Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Improving and repairing firearms. Rifle bedding, barrel work, stock replacement and other ways to improve your firearms.

Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by Supaduke » 17 May 2018, 1:48 pm

Bit of a read so bare with me.

So I went to the range the other day. Took some modern scoped rifles and some old milsurps out for a relaxed shoot and some load development.

Got some promising results on some adjusted proven loads and some brand new recipes.

Pull out my Howa .308 sporter, Boyds Prairie hunter stock , Nikko Sterling scope. Cheap and cheerful, it usually does a great job.

Over a few uses it just started shooting my handloads like ******. Wandering zero, stringing and general inconsistencies.

It had been in a Hogue stock previously and shot very well.
20180515_211157-1512x1512.jpg
Howa 308
20180515_211157-1512x1512.jpg (469.97 KiB) Viewed 3777 times


I took it home and checked the usual suspects.
Check and reseat action screws
Check and remount scope and rings
Check and remount pic rail
Clean out any fluff, tool marks , burrs etc from stock.
Remount barrelled action and ensure free float.

All screws tightened by hand to a snug tension.

To eliminate the possibility that I rolled a bad batch of ammo I take some factory PPU 150gr SP that I know the rifle usually shoots well.

Rifle still shoots like ******. Put 40 rounds through it and while it had its good moments it averaged somewhere around 5 inches at 100m.

Far from ready to admit defeat, I cleaned and pulled it apart tonight in anticipation of an overhaul and some new parts.

First thing I did before pulling it apart was check that all screws were tight. I nipped up the action screws and one scope mount screw needed a quarter turn, nothing substantial. After tightening, I cycled the bolt and it now one of the locking lugs gently clips the receiver as you cycle it.

20180515_211238-1512x1512.jpg
Stock
20180515_211238-1512x1512.jpg (439.59 KiB) Viewed 3777 times


So we have found the culprit. The stock must not be 100% square as the action is slightly twisting when the action is tightened. I have had a few Boyd's stocks and this is the first time I have run into any really problems.

So I look over at the acraglass bedding kit I bought a while ago and decide it's time to bed this thing. And while I'm at it I will put some pillars into it.

20180515_212614-1512x1512.jpg
Acraglass
20180515_212614-1512x1512.jpg (442.9 KiB) Viewed 3777 times


20180515_212827-1512x1512.jpg
Acraglass contents
20180515_212827-1512x1512.jpg (407.94 KiB) Viewed 3777 times


Never felt the need to bed a rifle before.
Most modern rifles I have owned have already had some degree of pillar bedding. And I've never really had a lemon that couldnt be fixed with some mild tinkering or proper finishing.

I have read plenty of literature and watched lots of videos on the subject of pillar and glass bedding. Everyone has a slightly different take on the subject , and there are several variations of the same theme. They all do essentially the same thing though.

So I am going to document my journey , bedding a rifle for the first time. I will post my results wether they be flawless or fcked up.

First of all though, I would open the floor to any tips or tricks you guys may have learnt. Pitfalls to be wary of. Products you have used and recommend. Products you would not use again etc.
Supaduke
Warrant Officer C2
Warrant Officer C2
 
Posts: 1230
Victoria

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by bigrich » 17 May 2018, 4:01 pm

i haven't bedded a rifle before either. will watch this post with interest
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by Wm.Traynor » 17 May 2018, 7:27 pm

:thumbsup: Just some questions, purely out of curiosity if you wouldn't mind.
Firstly though, that's a pretty shrewd conclusion to draw about the action twisting, especially in view of the meagre clue you had :thumbsup:
Q. What happened to the original bedding to make the action twist? That is a really savage outcome IMO :shock: I say that in view of it being a laminated stock. Those things are not supposed to move, let alone twist actions.

Forgot to add
Put a straight edge on your action; it might be warped and Good Luck :thumbsup:
Wm.Traynor
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1644
Queensland

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by sungazer » 17 May 2018, 7:31 pm

Do it in steps. ie the bottom metal first. Then drill out the holes for the pillars and part glue them in place. Then do the top bedding job. I have seen it all done in one sitting on U tube but when everything is floating and nothing is fixed it is a absolute ...... Putting the pillars in first may be the best starting point but just glue them in at one end so the glass can do the rest of the gluing in .
sungazer
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1525
Other

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by Supaduke » 17 May 2018, 7:55 pm

The conclusion comes from the fact that in the previous stock it cycled flawlessly. With zero tension on action screws the bolt cycles flawlessly. In the new stock with mild tension on the action screws the bolt has a very light bind. Further tightening makes the bolt bind quite badly. Therefore logic would dictate that the action is not sitting square in the new stock, it's twisting ever so slightly as tension is increased on the action screws. Could be something as simple as a little burr I'm not seeing, sitting right in a perfect corner, adding just enough leverage as you tighten it down to induce a twist. I will clean out all the inletting with a Dremel as well as make some holes/divots to anchor the bedding.
Last edited by Supaduke on 17 May 2018, 8:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Supaduke
Warrant Officer C2
Warrant Officer C2
 
Posts: 1230
Victoria

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by Supaduke » 17 May 2018, 8:10 pm

Good to know Sungazer.

I also swapped scopes at some point with no difference.

I am going to turf the pic rail and get some better quality mounts. Never been overly impressed with the legacy pic rail. Fairly soft aluminium and I've noticed it marks and dents easily, doesn't instill confidence.

I figure a decent bedding job can't hurt and an upgrade in optics mounting can't hurt either.
Supaduke
Warrant Officer C2
Warrant Officer C2
 
Posts: 1230
Victoria

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by sungazer » 17 May 2018, 9:56 pm

I did have a similar problem well exactly the same it was only a 22 action in a boyds stock and tightening the action screws would jam the bolt up. it was bending the action and its only soft wood. I was lucky and could send it back.
I have done a bedding job on one of my guns a boyds stock 3-4 times. First I tried it all in one step Arhh s**t. from there I then did the bottom metal. Then I could do the Top. I then later dug out a lot of the top and re did that perhaps twice.
Its tough when you have that big mag hole then you need to make room around the pillars which spills out into the trigger well and mag well.
Good Luck
sungazer
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1525
Other

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by AZZA'S HJ47 » 17 May 2018, 10:45 pm

Just finished doin the same to my howa and m39 rifle the 308 is now a tack driver i used jb weld for mine it was also a rubber over mould. Best advise i can give you is make sure that your chosen release agent is going to work well with the chosen bedding compound. I ended up working out that the lanolin case lube that i made worked better than one shot and boot polish. Scariest part about the whole job is the removal of the action. The rest is easy.
Sako Varmint 243,Marlin 917, Lithgow La101 .22 , 1917 BSA 303 (ted), Finnish Vkt 1944 M39,T3X Super Varmint 223, Marlin 1895 SBL 45-70 Howa 1500 308, BSA CF2 222, 1911 9mm, Adler 12G, Sako 7mm rem Mag,Ruger m77 mk1 22-250AI, Rem 700 17 Rem, BSA No 5 303
User avatar
AZZA'S HJ47
Sergeant
Sergeant
 
Posts: 687
Queensland

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by sungazer » 18 May 2018, 9:39 am

I used JB weld with Lee Lube as the release agent sprinkled graphite just to be sure. worked really well. From what other have said since it appears the JB is a bit runnier than devcon. It still starts to set pretty quick though so you need to be prepared. But then once its all together let it set a day or so other wise thin sections tend to crumble or crack so patience is also key. On the flip side not too long as it is easy to trim when still a bit soft. :unknown:
sungazer
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1525
Other

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by marksman » 18 May 2018, 4:34 pm

the way to check the bedding is, stand the rifle up butt down, holding the forend and barrel with your fingers wrapped around both lightly
undo your king screws one at a time and feel for movment
so while holding undo the front screw and feel for movement from the barrel
do it up snug and undo the rear, feel for movement from the barrel
any movement will mean bad bedding and a bent action when tightened up
you can sometimes see a tang rear end move as you tighten it up with the front done up first
no good for consistency as when the rifle is fired the bent action will snap straight and your barrel will whip differently/inconsistently
“If you do not read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read the newspapers you are misinformed”. Mark Twain
User avatar
marksman
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3660
Victoria

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by Gwion » 20 May 2018, 11:03 pm

Supaduke wrote:The conclusion comes from the fact that in the previous stock it cycled flawlessly. With zero tension on action screws the bolt cycles flawlessly. In the new stock with mild tension on the action screws the bolt has a very light bind. Further tightening makes the bolt bind quite badly. Therefore logic would dictate that the action is not sitting square in the new stock, it's twisting ever so slightly as tension is increased on the action screws. Could be something as simple as a little burr I'm not seeing, sitting right in a perfect corner, adding just enough leverage as you tighten it down to induce a twist. I will clean out all the inletting with a Dremel as well as make some holes/divots to anchor the bedding.


Your screw holes may also not be true. This coukd definitely put twisting torque on the action. Also, the bedding plan may have ever such a slight rise in the middle or a cant or such.

As you say, rough out your inlet by about 1.5mm but don't go over board. You don't want the bedding compound too thin but you also don't want it too thick. I would also wait to do that until you have fit your pillars.
To correct any skew in the screw holes, ream them out as much as possible before fitting your pillars then fit your pillars to thee action by screwing them to it with screws of the same thread as your action screws. Wrap the screws in tape first so that they are centered in the pillars. Apply bedding compound around the pillars and in screw holes. Be sure there is plenty of release agent on action and between pillars and action and pillars and screw heads because you don't want it all sticking together.
Drop the action and gooed up screws into the inlet and fix in place with rubber tubing so it is held firmly inplace with no torque applied. When it goes off, remove screws and action and then go about the full length bedding of the action.

Have fun and take your time and clean everything well as you go. Wear disdposable surgical/food handling gloves and have the box on hand. It will save you spreading compound every frea king where.....
User avatar
Gwion
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3978
-

Re: Bedding a Rifle, A rookie's oddessy.

Post by Supaduke » 21 May 2018, 10:02 am

All good advice. I also have some modelling clay on order from eBay, awaiting delivery.
Supaduke
Warrant Officer C2
Warrant Officer C2
 
Posts: 1230
Victoria


Back to top
 
Return to Gunsmithing