Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

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Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by melanie » 13 Jan 2015, 8:46 am

Hi guys,

I'm looking at some compact hunting rifles. At the moment the Ruger Scout or Compact which both have the 16.5" barrel, but not set on Ruger. Just using as examples. Anyway...

Barrels that short, great for moving around but how is the accuracy? Between the 2 they come in .243, 7mm and .308, all for hunting med-larger game.

Can I expect enough accuracy out of one of these for shooting something rabbit size at 100m? Foxes at 200m?

Thanks guys.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 13 Jan 2015, 9:35 am

Melanie. Don't know about those particular rifles; have read varying reports. But the short answer for your "short barrel accuracy" is yes, you can get a short barrel to shoot very well indeed.

There will be some drops in velocity depending on cartridge but that comes down to knowing your platform and where it shoots at what ranges.

For example: my first centerfire was/is a 223rem Howa heavy barrel. Trigger done, new stock, bedded, one piece scope mount and entry level scope (sub $300). Also shortened the barrel by about 6inches from 24" to around 18" or so. With out too much trying on my part that rifle can shoot 3-5 rounds at 0.6" @ 100m. Best i have done is 0.4" @ 100m. Buying and customising the rifle (no scope) cost me around $800.

Have fun and be safe shooting.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Chronos » 13 Jan 2015, 10:24 am

Perfect timing Melanie, I'm looking at options for my wife at the moment so i've been gathering info on this topic

My wife is 5'3", close enough to average height for woman but most rifles are too long and front heavy for her. I looking at the rifles below as an option for her as well as some timber stocked guns i can cut the stock down to bring the length of pull closer to what suits her. Length of pull it the distance from the butt plate (shoulder) to the trigger. I'll update with length of pull measurements when i get them

Rifle Cartridge Overall length Barrel length Length of pull Weight Kg
CZ Classic 223 1025 555 320 2.70 CZ 527 full length for comparison
CZ Carbine 223 950 470 320 2.70
Tikka Hunter 223 1080 570 3.10 T3 full length for comparison
Tikka lite 223 1080 570 3.10
Tikka Lite MT 223 1020 510 3.00 T3 lite with 20" barrel, not much weight saving there
Savage Axis 223 1114 558 2.95
Savage Youth 223 1016 508 2.80
Ruger Compact 223 902 420 2.84
Vangard youth 223 987 508 317 3.07 As heavy as a T3 lite???

Tikka do make a T3 compact with a short buttstock but it's special order here with a 6-8 month wait, I reckon they'd sell heaps if they brought them in

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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Baronvonrort » 13 Jan 2015, 12:32 pm

The shortest I would go would be 20 inch barrel.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 13 Jan 2015, 12:42 pm

Baronvonrort wrote:The shortest I would go would be 20 inch barrel.


:thumbsup:
Me too, if and when i do it again. My barrel is too short to take with me when i visit the home country in NE Victoria. 20" is minimum barrel length there, i believe. Too bad because i was looking forward to knocking some foxes on a mates property and then realised i'd shortened my barrel too much so can only take my .22lr.
:unknown:
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by cruze82 » 13 Jan 2015, 1:28 pm

Gwion wrote:
Baronvonrort wrote:The shortest I would go would be 20 inch barrel.


:thumbsup:
Me too, if and when i do it again. My barrel is too short to take with me when i visit the home country in NE Victoria. 20" is minimum barrel length there, i believe. Too bad because i was looking forward to knocking some foxes on a mates property and then realised i'd shortened my barrel too much so can only take my .22lr.
:unknown:



really is this true :?:
can any one else confirm this if so I might have to think about taking a different rifle on a hunting trip later this year
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 13 Jan 2015, 2:32 pm

Mate, trying to find the regs to clarify; without much luck. I have been told this by Vic shooters previously, though when discussing carbines etc.

Would also appreciate if anyone can point to the regulations that state allowable barrel lengths for Cat A&B rifles in Victoria.

Cheers.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by North East » 13 Jan 2015, 2:43 pm

Gwion wrote:Mate, trying to find the regs to clarify; without much luck. I have been told this by Vic shooters previously, though when discussing carbines etc.

Would also appreciate if anyone can point to the regulations that state allowable barrel lengths for Cat A&B rifles in Victoria.

Cheers.


The Ruger Gunsite Scout has a barrel length of 16"-18". They are legal in Victoria. So your mate got it wrong.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by 1290 » 13 Jan 2015, 2:52 pm

Dont misunderstand the regs guys.... the Firearms Act section 134 prohibits you reducing the barrel length to less than 50cm (19.68inches) or overall length of 75cm.

My understanding is that a licensed smith CAN reduce the barrel to less than 50cm provided the overall length complies.....

Note you can purchase cat B rifles with short barrels in Vic provided the o/a length is compliant - Eg. Ruger Scout 16.1 and 18.7"... etc etc

Come to vic with your shorties guys, its ok.... :drinks:
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by cruze82 » 13 Jan 2015, 3:20 pm

Glad that got cleared up had me worried for a moment there
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 13 Jan 2015, 4:55 pm

That's great news! Looking forward to bringing the compact Howa over for some fox and maybe dog action!

Sorry to have confused things and thanks for clarifying! :D
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by North East » 13 Jan 2015, 5:15 pm

Gwion wrote:That's great news! Looking forward to bringing the compact Howa over for some fox and maybe dog action!

Sorry to have confused things and thanks for clarifying! :D


Bring a .30cal get a Game Licence for Deer (Stalking) and chase deer.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by North East » 13 Jan 2015, 5:21 pm

North East wrote:
Gwion wrote:That's great news! Looking forward to bringing the compact Howa over for some fox and maybe dog action!

Sorry to have confused things and thanks for clarifying! :D


Bring a .30cal get a Game Licence for Deer (Stalking) and chase deer.


I'm going up to Mt Hotham tomorrow for a few days chasing deer. I'll let you know what's around....if it stops raining. Wild dogs are still an issue up there particularly around Dinner Plain.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by mausermate » 13 Jan 2015, 9:27 pm

just be reminded that short barrels generally give an increase in recoil, increase in muzzle blast and reduction in velocity. Accuracy is generally not the major issue.
Now that's been said, who's coming for a shot?
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 14 Jan 2015, 8:29 am

mausermate wrote:just be reminded that short barrels generally give an increase in recoil, increase in muzzle blast and reduction in velocity. Accuracy is generally not the major issue.


Good point. That is all true.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 14 Jan 2015, 8:33 am

North East wrote:
North East wrote:
Gwion wrote:That's great news! Looking forward to bringing the compact Howa over for some fox and maybe dog action!

Sorry to have confused things and thanks for clarifying! :D


Bring a .30cal get a Game Licence for Deer (Stalking) and chase deer.


I'm going up to Mt Hotham tomorrow for a few days chasing deer. I'll let you know what's around....if it stops raining. Wild dogs are still an issue up there particularly around Dinner Plain.


I'd be keen to know what's floating around Hotham area. Got a few mates who live in the upper Ovens area.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Baronvonrort » 14 Jan 2015, 12:51 pm

Check out the Tikka tac and super varmint with 20 inch barrels, they have a muzzle thread for a brake as well.

I would go Tikka over Ruger.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Tiiger » 14 Jan 2015, 1:01 pm

Be aware barrel profile will play a bit part in short barrel accuracy.

A short bull barrel (e.g. Rem 700 SPS Tactical) will be more accurate than something like a sporter profile barrelled Ruger.

Just so you're comparing apples and apples when looking at short barrel accuracy.
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by squirrelhunter » 14 Jan 2015, 1:06 pm

Gwion wrote:Mate, trying to find the regs to clarify; without much luck. I have been told this by Vic shooters previously, though when discussing carbines etc.


I know the Scout is responsible for some of this confusion.

You may recall the US version has the 16.5" barrel, but they had to release an 'Inernational' version that has the 18" barrel.

Some jumped to the conclusion on this that the barrel length was the reason the US version wasn't allowed, but it was actually due to the threaded barrel and flash hider not being able to be shipped out due to US ITAR regs.

They've since done a 16.5" barrel version with a different thread for international markets and they're sold here at that length :)
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by Gwion » 16 Jan 2015, 7:41 am

Here you go Melanie.

My rifle with 17.5" barrel.

shortened-mag-1.jpg
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And a couple of groups it shot yesterday (at 100m in 10Mph changeable wind) while starting load development for a new powder. The second and 6th groups shot for this new powder/case/seating depth combo.
BM8208-test-02.jpg
BM8208-test-02.jpg (153.05 KiB) Viewed 4083 times


BM8208-test-06.jpg
BM8208-test-06.jpg (149.56 KiB) Viewed 4083 times


Shorties can shoot OK! :thumbsup: :drinks:
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by dorpel » 16 Jan 2015, 12:00 pm

squirrelhunter wrote:Some jumped to the conclusion on this that the barrel length was the reason the US version wasn't allowed, but it was actually due to the threaded barrel and flash hider not being able to be shipped out due to US ITAR regs.

They've since done a 16.5" barrel version with a different thread for international markets and they're sold here at that length :)


All because it had the same thread as a M16 or something so treated like a military firearm.

That's Australian gun control logic right there. :thumbsdown:
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Re: Compact hunting rifle accuracy and ranges

Post by melanie » 16 Jan 2015, 12:01 pm

Gwion wrote:My rifle with 17.5" barrel.


Shooting like that would make me a happy girl :D :drinks:
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