What makes a gunsmith? Any ideas?

[Warrigul]

A bit of a rant here,

How the hell can anyone call themselves a gunsmith when they don't even do any of their own machining and hold no formal machining or trade qualification?

What would be a reasonable criteria for calling oneself a gunsmith?

Rant over.

Opinions please.

[Apollo]

Sounds like someone has been stung ....

I can't speak from any legal point of view nor the rest of our country but as best I know there is no actual Trade or Qualification required as really a "Gunsmith" is just a name. A little different in the USA I believe but here not so.

In NSW I would believe you are required to be a "Firearms Dealer" and have the appropriate licence issued from the NSW FAR.

So, the local Gun Shop is a Dealer and can store, modify and do repairs to a Firearm. Doesn't make them a "Gunsmith" business. Generally No.

Reputation, reliability, expertise etc in doing repairs, machining, modifications, construction etc of Firearms and Parts I would believe makes a "Gunsmith".

I deal with any one of a few or more "Gunsmiths" ... they have been in the business for many years, one is also a "Barrel Manufacturer" and all are or have been very involved in the Precision Shooting side and highly regarded target shooters of any form available here in Aussie. One is the consultant for the NRA, another is an authorised repairer for Winchester Australia. then a Barrel Manufacturer etc.

Someone that doesn't do any machining, then in my opinion not a "Gunsmith".... Sounds like a risky attempt to do something.

I would think that a start would be being a qualified Tradesman in "Machining, Fitting & Turning, Mechanical Engineer and /or such" who holds a current recognised ticket....but, as I said, there is not official Trade called "Gunsmith" ..... that I know of....

[Warrigul]

Sounds like someone has been stung ....

I can't speak from any legal point of view nor the rest of our country but as best I know there is no actual Trade or Qualification required as really a "Gunsmith" is just a name. A little different in the USA I believe but here not so.

I spent part of this morning fixing someone's fruck up for a mate.

It only cost him a couple of hours stacking my wood whilst I worked on his job and a carton for the use of a lathe(I don't have my own anymore) but to look at the state of the cases coming out of his rifle it was very lucky the damage wasn't much worse. I am pretty sure all they did was screw a replacement barrel on without even checking headspace.

I am not a gunsmith but I reckon a moderately trained chimp could have done a better job on this rifle than the original bloke did. It is not hard to do it right, with all the info out there nowadays it is painting by numbers.

It really makes you wonder at times.

[Ken]

I suppose the problem here is there is no educational framework for becoming a gunsmith?

If you wanna become an electrician you go do an apprenticeship. If you want to be a gunsmith what's stopping you from just calling yourself one?

Nothing I don't think.

[Baronvonrort]

Apollo-
Who is the Barrel manufacturer in Australia?

Are they any good?

From what i understand a firearm dealer is also licensed to manufacture firearms, if you cannot use i lathe i cannot call you a gunsmith.

[Apollo]

There are three Barrel Manufacturers in Australia. Maddco & TSE in Qld then also Tobler in NSW. All have had a reputation as being excellant at one time, are they any good, well that is not open to discussion here as far as I'm concerned as I have not used any of them.

BTW...There is also "True-Flite" Barrels manufactured in New Zealand.

In NSW if you look at the conditions for a Dealers Licence on NSW FAR you will see they are licenced to do any work and manufacture of Firearms / Parts. Are they qualified, that is another question I much doubt is yes from most I have had any dealings with and certainly don't get to touch any of my expensive custom rifles.

As I said, as far as I know to be a Gunsmith in NSW you need to have a Dealers Licence for a start. What happens from there is anyone's guess but I don't deal with any so called Gunsmith unless I have a lot of background information on who they are and what they have experience with. I can use a Lathe but I would not take on the tasks involved with precision custom firearms. I'd rather pay someone that knows exactly what they are doing and will back their own work.

[Warrigul]

There are three Barrel Manufacturers in Australia. Maddco & TSE in Qld then also Tobler in NSW. All have had a reputation as being excellant at one time, are they any good, well that is not open to discussion here as far as I'm concerned as I have not used any of them.

BTW...There is also "True-Flite" Barrels manufactured in New Zealand.

In NSW if you look at the conditions for a Dealers Licence on NSW FAR you will see they are licenced to do any work and manufacture of Firearms / Parts. Are they qualified, that is another question I much doubt is yes from most I have had any dealings with and certainly don't get to touch any of my expensive custom rifles.

As I said, as far as I know to be a Gunsmith in NSW you need to have a Dealers Licence for a start. What happens from there is anyone's guess but I don't deal with any so called Gunsmith unless I have a lot of background information on who they are and what they have experience with. I can use a Lathe but I would not take on the tasks involved with precision custom firearms. I'd rather pay someone that knows exactly what they are doing and will back their own work.

There is using a lathe and using a lathe.

There is nothing on a firearm that is any more difficult than many everyday jobs, for a competent and qualified machinist. I am lucky to have a solid background in industrial equipment and did my time in an engine room where we were expected to look after our own machining.

Whilst I don't generally do work for others, I don't have my own lathe or miller, I have to say that it is very satisfying to win a comp with a rifle that started out as a bare action and a barrel blank personally machined and fitted to a home made stock.

I totally get why kits are so popular with the black powder dudes.

I have used Maddco and TSE barrels and have had no complaints at all. I prefer TSE simply because I have dealt with them the most.

[Apollo]

"Warrigul" Why did you highlight my text and have a go at me...???

Do you have some problem... ??

I don't give one rats what you can do with a Lathe. You asked what it takes to be a Gunsmith.

I also don't care why you posted the Topic. Quite plainly to get a bite.

[Westy]

Popcorn anyone!!!!!!

[Warrigul]

"Warrigul" Why did you highlight my text and have a go at me...???

Do you have some problem... ??

I don't give one rats what you can do with a Lathe. You asked what it takes to be a Gunsmith.

I also don't care why you posted the Topic. Quite plainly to get a bite.

This sort of attitude has seen you booted off forums before L, you are better off not answering at all if you can't be civil.

I am going on a nice week long camping holiday and I would prefer it if you didn't bother replying to my posts in future.

[shooting sports]

From what i understand a firearm dealer is also licensed to manufacture firearms, if you cannot use i lathe i cannot call you a gunsmith.

Not in Queensland. You need to be a licensed "Armourer" to manufacture. A QLD dealer can repair & modify, but not make guns.

[veep]

Same in VIC.

We have different classes of dealer licensing including Class 3 which is

"Only repairing Category A, B, C, D, E longarms, General Category Handguns, Category E Handguns and related parts; and/or"

Get one of those and call yourself a smith I guess?

[cavok]

What makes a gun smith, calling yourself one for starters.

In Victoria from late 1980 till he closed his premises and sold out to the government from memory 6 or 7 years ago the best gunsmith in any pistol work/building and repairing, also rifles was person who came from the building trade, some said he was a chippy, taught himself from what I know, ran a fantastic business and a brilliant pistol shooter.

He traded under RELIC Customs, brilliant and pleasant person, built some of the best semis from scratch for many a year. A few did not like his work, I guess they went elsewhere, most did, nothing was to much for this guy.

I certainly hope one day he will show up again, best there ever was. Not certain but I don't think he had any qualifications, started small, business was good, and in the end his new CNC machine spat out semis and he fixed everything else. I won't mention his name, not my place to do so.

[Lyam]

What makes a gun smith, calling yourself one for starters.

Sounds like a few people I know who buy an expensive camera and hang it around then neck and call themselves "a photographer".

Most had never taken more than a selfie in front of the mirror so far.

Saying it doesn't always make it so.

[Redwood]

It's like the "dress for the job you want and it will happen" mantra.

I'm going to work today as a Cowboy Astronaut

[keen]

cowboy_astronaut_millionaire.jpg (17.35 KiB) Viewed 7237 times

[6mmdasher]

I was told a few years ago that there were only 6 trained gunsmiths in Australia, Keith Hills was one , John Giles another and i think Bill Hallam did training in the USA as well, everyone else are classed as Amourers. There are Four barrel makers in Australia that I know of, Maddco, TSE(Mab) , Tobler and Sprinter Barrels in SA

[cavok]

I was told a few years ago that there were only 6 trained gunsmiths in Australia, Keith Hills was one , John Giles another and i think Bill Hallam did training in the USA as well, everyone else are classed as Amourers. There are Four barrel makers in Australia that I know of, Maddco, TSE(Mab) , Tobler and Sprinter Barrels in SA

The best still lives in Victoria, trades under Muscrat, best revolver gunsmith and semi gunsmith, in rifles there are a few more.

[MeccaOz]

What makes a gunsmith .... Well mate, When a man and a woman love each each other Ahem... Well you know how bee's ... Awww crap I didnt wanna have this talk heres a porn magazine, figure it out .

[Westy]

What makes a gunsmith .... Well mate, When a man and a woman love each each other Ahem... Well you know how bee's ... Awww crap I didnt wanna have this talk heres a porn magazine, figure it out .

Mecca your a nut job, and I like it

[Utcherd]

everyone else are classed as Amourers.

Which means what?

They can store/handle firearms but a trade isn't part of it?