Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Improving and repairing firearms. Rifle bedding, barrel work, stock replacement and other ways to improve your firearms.

Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Toolnup » 22 Aug 2018, 7:48 pm

Hi all,

I'm thinking about cutting the 26 inch varmint barrel down on my Remington 700 .308 to 20 inches.

My original idea of long range target shooting has never actually eventuated so making it a bit more portable has some appeal. May want to hunt some ferals or something one day.

I realise I will lose some velocity (not sure how much) but is there any other pros and cons I should consider? It shoots pretty damn good as is so I would hate to jeopardize that and have the accuracy suffer.

Has anyone done anything similar to their rifle and if so how did it go?

Also, can anyone recommend a gunsmith in the Brisbane or Sunshine Coast area that could do the job?

Cheers.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by SCJ429 » 22 Aug 2018, 8:45 pm

I have a big bore with a 18 inch barrel, it balances the rifle and makes it point really well. You will lose a little velocity but a 308 isn't the fastest kid on the block in any case. I think it would work well if you are shooting lighter projectiles at ranges up to 300 metres. The only smith I know in QLD is John Giles. Accuracy could improve with the stiffer shorter barrel and a decent crown.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Mitch » 23 Aug 2018, 5:25 am

Will lose velocity
Will possibly be a bit louder (this always seems a bit subjective to the person)
If you handload then there is a very good chance of having to re-work your loads

May balance it more
Easier to swing quickly
Less weight

If it is want you want to do then i say go for it. If it turns out to be a bad idea can always get it re-barreled
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Rod_outbak » 23 Aug 2018, 5:38 am

I have a Rem 700 Varmint Stainless Fluted, in .308, with a 26" barrel.
Mine is mounted in an MDT TAC-21 chassis.
Fantastic rifle; heavy as sin, but pokks things at distance with ease.
Walking with the rifle the other morning (sunrise Grasshopper-Pokk), I note the rifle doesnt balance where I carry it(nose-heavy), so I've been considering my options.
Sadly, I think the fluting probably prevents me from lopping any length off it.

I have considered having it re-barrelled in something like .260, but I ended up buying a Ruger Precision Rifle in .308 with a 20" barrel just before Christmas, so still tossing up which one I re-barrel. I kinda like the idea of keeping the Rem 700 with the 26" barrel for any long-range pokking, and change the RPR over to a 6.5 calibre.
[Still weighing up pros & cons, though]

Lee Trengrove (Brisbane) does a lot of work on Rem 700's, and specialises in custom-machining muzzle brakes, and threading barrels to fit them.
I've had him fit a brake to my Tikka 7mm-08 hunter, and have been extremely happy with the results, and his work.
I've also had mates get him to do various work, and aside from long wait times (as per most decent gunsmiths..), he does great work.
trentech.com.au
Allan Swan(Ipswich) also has a a VERY long-established reputation for being able to work magic with barrels; might be worth also asking him.
https://www.allanswangunsmithing.com/

If I was going to shorten my Rem 700, I'm not sure how short I'd go. The 20" barrel on the RPR is fantastic for making the rifle so much more easy to carry around, but that 26" barrel on the Rem 700 sure does reach out and touch stuff...
When I was discussing replacing the barrel with a 6.5mm one, most of my distance-shooting mates were suggesting I would do the rifle any favours if I go much shorter than 22"-24", but we didnt really get into discussing WHY they felt that to be the case.

Cheers,

Rod.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Oldbloke » 23 Aug 2018, 6:16 am

I would sell it and buy a more appropriate rifle.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by SCJ429 » 23 Aug 2018, 8:09 am

If you are shooting a 6.5 at longer ranger with 140+ grain projectiles using slower powders like 2209 a short 22 inch barrel will have you spitting out huge flames from the muzzle. This is all lost velocity which is badly needed at long range. A better solution would be a 6.5 Gredel shooting lighter pills shooting in the 1s out of your 22 inch barrel. It works for thousands of PPC shooters.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by bigpete » 23 Aug 2018, 8:59 am

Done it heaps. You dont need to go to a gunsmith for it unless it's a legal requirement.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Andrew1au » 23 Aug 2018, 9:31 am

Maybe consider just getting another barrel. Can always change back if you want. Plus even if you cut a varmint barrel to 20”, it’s still going to be heavy for hunting. Get yourself a sporter barrel.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by pete1 » 23 Aug 2018, 10:18 am

Oldbloke wrote:I would sell it and buy a more appropriate rifle.


I wound agree.
I have 22inch 308 and gets a fireball out end of barrel, so that or anyless would prob still shoot fireball.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Rod_outbak » 23 Aug 2018, 3:14 pm

[quote="pete1"]

[quote="Oldbloke"]I would sell it and buy a more appropriate rifle.
[/quote]

I wound agree.
I have 22inch 308 and gets a fireball out end of barrel, so that or anyless would prob still shoot fireball.
[/quote]

????
Sorry, but am I missing something here??
I have a 20" .308 (RPR - as well as a 26" Rem700 in same cal), and I dont get a massive fireball when shooting with it.
Yes, the 20" has more muzzle blast felt than the 26", but having fired both at night/twighlight, the difference in actual flame out of the muzzle, isnt that much.
Besides, the RPR has a bitey (Fat Bastard) brake on it, so not too surprising it's muzzle blast is worse.
The barrel on the RPR is pretty close to the profile of a varmint barrel, so I'm confused why cutting the 26" rifle would be inappropriate.
Wouldnt changing powders to something a bit faster, possibly improve the 'fireball'?

There are a lot of people who use much shorter barrels than 22" in a .308, and dont seem to suffer for it.

Cheers,

Rod.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Homer » 23 Aug 2018, 5:58 pm

G'Day Fella's,

Basically Toolup, I'd say No.
Better to sell it and buy a new one that has the features you now require.
The reason I suggest this is, most rifle barrels these days, have a slight restriction (referred to as Choke), in the last part of the barrel, near the muzzle.
If you shorten the barrel, you may loose this and no longer have the same accuracy, that you presently have at 26"???

Hope that helps

D'oh!
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by marksman » 23 Aug 2018, 6:58 pm

If I were to do it I would get a gunsmith to cut a few threads off and rechamber then dock the barrel and recrown
cost should be about $250-$300
IMO it should be determined by the shot count in your barrel, I would leave it until it has done at least 1000 shots
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Toolnup » 23 Aug 2018, 7:08 pm

Thanks for all the info guys. I bit more to consider than I originally thought.

I considered just getting another barrel but I had a quick look and its seems rather expensive, where as cutting and recrowning would be less so and I don't think I could bring myself to selling it, just shoots so well.

Might be a good excuse for another rifle.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by bigfellascott » 23 Aug 2018, 7:12 pm

pete1 wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:I would sell it and buy a more appropriate rifle.


I wound agree.
I have 22inch 308 and gets a fireball out end of barrel, so that or anyless would prob still shoot fireball.


Sounds like ya need a faster burning powder if she's shooting flames out the muzzle (a sign the powder hasn't burn completely before the projectile has exited the barrel, which means wasted energy/velocity compared to something that burns more efficiently (no big deal if you don't care) but something to be aware of in any case. :thumbsup:
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by pete1 » 23 Aug 2018, 8:14 pm

bigfellascott wrote:
pete1 wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:I would sell it and buy a more appropriate rifle.


I wound agree.
I have 22inch 308 and gets a fireball out end of barrel, so that or anyless would prob still shoot fireball.


Sounds like ya need a faster burning powder if she's shooting flames out the muzzle (a sign the powder hasn't burn completely before the projectile has exited the barrel, which means wasted energy/velocity compared to something that burns more efficiently (no big deal if you don't care) but something to be aware of in any case. :thumbsup:


Yeh it only happens when i use cheap ammo (PPU), still shots straight so doesn't really affect me.
If i use Hornaby or something i dont have a fireball.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by marksman » 24 Aug 2018, 7:11 pm

Toolnup wrote:Thanks for all the info guys. I bit more to consider than I originally thought.

I considered just getting another barrel but I had a quick look and its seems rather expensive, where as cutting and recrowning would be less so and I don't think I could bring myself to selling it, just shoots so well.

Might be a good excuse for another rifle.


if it shoots really well I wouldn't do it cause it might not any more :thumbsup:
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by SCJ429 » 24 Aug 2018, 7:50 pm

A Remington that shoots really well? When did this happen? Must be a A or B series. How well does it shoot?
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Toolnup » 25 Aug 2018, 3:52 pm

SCJ429 wrote:A Remington that shoots really well? When did this happen? Must be a A or B series. How well does it shoot?


Yeah I know they get a bad rap but mine will shoot sub MOA all day if I do my part.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Rod_outbak » 25 Aug 2018, 5:07 pm

[quote="Toolnup"]

[quote="SCJ429"]A Remington that shoots really well? When did this happen? Must be a A or B series. How well does it shoot?[/quote]

Yeah I know they get a bad rap but mine will shoot sub MOA all day if I do my part.

[/quote]

Yeah, my Rem 700 VSF in .308 has been a pearler since day 1.
6 years old to date, and never had a day when I regretted buying it.

I know that I've been told that there are plenty of later model Remingtons that had serious quality control issues, but mine has been proven to be a fantastic rifle.
My mate who worked up loads for me, found he could shoot ragged 1-hole groups(5 rounds) at 100m with it.
I know Remington have been hit & miss in the recent past, but I couldnt complain about mine at all.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by SCJ429 » 25 Aug 2018, 7:11 pm

Sorry Toolnup, I didn't mean to have a laugh at your expense. I have a friend who has a Remington 5R Sendero that shoots in the .4s. Remington does seem to do better with Varmint barrels in 30 cal. I have another friend with a 22/250 who couldn't hit the side of a barn door. I thought that he was just a terrible shot but after hundreds of rounds load testing it would not shoot better than five inches. He sold it and moved on. That rifle was soul destroying for a new shooter.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Toolnup » 25 Aug 2018, 8:18 pm

All good, no worries.

Yeah I've had mine for a while and i do remember ordering it and then having second thoughts as the qc issues came to light.

The only drama i have had was the trigger recall a few years ago that needed to be done. But ended up with a much nicer trigger out of it so that was good.

Still like the idea of having a short heavy barreled rifle of some kind.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Oldbloke » 25 Aug 2018, 8:24 pm

No expert here. But I think all you need is a mate with a half decent lathe
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by bigpete » 26 Aug 2018, 5:04 pm

Oldbloke wrote:No expert here. But I think all you need is a mate with a half decent lathe


I've done them with a hacksaw lol.
Shot 3/4" groups before and after.
Too easy
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Oldbloke » 26 Aug 2018, 6:22 pm

bigpete wrote:
Oldbloke wrote:No expert here. But I think all you need is a mate with a half decent lathe


I've done them with a hacksaw lol.
Shot 3/4" groups before and after.
Too easy


Same here.. Did a 22lr yonks ago and used a hack saw, then file then counter sink drill. Finished it off by lapping. Lol shot great after the job was done..
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by marksman » 26 Aug 2018, 6:34 pm

I fixed one for a guy who attacked his barrel with a hacksaw after doing the projectile test on the muzzle and the projectile fell into the bore a bit
I draw filed it flat and square but couldn't give a guarantee it would be any better than what he had done
I squared it by poking a rod that fitted fairly tight into the bore and putting a square against it and the messy muzzle
I did the crown with a brass dome nut on a bolt in a drill with valve grinding paste and some metal polish
made it better, went from 4" moa to 3/4" at 100, it was an old sporter 303, he still has it and it still shoots as good
a lathe is a much smarter thing to use :drinks:
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Oldbloke » 26 Aug 2018, 6:40 pm

"I did the crown with a brass dome nut on a bolt in a drill with valve grinding paste and some metal polish "

I did the same. But used a ball bearing welded to a rod with lapping paste.
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by bigpete » 26 Aug 2018, 7:45 pm

Didn't bother doing the crown on any of mine. Eventually got a gunsmith to crown one,made not one jot of difference.
Even coned the barrel of my hawken using hand tools. Also made zero difference
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by Oldbloke » 26 Aug 2018, 9:03 pm

Interesting.. Makes you wonder just how important is the crown.. The way some people talk it's critical. But from above experience not so important......?
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by bigpete » 27 Aug 2018, 6:12 am

I've no doubt it can affect the direction of bullet travel,after all,I have removed metal from the inside of the crown of a sxs shotgun to regulate the barrels together.
And I'm sure that I wouldn't hacksaw up a long range rig. But I'm positive that as long as the crown is cut straight and even most guys wouldn't be able to tell much difference. I've done 2 22s,a22wmr,a 308,a 303,and a 223, and none of them shot worse after being done
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Re: Cutting barrel down. Yes or no?

Post by straightshooter » 27 Aug 2018, 8:08 am

The importance of the crown is vastly over rated, especially by target shooters, provided the rifle bore has no defects at the muzzle.
Think about it, again provided the bore is sound and correctly dimensioned at the muzzle, what changes from shot to shot even with hack sawn at a 45 degree angle?
Because the crown is readily visible, gunsmiths take particular care as it is an indicator of their skill and workmanship and thus the crown is regarded with unwarranted reverence by many shooters.

Edit: I forgot to say that in a 308 a 22" barrel is an excellent compromise in weight, handiness and velocity potential.
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