Too much Ammo for gunsafe

[Crankbro]

G’day , I bought a 3 gun safe for my two firearms and the separate ammo box inside is quite small and has quickly become full of ammo. Do I need to buy another approved gunsafe for extra ammo or can I just get a separate normal box safe which is bolted the same way as the gunsafe ? I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter . Thanks

[on_one_wheel]

State rules probably vary but most shooters quickly outgrow their internal ammo bit.

I moved my ammo storage to a large tradesman's toolbox and a single steel locker the box is bricked with powders, primers, primed cases, reloads, .22 ammo and the locker stacks cartons of 12 gauge cartridges nicely with some spare room for ammo belts, slings, scopes and loose bits n pieces.

[deye243]

Western Australia is the king of retarded gun laws somebody from the west will chime in soon because they're a lot more crazy than any other state in the country

[ZaineB]

just get some lockable filing cabinets, looks inconspicuous and boring, put it in them, lock when not accessing them

[bladeracer]

G’day , I bought a 3 gun safe for my two firearms and the separate ammo box inside is quite small and has quickly become full of ammo. Do I need to buy another approved gunsafe for extra ammo or can I just get a separate normal box safe which is bolted the same way as the gunsafe ? I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter . Thanks

WA requires ammunition to be secured the same as firearms, in another approved safe. This includes empty brass and bullets.

[bladeracer]

just get some lockable filing cabinets, looks inconspicuous and boring, put it in them, lock when not accessing them

Not legal in WA.

[Bello]

Hi Mate
When I outgrew my last gun safe and bought a much bigger gun safe, I used the old safe as a loaded ammo safe. I made up some shelves for it and put different calibres on different shelves. All seem rosy....but...
I have now outgrown both
The minister for was and finance will not let me buy another one
I do like what 0n_one_wheel has done

[ZaineB]

just get some lockable filing cabinets, looks inconspicuous and boring, put it in them, lock when not accessing them

Not legal in WA.

did I say put a sign on the front door saying you put it in there?

[bladeracer]

just get some lockable filing cabinets, looks inconspicuous and boring, put it in them, lock when not accessing them

Not legal in WA.

did I say put a sign on the front door saying you put it in there?

That does not make it any less illegal.

[animalpest]

In WA firearms includes ammo. You need both storage areas to comply and is an approved safe bolted down. If you can't fit your ammo in your box inside the safe then you will need a second safe.

I use a second safe.

[Communism_Is_Cancer]

I am sorry but I have to respond to this.

"I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter".

Literally a google search away you can bring up the legislation. WA has an act and a regulation.

[deye243]

I am sorry but I have to respond to this.

"I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter".

Literally a google search away you can bring up the legislation. WA has an act and a regulation.

If you have to respond a link would be nice as the OP may not have very good Google foo

[bladeracer]

I am sorry but I have to respond to this.

"I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter".

Literally a google search away you can bring up the legislation. WA has an act and a regulation.

I think all states have Acts and Regs regarding firearm law.
The Act proclaims the laws _we_ have to comply with.
The Regs explain how the enforcement agency manages the Act.

In fairness to the OP, the WA Police website is pretty vague about this.
Basically 11A1 tells us that firearms _and_ ammunition must be stored according to Schedule 4 of the Regs.

11A8 tells us that firearms must not be stored with ammunition, so it is left to extrapolate that you require two Schedule 4 safes.

11A23A excludes propellants from Schedule 4 requirements, unless it is within ammunition.
Section 4 of the Act defines ammunition to include anything designed to be discharged from a firearm - bullets, wads, shot, slugs, pellets, etc:
"ammunition includes anything manufactured specifically as a component of ammunition designed for discharge from a firearm and also includes any primer or propellant manufactured specifically for use in making ammunition designed for discharge from a firearm but does not include ammunition rendered inoperative for the purpose of a collector’s item;"
Interestingly, brass is not designed to be discharged from a firearm, so unless they've changed something in the Act or Regs, they need to stop prosecuting people for having unsecured brass.

I'm glad I did the search as I hadn't seen 11A(7A), only Police and military can store loaded magazines in WA.

[Farmerpete]

Qld regs are on department of mines site and same as gunpowder and other ordinates if that helps

Although if you get stuck the first response was kinda true (although illegal) if you locked it in a filing cabinet no one would know unless you told them.

[bladeracer]

Qld regs are on department of mines site and same as gunpowder and other ordinates if that helps

Although if you get stuck the first response was kinda true (although illegal) if you locked it in a filing cabinet no one would know unless you told them.

In Qld they have the right to enter private premises to inspect explosives storage though.
But Qld is like all other states except WA, ammo just needs to be locked in a container, not a gun safe.

[Crankbro]

Hi Mate
When I outgrew my last gun safe and bought a much bigger gun safe, I used the old safe as a loaded ammo safe. I made up some shelves for it and put different calibres on different shelves. All seem rosy....but...
I have now outgrown both
The minister for was and finance will not let me buy another one
I do like what 0n_one_wheel has done

Yer that seems like a pretty good idea thanks

[Crankbro]

I am sorry but I have to respond to this.

"I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter".

Literally a google search away you can bring up the legislation. WA has an act and a regulation.

Yer mate that’s pretty obvious . Maybe the way I worded it wasn’t exactly right but what I was looking for was a interpretation of such legislation as previously mentioned it is very vague .

[Crankbro]

G’day , I bought a 3 gun safe for my two firearms and the separate ammo box inside is quite small and has quickly become full of ammo. Do I need to buy another approved gunsafe for extra ammo or can I just get a separate normal box safe which is bolted the same way as the gunsafe ? I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter . Thanks

WA requires ammunition to be secured the same as firearms, in another approved safe. This includes empty brass and bullets.

I wonder if a handgun safe would be sufficient as separate ammo storage ?

[bladeracer]

G’day , I bought a 3 gun safe for my two firearms and the separate ammo box inside is quite small and has quickly become full of ammo. Do I need to buy another approved gunsafe for extra ammo or can I just get a separate normal box safe which is bolted the same way as the gunsafe ? I’m from Western Australia and finding any specific legislation is difficult for this matter . Thanks

WA requires ammunition to be secured the same as firearms, in another approved safe. This includes empty brass and bullets.

I wonder if a handgun safe would be sufficient as separate ammo storage ?

Certainly, but they are generally pretty small.
Mine has access from one end, which is fine for handguns, but it means you pretty much have to pull everything out to find the ammo you want.

Personally, I'd buy a bigger rifle safe, and use your current safe for ammo.

[Downunder]

It’s there at the top of a google search “WA ammunition storage” in B&W.

https://www.police.wa.gov.au/About-Us/Our-Agency/Police-Licensing-Services/Firearms/Firearms-storage

[womble]

WA you are required to store all ammo at a minimum of 500 meters under ground in a pool of tiger sharks. And the entrance must be sealed under a reo-enforced slab of concrete no less than 50 x 50 meters in diameter and 25 meters in height.
Hope this helps, cheers.

[straightshooter]

WA you are required to store all ammo at a minimum of 500 meters under ground in a pool of tiger sharks. And the entrance must be sealed under a reo-enforced slab of concrete no less than 50 x 50 meters in diameter and 25 meters in height.
Hope this helps, cheers.

You forgot the yet to be legislated requirement that every case and projectile be serial numbered and registered.

[JohnV]

I can't see how those ammo storage requirements are consistent with the firearms act . Some areas of the act have clauses that say , something like , " or such requirements as the Commissioner deems appropriate which are consistent with the act .
There is nothing in the act that mentions a separate approved safe for ammo storage for A & B . It mentions for category A & B ammo to be stored separately in a lock up container that is not easily penetrable and for category C a separate lock up area in the approved safe .
That should be taken to court for a legal interpretation by a judge because I think the WA Police Commissioner might be over stepping his authority a least for A & B ammo .

[bladeracer]

I can't see how those ammo storage requirements are consistent with the firearms act . Some areas of the act have clauses that say , something like , " or such requirements as the Commissioner deems appropriate which are consistent with the act .
There is nothing in the act that mentions a separate approved safe for ammo storage for A & B . It mentions for category A & B ammo to be stored separately in a lock up container that is not easily penetrable and for category C a separate lock up area in the approved safe .
That should be taken to court for a legal interpretation by a judge because I think the WA Police Commissioner might be over stepping his authority a least for A & B ammo .

I don't think any state differentiates CatA/B ammo from any other ammo.
You only need a second safe if the bolt box is not big enough for your ammo. You can store ammo in a locked receptacle in the safe, provided it is part of the safe, not a container that can be removed.
Ammunition must be secured in a container that _at least_ meets the requirements of Schedule 4 - the same requirements as for the firearms.

[JohnV]

Again bolt box is not consistent with the firearms act there is no mention of bolt removal , that was in the old act .
NSW you do not have to store category A&B ammo in a safe or approved safe or within the safe . It only has to be in a separate locked container that is not easy penetrable and can be transported that way also . SSAA WA needs to take the Commissioner to court because those extra requirements are not consistent with the act . QLD is the same the Police are still insisting on bolt removal during transport which is not required by the act .

[bladeracer]

Again bolt box is not consistent with the firearms act there is no mention of bolt removal , that was in the old act .
NSW you do not have to store category A&B ammo in a safe or approved safe or within the safe . It only has to be in a separate locked container that is not easy penetrable and can be transported that way also . SSAA WA needs to take the Commissioner to court because those extra requirements are not consistent with the act . QLD is the same the Police are still insisting on bolt removal during transport which is not required by the act .

You do not have to remove the bolt in most states.
What are you talking about CatA/B ammo for, is there another kind of ammo?
Section 11A8 of the regs requires any internal container to be fixed to the safe such that it cannot be removed.

[JohnV]

Yes but is that a Commissioners amendment ? It's not the actual wording of the act ?
However that wording allows separate ammo storage in a cabinet or container as long as no guns are in the container .
No mention of another approved safe for ammo .

[animalpest]

It's the actual wording of the Act.

[ZaineB]

Again bolt box is not consistent with the firearms act there is no mention of bolt removal , that was in the old act .
NSW you do not have to store category A&B ammo in a safe or approved safe or within the safe . It only has to be in a separate locked container that is not easy penetrable and can be transported that way also . SSAA WA needs to take the Commissioner to court because those extra requirements are not consistent with the act . QLD is the same the Police are still insisting on bolt removal during transport which is not required by the act .

You do not have to remove the bolt in most states.
What are you talking about CatA/B ammo for, is there another kind of ammo?
Section 11A8 of the regs requires any internal container to be fixed to the safe such that it cannot be removed.

doesn't say that explicitly, as your own quotation shows, it says cabinet or container and that it needs to be fixed in place securely, it doesn't say safe or vault or anything, nor does it have to be fixed to the safe.

[Oldbloke]

But this link to the WA pol site strongly suggests ammo must be stored in a safe. Lots of confusing info I think. Conflicting info is intentional I think.

https://www.police.wa.gov.au/About-Us/O ... ms-storage

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Schedule 4 seems to describe a safe. But I may be corrected.