Nice test of different bullet designs.

[bladeracer]

This popped up in my feed yesterday.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGhKnwE45OE
German guy testing bullets at different velocities.

[Oldbloke]

Good video, thx BR

[bladeracer]

Good video, thx BR

It popped up in my feed so I downloaded it during the night. I watched it just now but it was in German. I didn't understand much of what was said but a lot of it was evident just in the video and pics so I thought it was worth sharing. I searched for it to get a link and it came up in English, I don't know where I got the German version from

[Oldbloke]

All it really showed was.

Don't eat up too close to the holes.

He is correct, foetus and those under say,,,18 are at most risk. The younger the higher the risk.

It's really only the smallest (microscopic) fragments of lead that can do you harm by eating.

Unless you eat contaminated meat weekly,,, go back to sleep.

He didn't mention that your body/liver/kidney are constantly removing toxins from your body, including lead.

[Tinker]

That was a frightening amount of lead left behind in the carcass, some of it a long way from the entry & exit holes, and that was only the fragments large enough to show up on xray. No doubt there are many more microscopic fragments.
A study done last year of venison samples showed that over 50% of them exceeded the Australian food standard for lead contamination. See https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10104915/. Interestingly kangaroo meat didn't contain any lead, presumably because they were head shot.
Lead isn't easily removed from the body by the kidneys or liver - it's stored mostly in the bones and leaches out slowly. The damage it causes occurs very slowly, which is why younger people are more at risk.
Whether lead bullets are an actual health hazard to hunters is still open to debate, as it hasn't been well studied.
I use jacketed bullets for culling ferals, but will only use monolithic copper bullets for harvesting game.

[on_one_wheel]

I don't eat any part of the head, it's safe to say I don't eat any lead.

[bladeracer]

That was a frightening amount of lead left behind in the carcass, some of it a long way from the entry & exit holes, and that was only the fragments large enough to show up on xray. No doubt there are many more microscopic fragments.
A study done last year of venison samples showed that over 50% of them exceeded the Australian food standard for lead contamination. See https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10104915/. Interestingly kangaroo meat didn't contain any lead, presumably because they were head shot.
Lead isn't easily removed from the body by the kidneys or liver - it's stored mostly in the bones and leaches out slowly. The damage it causes occurs very slowly, which is why younger people are more at risk.
Whether lead bullets are an actual health hazard to hunters is still open to debate, as it hasn't been well studied.
I use jacketed bullets for culling ferals, but will only use monolithic copper bullets for harvesting game.

I certainly wouldn't call it frightening, it's just lead. I'm probably exposed to hundreds of times more lead in loading cast ammo and shooting hundreds of rounds of .22LR every week. People that fish regularly are probably handling lead all the time as well. In fact, I have a variety of bullets in my pockets and on my desk all the time that I pick up, and I have thousands of cast bullets in boxes at my feet and on the desk beside me where I reload.

Yes, lead is an issue in young kids, so you have to use your common sense, but it's not something you need to be frightened of. This little handful of lead on my desk was in my pocket for weeks, the coiled stuff is a sample of leadlighting lead I carry to show people in case they're interested in getting some for themselves.

[bladeracer]

I don't eat any part of the head, it's safe to say I don't eat any lead.

Precisely, head shoot the animal if you're that worried about lead, but I do still find the bullet and fragments some distance down the neck.

[Oldbloke]

BR is correct. It's woke garbage.

There is so much misinformation on the www about "toxic" substances it makes me sick.
People read crap on the www repeat it "assuming" it's correct and think they are experts.

The data that is quoted is worst possible scenarios. Usually for people who work with lead 40 hours a week. It simply is a gross exaggeration of the risk to the average hunter.
If what is talked about by the GMA and others was true I would have died of lead poisoning years ago or be in a clinic with brain damage. Handled lead sinkers Eaten heaps of #5 lead pellets.

How many contaminated steaks did you think you have eaten over the last year, my bet is SFA. Because we remove most of the contaminated meat when we butcher it, that's why. And you might eat contaminated meat monthly, not daily.

The reason lead is dangerous is because it effects the CNS, bones have little to do with it.
And the foetus and young are at risk because the brain is still growing. Much less risk to adults.

The SSAA, Field and Game and a few o t hers need to get together and hire a UN-BIAS biologist or hygienists and put this garbage to bed for good.

Don't rely on the internet, it's full of exaggerated crap.

[Oldbloke]

"Lead isn't easily removed from the body by the kidneys or liver - it's stored mostly in the bones and leaches out slowly."

Rubbish.

In industry where people are exposed to lead for 40 hrs a week (or more) if after testing the blood level of lead is over the legal limit, they are moved to a work area where the exposure is much lower or zero. After a few months they go back to working with lead. WHY, because the bodies natural systems have lowered the Pb blood level to near zero.
That my friend is fact.

I'll repeat, foetus and children are at significant risk, adults are not.

How do you avoid Pb poisoning.
If your melting lead, simply do it in a well ventilated area such as under a verandah of open doors and windows if doing it in a shed.

If you are a fisherman, simply wash your hands before eating or smoking after handling sinkers.

If your a hunter, simply do not take home any bruised, or in anyway damaged meat, bury it or leave it for the feral dogs and foxes.

If like me you eat rabbits or duck with pellets, same applies remove pellets and bruised meat.

My father just about lived of shot (12g) and ferreted rabbit when he was a kid. Lived to 92, and was as sharp as a tack up till he was 91.

OR, as suggested head shoot.

If the goverment was fair dinkum about our health they would ban tomorrow;
Alcohol
Petrol
Diesel
Salt
McDonalds
KFC
Swimming.
Yacht races to Hobart. What's the average, 1 a year?
Cars abt 1200 a year.
Trucks
Living on the street
Any work almost 300 a year die at work every year.


HOW MANY HUNTERS HAVE DIED OR BEEN HOSPITALISED DUE TO EATING CONTAMINATED MEAT?

Name 1 or even 2 documented cases.

Casting lead bullets may be different tho.

And just to add, life is full of risks, if you decide to go spear fishing and are attacked by a shark,,, it's stiff sh1t. Nobody talks about banning spear fishing.

But if 1 eagle dies it's ban all lead bullets.

But if I decide to risk a bit of lead in my food the government wants to save me. Well I call BULL s**t. If I decide to take that risk, it's my arse.

[Tinker]

Woke garbage, is it? Sounds like you've eaten one too many of your #5 shot.
Paint companies used to downplay the dangers of lead in their paint, as did the fuel companies in the 70's with their leaded fuel.
Like I said, whether the amount of residual lead in a deer carcass is a health hazard or not hasn't been well studied. I cast my own bullets and reload most of my own ammo, but I always try to minimise my exposure to lead by casting outdoors and washing my hands after reloading.
Lead is toxic, whether you think that's 'woke' or not. Minimising your exposure to lead isn't 'woke', it's just smart.

[Oldbloke]

Woke garbage, is it? Sounds like you've eaten one too many of your #5 shot.
Paint companies used to downplay the dangers of lead in their paint, as did the fuel companies in the 70's with their leaded fuel.
Like I said, whether the amount of residual lead in a deer carcass is a health hazard or not hasn't been well studied. I cast my own bullets and reload most of my own ammo, but I always try to minimise my exposure to lead by casting outdoors and washing my hands after reloading.
Lead is toxic, whether you think that's 'woke' or not. Minimising your exposure to lead isn't 'woke', it's just smart.

That's right, minimise your exposure. Because that is all that's required. That's because the woke crews exaggerate the risk.

Did you know that suicide by panadol is the latest. Has it been removed from the shelves,,,,nope. BTW this is very old news.

BTW the benzene in petrol is carcinogenic, hold your breath or stand up wind when you next fill up.

Exhaust fumes/particulates from diesel,, ,, class 1 carcinogenic. (IIRC) Hold your breath when you next walk the dog mate.

We are living with toxic and carcinogenic substances every day mate.

There are far greater risks in life than a bit of lead.

I'll climb down from the soap box now.

[bladeracer]

Lead is toxic, whether you think that's 'woke' or not. Minimising your exposure to lead isn't 'woke', it's just smart.

Lead is certainly toxic, but the symptoms are minor and easily dealt with. It's not toxic in that it is likely to kill you or give you cancer. It's probably far less toxic than tobacco, caffeine, sugar, alcohol, gasoline or a great many other things that people use excessively every day.

[Oldbloke]

Lead is toxic, whether you think that's 'woke' or not. Minimising your exposure to lead isn't 'woke', it's just smart.

Lead is certainly toxic, but the symptoms are minor and easily dealt with. It's not toxic in that it is likely to kill you or give you cancer. It's probably far less toxic than tobacco, caffeine, sugar, alcohol, gasoline or a great many other things that people use excessively every day.

Spot On BR

I missed sugar and tobacco. Silly me.

What most don't get is its about how much is absorbed by the body. (the dose over time) And that varies greatly depending on:

How it enters the body, breathing, mouth/digestion, skin, eyes.
In what form, vapour, fumes, dust or large particles
Chemistry, Pb, oxide, and a few others.
How often
And how much.


And lead paint was banned not because it was particularly hazardous to the average person. Although when sanding it, would have been hazardous to health im sure, particularly if you did it regularly such as a professional painter might.

It was teething toddlers who were chewing on lead painted cots for weeks on end. Causing life time CNS damage such as low IQ.