

A couple of years ago I would have bought a 6.5x55 or even a 260 Rem over a Creedmoor. But the way the Creedmoor has taken off in recent years . . . Never mind it's a more efficient cartridge with a short action and inherent accuracy, I've been looking online and visiting gun shops recently to see what sort of ammo, rifles and brass they have, and on average there's more of everything now in Creed compared to Swede and 260. That means more choice of rifles, more choice of factory ammunition - both match grade and cheaper hunting ammo - more choice of brass (including everything from spent factory to Lapua small-primer), more load data, and arguably more availability which is only going to increase - especially now Sako/Tikka and other major manufacturers have all jumped on the "bandwagon".

Whether you reload or not, the Creedmoor makes a good case for being the most practical 6.5 cartridge for many people and purposes. Whether it's around in 100 years like the Swede remains to be seen, but it's only going to get bigger before then.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by perentie » 06 Apr 2018, 7:52 am

bigrich wrote:any other 6.5 feed back ? there is a 6.5x57 and a bigger one again i think . opinions anyone ?


No one (I think) has mentioned the 6.5-284 I built one on a Rem 700 for my wife for F class shooting about 10 years ago. Shoots very well but as expected is a bit hard on barrels. I havnt bothered cutting and rechambering, I just chuck in a new barrel. There may be life left yet in those old ones cut back and rechambered for one of these shorter 6.5,s.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Lawyer Daggett » 21 Oct 2019, 2:52 pm

I recently made this decision. After considerable research I went with the 6.5x55. I considered the 6.5x57, 6.5x55, 6.5 Rem Mag ( as a former .350 Rem Mag owner I thought it could be interesting to work with), .260 and the Creedmoor.
Case availability knocked out the Rem Mag, I figure even if it turns out to be a fad, there are enough Creedmoor's in circulation to guarantee case availability, and the choice became a three dog race between the 6.5x55, .260 and the Creedmoor with little to choose between them,
Ultimately the choice came down to the Swede's case capacity, and the availability at a sensible price of a nice second hand rifle in it- a Mauser M12 Pure.
I decided upon the 6.5x55.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by JimTom » 21 Oct 2019, 3:05 pm

Nice one. It was a win win win scenario though. I don’t think any of the three would be a bad choice mate. Let us know how it shoots mate.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by Bill » 21 Oct 2019, 6:49 pm

Good choice Lawyer daggett the Swede just does it with ease, A classy case that doesnt need to be jucied up to the tits to get decent performance.

M12 pure will be a nice rifle, got a favorite bullet you'll be using ??

If I wanted a short 6.5 it would be the PRC.
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Re: 6.5x55 vs 6.5 creedmoor

Post by bigrich » 23 Oct 2019, 3:57 pm

Lawyer Daggett wrote:I recently made this decision. After considerable research I went with the 6.5x55. I considered the 6.5x57, 6.5x55, 6.5 Rem Mag ( as a former .350 Rem Mag owner I thought it could be interesting to work with), .260 and the Creedmoor.
Case availability knocked out the Rem Mag, I figure even if it turns out to be a fad, there are enough Creedmoor's in circulation to guarantee case availability, and the choice became a three dog race between the 6.5x55, .260 and the Creedmoor with little to choose between them,
Ultimately the choice came down to the Swede's case capacity, and the availability at a sensible price of a nice second hand rifle in it- a Mauser M12 Pure.
I decided upon the 6.5x55.


i love the swede cartridge. will like to hear feedback on the mauser rifle . love your online name mate , i watched the original "tru grit" the other night . another classic movie from a forgotten era :thumbsup:
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