Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Game hunting and large prey. Deer stalking, hunting with hounds. Boar, pigs etc., large prey, culling, hunting large feral animals.

Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by ThatBloodyPom » 15 Jun 2018, 1:57 pm

Hi folks,

Got my license last year, and recently got a .22 PCP air rifle. I'm keen to get out and get some bunnies but I have one problem, I don't really have anywhere to go. I'm on a few acres of rural land so I might spot a rabbit every few days, but nothing to keep me occupied. I have the "pest hunting on crown land" ticket, but haven't found a spot in the Wombat SF yet.

Plenty of farm land about, is it worth dropping notes in a few letterboxes? What's a good tactic to convincing local landowners you're just after rabbits, and will be respectful and not be an idiot? I've only been here a few years and don't know many folk to exercise connections. Have a few acquaintances that are into shooting who promised to take me out, but getting them to fulfil that has been difficult.

Used to go out after rabbits with my dad in UK as he was mates with a few farmers, loved it, hoping to relive that here, and introduce my little one when he's old enough :)

Looked into Farmer Assist, but looks like I'd need to do the test before I can see if theres any posted jobs in my area.

I'm in Moorabool, near Ballan / Myrniong
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Daddybang » 15 Jun 2018, 2:07 pm

Find the pub that the locals drink at and go have a beer. Don't of course be to pushy but introduce ya self and have a chat. :thumbsup: :drinks:
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by YoungBuck » 15 Jun 2018, 4:34 pm

ThatBloodyPom wrote:Have a few acquaintances that are into shooting who promised to take me out, but getting them to fulfil that has been difficult.

Yep I've found that this is quite common...


ThatBloodyPom wrote:Looked into Farmer Assist, but looks like I'd need to do the test before I can see if theres any posted jobs in my area.

I'm on farmer assist myself, the number of Vic jobs is VERY low, infact there are none posted right now. Theres plenty of Roo culling requests in NSW and Qld though.

Also you only have to search and read through some of the Wombat SF thread to see how much game/pests people manage to find....usually nothing :violin:
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Jon79 » 15 Jun 2018, 8:26 pm

have found farmers to be very stand offish unless they know you well compared to when I used to shoot a lot 15years ago, many have had fences cut etc by people illegally accessing their property, one place I shoot on has this happen a lot where their property backs on to a back road/track in the scrub,

Another place I shoot on has a lunatic neighbour who rings up and complains whenever he sees a spotlight or hears a shot.... I went out the other night about 6pm shot 2 hares 3km away from his house and was back home by 7.15pm and he had rung up claiming world war 3 was happening lol (I only fired 2 shots) these sorts of things also make it harder

when we used to go out west shooting we would always call in to the pub and have a yarn with the locals and nearly always ended up with a couple extra of properties to shoot on while we were up there....don't get on the piss and be a know it all or dress like a wanker though

The local rural store can be another spot, if you never go there start getting your dog food or something there and during the conversation mention that you'd love to find a property to shoot a few bunnies for the dog or get a few foxes you'd be surprised how often they know someone who has been in complaining about rabbits, foxes etc & when you call them and say so and so from Elders etc said to give them a call most times they'll except their judgment and give you a chance
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Rod_outbak » 18 Jun 2018, 11:52 am

My $2, (As a landholder in Outback QLD...)

We look at any shooters coming onto the property, mostly from the angle of 'Risk Assessment'.

Unless I know the shooter, or have someone known to me who can vouch for the shooter, it's a struggle to let complete strangers come shoot unsupervised.
[And I suspect this is your greatest stumbling block in finding land to shoot on as well.]
Nothing to do with your own skills/intentions as such, but the difficulty the landholder faces in assessing the risk they take by letting you onto their land.

We occasionally get leaflets from people wanting to come shooting and/or pigging on the property, and they mostly end up in the bin.
Until we can be sure the risk of letting someone onto the place, it's not worth it.

In decades past, we didnt have things like 'Farm Biosecurity', 'Duty of care', 'Livestock Production Assurance', and other crap to deal with, so it was a bit easier to make the call.

Some of the risks the landholder faces are:
- Risk of shooters not understanding where they can & cant shoot on the property.
- Risk of shooters leaving behind rubbish or potential contaminants.
- Risk of shooters bringing mates along, and them not having been inducted into what the landholder wants from the shooters.
- Risk of shooters having a completely different set of ideas on whats acceptable when shooting on the property.
- Risks of unknown visitors crossing the country where the shooters are operating (like electricity authority, and a few clueless Govt types).
- Risk of lambing ewes being mis-mothered due to someone wandering(and/or shooting) through them.
- Risk of livestock being hit by gunfire.
- Risk of critical infrastructure like tanks, troughs and/or buildings being hit by gunfire.
- Risk of offending/upsetting neighbours as a result of gunfire near their house.
- Risk of gates being left open, and/or fences being opened up for access.
- Risk of shooters not understanding the legal issues when shooting near/from/over public land (eg: public roads)
- Risk of shooters not having the same values when it comes to shooting wildlife (ferals and/or some of the local animals)

And YES; ALL of the above have been issues for us in the past. For some of them, more than once.
I also appreciate that the OP was talking about access to an open paddock or two to simply pokk some bunnies, which is a much smaller scale than what I'm talking about. Some of the above issues arent going to translate to smaller farm ing areas, but many will.

Now, ALL of the above risks are vastly reduced IF we have a person who can spend a little time with us, and get the run-down on how we want anyone to operate. Every property in our area operates notably differently to us, so the shooter needs to understand our operations.
We have detailed maps of the property, and we give shooters as much detail as possible about how & where we want them to operate.
The problem is; we simply dont have the time or resources to vet every person who drops a leaflet in the mailbox, or calls in to see us off the road.
Thats why having someone we know introduce (& vouch for) the shooter, gives us something of an idea on how much we can trust the shooter will follow our directions.

In our case, we have 2 registered roo-shooters, and 3 groups of hunters who regularly visit during most years, for a week or so of pokking.
We also have some family and friends who visit, who also might do a spot of pokking, but usually they will be accompanied by one of us.
But none of these people were casual drop-ins; they were all known to us, or had someone who could vouch for them.

Thats one major benefit of the 'Farmer Assist' program; it gives the landholder some sort of vetting process in taking the risk.
[And No; I'm NOT a participant in Farmer Assist, but I can see the benefit of such a program. If we werent in year 7 of the worst drought in creation, I'd consider participating..]
I know I'm not offering much in the way of solutions in how to secure land to shoot on, but if you understand a bit about the landholders side of things; maybe it helps you formulate a way of making contact?

As I said; My $2.

Cheers,

Rod.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by YoungBuck » 18 Jun 2018, 6:55 pm

Interesting take on things. Thanks for sharing.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Bent Arrow » 18 Jun 2018, 8:26 pm

Rod_outbak wrote:My $2, (As a landholder in Outback QLD...)

We look at any shooters coming onto the property, mostly from the angle of 'Risk Assessment'.

Unless I know the shooter, or have someone known to me who can vouch for the shooter, it's a struggle to let complete strangers come shoot unsupervised.
[And I suspect this is your greatest stumbling block in finding land to shoot on as well.]
Nothing to do with your own skills/intentions as such, but the difficulty the landholder faces in assessing the risk they take by letting you onto their land.

We occasionally get leaflets from people wanting to come shooting and/or pigging on the property, and they mostly end up in the bin.
Until we can be sure the risk of letting someone onto the place, it's not worth it.

In decades past, we didnt have things like 'Farm Biosecurity', 'Duty of care', 'Livestock Production Assurance', and other crap to deal with, so it was a bit easier to make the call.

Some of the risks the landholder faces are:
- Risk of shooters not understanding where they can & cant shoot on the property.
- Risk of shooters leaving behind rubbish or potential contaminants.
- Risk of shooters bringing mates along, and them not having been inducted into what the landholder wants from the shooters.
- Risk of shooters having a completely different set of ideas on whats acceptable when shooting on the property.
- Risks of unknown visitors crossing the country where the shooters are operating (like electricity authority, and a few clueless Govt types).
- Risk of lambing ewes being mis-mothered due to someone wandering(and/or shooting) through them.
- Risk of livestock being hit by gunfire.
- Risk of critical infrastructure like tanks, troughs and/or buildings being hit by gunfire.
- Risk of offending/upsetting neighbours as a result of gunfire near their house.
- Risk of gates being left open, and/or fences being opened up for access.
- Risk of shooters not understanding the legal issues when shooting near/from/over public land (eg: public roads)
- Risk of shooters not having the same values when it comes to shooting wildlife (ferals and/or some of the local animals)

And YES; ALL of the above have been issues for us in the past. For some of them, more than once.
I also appreciate that the OP was talking about access to an open paddock or two to simply pokk some bunnies, which is a much smaller scale than what I'm talking about. Some of the above issues arent going to translate to smaller farm ing areas, but many will.

Now, ALL of the above risks are vastly reduced IF we have a person who can spend a little time with us, and get the run-down on how we want anyone to operate. Every property in our area operates notably differently to us, so the shooter needs to understand our operations.
We have detailed maps of the property, and we give shooters as much detail as possible about how & where we want them to operate.
The problem is; we simply dont have the time or resources to vet every person who drops a leaflet in the mailbox, or calls in to see us off the road.
Thats why having someone we know introduce (& vouch for) the shooter, gives us something of an idea on how much we can trust the shooter will follow our directions.

In our case, we have 2 registered roo-shooters, and 3 groups of hunters who regularly visit during most years, for a week or so of pokking.
We also have some family and friends who visit, who also might do a spot of pokking, but usually they will be accompanied by one of us.
But none of these people were casual drop-ins; they were all known to us, or had someone who could vouch for them.

Thats one major benefit of the 'Farmer Assist' program; it gives the landholder some sort of vetting process in taking the risk.
[And No; I'm NOT a participant in Farmer Assist, but I can see the benefit of such a program. If we werent in year 7 of the worst drought in creation, I'd consider participating..]
I know I'm not offering much in the way of solutions in how to secure land to shoot on, but if you understand a bit about the landholders side of things; maybe it helps you formulate a way of making contact?

As I said; My $2.

Cheers,

Rod.



Thanks Rod, I think this is worth way more than $2. Some great insights here for people who have had little exposure to the issues that farmers have to take into account when deciding to/not to grant access to someone they don't know from a bar of soap.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Oldbloke » 18 Jun 2018, 9:52 pm

What else would we expect a farmer to do. He is trusting a stranger with a firearm on his property. He is naturally going to be cautious. He would be nuts to be anything else.

And if he’s had a few bad experiences expect him to be even more risk adverse.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by wanneroo » 19 Jun 2018, 11:23 am

I think Rod pretty much put down the definitive post on this. Not much more I could add.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by southwest shooter » 19 Jun 2018, 1:30 pm

Drive a huge 4wd and make sure you wear cammo gear , that should work.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Jon79 » 19 Jun 2018, 1:36 pm

southwest shooter wrote:Drive a huge 4wd and make sure you wear cammo gear , that should work.


yep and best to turn up at night with all 34 driving lights on so they can see you
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by BRNO_Bigot » 19 Jun 2018, 4:34 pm

Jon79 wrote:
southwest shooter wrote:Drive a huge 4wd and make sure you wear cammo gear , that should work.


yep and best to turn up at night with all 34 driving lights on so they can see you



With your pig dogs hanging out and barking and picking fights with the farm dogs, while you guzzle a few stubbies.

Yup, that'll work ;)
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Gwion » 19 Jun 2018, 7:09 pm

BRNO_Bigot wrote:
Jon79 wrote:
southwest shooter wrote:Drive a huge 4wd and make sure you wear cammo gear , that should work.


yep and best to turn up at night with all 34 driving lights on so they can see you



With your pig dogs hanging out and barking and picking fights with the farm dogs, while you guzzle a few stubbies.

Yup, that'll work ;)


Don't forget to tell them what a great bloke you are and such an awesome shot and how you can drop pigs from 150m standing freehand...
Then seal the deal by chucking your stubby out the window as you head down the driveway.....
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 19 Jun 2018, 8:33 pm

Hmm I don't drink but that's good suggestion, thanks gwion
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Gwion » 19 Jun 2018, 8:50 pm

:D no worries, Ziad.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 19 Jun 2018, 9:49 pm

Hahahaha
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by madang55 » 20 Jun 2018, 7:44 pm

Have a look at the Vic Police website. There is a link for an application to shoot rabbits etc on crown land. You fill in the form and they send you the permission and location. That's the gist of it anyway.
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by Stix » 20 Jun 2018, 10:24 pm

Gwion wrote:
BRNO_Bigot wrote:
Jon79 wrote:
southwest shooter wrote:Drive a huge 4wd and make sure you wear cammo gear , that should work.


yep and best to turn up at night with all 34 driving lights on so they can see you



With your pig dogs hanging out and barking and picking fights with the farm dogs, while you guzzle a few stubbies.

Yup, that'll work ;)


Don't forget to tell them what a great bloke you are and such an awesome shot and how you can drop pigs from 150m standing freehand...
Then seal the deal by chucking your stubby out the window as you head down the driveway.....


I cant help but point out the 3 most important first impression trust gainers you've all forgotten...

*Ensure you have a stupidly big rambo knife strapped to your leg & a back-up knife poorly concealed on the inside of other ankle,
*Have a few loaded mags clipped to your belt
*& flick your cigarette butt off somewhere..anywhere... :thumbsup:
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by PaddyT » 21 Jun 2018, 8:21 am

ask them if they have any "wild cows" you can shoot
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Re: Tips for getting permissions from land owners?

Post by southwest shooter » 28 Jun 2018, 12:05 pm

Out shooting a few bunnies yesterday , while packing up I spy a cockie doing abit of fencing across the road .
I wander over and say gday , next thing I know I've scored another property to hunt on , stoked !
Moral of the story , ask and you may receive .
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