300AAC be used to hunt deer in Victoria?

[flashman]

Hi all just a quick question, can I use a 300 black out on sambar in Victoria, got imformation on cal and bullet weight, can't get a yes or no on the 300 AAC.......ok thanks

[pete1]

Yes you can use it as long as projectile weight of 130 grains and over for Sambar, Rusa and Red Deer and projectile weight of 80 grains and over for Hog, Fallow and Chital Deer.

In Vic we need a deer permit to hunt deer in state forests. Private property you know longer need deer permit to hunt deer, but I'm pretty sure you must still use correct caliber.

Info here
http://www.gma.vic.gov.au/hunting/deer/hunting-methods

[Oldbloke]

Yes it is legal for all species. They dropped the requirement of a minimum 2" case a few years ago. This restriction meant that the minimum you could use was the 30-30.

I think that 2" minimum was sensible. But due to the short magnums will not change now.

Looking at the 300aac it is moving a 150 gr projectile about 200 fps slower than the 30-30. (1900fps) So I think it would be ok for fallow and for well placed shots perhaps reds.

But I think it is way too small for sambar. (IMHO) I know people will say its all about placement, but in reality sambar opportunities don't come often and the shots taken are not normally in ideal conditions. They are a lot bigger too.
I carried a 30-30 for a few years unsuccessfully chasing sambar and never saw anyone else with one. I now use a 30-06 and it does the job fine.
Popular calibres are, 308, 30-06, 270, and you still occasionally see a 303 or 8x57. You then start looking at magnums. These calibres are popular for good reason.

If your interested in chasing sambar perhaps borrow something bigger for the first few trips then if still interested buy one of the above, or bigger.

[flashman]

Ok thanks for the imformation, need a cal with less kick a/c broken shoulder , the 30/06 will be up for sale , tried reduce loads all to no advail , good my .223 rem ok to shoot hence the 300 AAC , will do a bit more research on the 300 , only gun manufacturer I can get here is the ruger ranch rifle......

[Mr.Seacucumber]

Can you? Yes. Should you? Probably not.

[flashman]

Don't get me wrong 30/06 top round very versatile...lt sits at 23 to 25 foot pounds , got look up 300 AAC for its poundage???

[flashman]

Why not open to suggestions !!

[juststarting]

Load down 308 with a 150gr bullet and get a good recoil bad.

[flashman]

K.....308 win sounds like a plan, what foot pounds are we looking at ???

[flashman]

Wife just put her 2 cents in , learn to shoot left handed .........

[Lorgar]

K.....308 win sounds like a plan, what foot pounds are we looking at ???

Some recoil guidelines here: http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm

30-06 / 150gr - 17.5 lbs
30-06 / 180gr - 20.1 lbs

.308 / 150gr - 15.8 lbs
.308 / 165gr - 18.1 lbs

300 AAC / 125gr - Not listed but I think it's about 6 lbs off the top of my head.

Ok thanks for the imformation, need a cal with less kick a/c broken shoulder , the 30/06 will be up for sale , tried reduce loads all to no advail , good my .223 rem ok to shoot hence the 300 AAC , will do a bit more research on the 300 , only gun manufacturer I can get here is the ruger ranch rifle......

I'm no fan of recoil either.

(Post broken collar bone in significant car accident.)

Bit of a segue here, but have you considered a 7mm-08?

Legal for all here, calibre wise.

I shoot 120gr and 140gr Nosler Ballistic tip in mine. The 120gr for range run, pests and small game. The 140gr for the big 3 deer.

Recoil from the above table is:

7mm-08 Rem. / 120gr - 12.1 lbs
7mm-08 Rem. / 140gr - 12.6 lbs

As you can see, about 30% less recoil than the 30-06 depending on your load.

Critically though I would say, is the much better range and performance at distance than the 300 AAC.

At 200m your talking 1,700 ft lb energy on target from the 140gr 7mm, vs I think about 550 ft lbs from the 300 AAC.

[Dexer]

I carried a 30-30 for a few years unsuccessfully chasing sambar and never saw anyone else with one. I now use a 30-06 and it does the job fine.

IMO anything including a 30-30 and above in terms of down range energy at the typical shot range is fine. I wouldn't ever use 300AAC on sambar. As already stated if the .308 upwards are too recoil heavy, consider the 7mm08.

For the record there's been plenty of Sambar taken with 30-30 .

[flashman]

K guys been running the numbers, your wright , 308 looks the minimum cal I'll just work up some reduced loads for what I won't it to do ....

[yoshie]

What about 6.8 spc?

[Dexer]

What about 6.8 spc?

Can't speak for the smaller deer variety but definitely not on sambar.

Check here: http://www.gma.vic.gov.au/hunting/deer/hunting-methods

[flashman]

Well bugger me , didn't think of the stock !! Mine is synthetic and very light , Boyds wooden stock , I wonder how much recoil it would absorb,any guesses???

[Oldbloke]

It might not be the best for hunting, ie carrying for a long time. However a good way to reduce recoil is put a heavier barrel on or just more mass in the gun, Really makes a big difference. Best not to use a Monte Carlo stock as well that will make it recoil up as well perhaps giving you a wack in the eye with scope.

Correct. Perhaps load back a 308 or 30-06 to somewhere between 308 & 30-30 (150.gr proj at about 2400 FPS) then add about 1 kg of lead shot into the stock.
I think that would be OK for sambar out to about 100 metres. About 90% are shot under that distance.

"I wonder how much recoil it would absorb,any guesses??? A kg of lead will reduce it heaps.

[Oldbloke]

www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm

[flashman]

Well thanks for all your input , ok (1) new weapon, or(2) restock 30/06 with a Boyds , with reduced loads,well I've got a starting point,
...hope I can for mine.

[bladeracer]

K.....308 win sounds like a plan, what foot pounds are we looking at ???

Some recoil guidelines here: http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm

30-06 / 150gr - 17.5 lbs
30-06 / 180gr - 20.1 lbs

.308 / 150gr - 15.8 lbs
.308 / 165gr - 18.1 lbs

300 AAC / 125gr - Not listed but I think it's about 6 lbs off the top of my head.

The point of 300BLK is big heavy slugs at low velocities, like 220gn at 1000fps for 2.5lbs of recoil energy.
I wouldn't be using it on deer, certainly not Sambar.

I have a very messed up shoulder so I get why you wouldn't enjoy shooting 30-'06 off the bench, but for hunting deer how many shots do you plan to take? Put a shoulder pad in your jacket, put a fat recoil pad on the rifle, and take the shot.
https://enoughgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6560&p=99772#p99772

I suffer most from the shotgun and the 7.62x54R, the .303 and 8x57mm don't bother my shoulder. The 7mm-08 is gentler than all of them.

[Oldbloke]

Well thanks for all your input , ok (1) new weapon, or(2) restock 30/06 with a Boyds , with reduced loads,well I've got a starting point,
...hope I can for mine.

There is no need to buy a new stock. In fact it might not be heavy enough.
All you need is a zip lock bag or sock and some lead shot. Jam it inside the plastic sock with packing to stop it moving. Easy easy.

[flashman]

Looks like a Boyds, in pepper I think.....

[bladeracer]

Well bugger me , didn't think of the stock !! Mine is synthetic and very light , Boyds wooden stock , I wonder how much recoil it would absorb,any guesses???

For 7mm-08 shooting a 160gn bullet at 2500fps on 40gns of powder.
The bare Ruger American 22" is 2.85kg and makes 17.4ft/lbs of felt recoil energy.
Put on a scope, rings, bipod, butt pad and sling and it'll probably be closer to 4kg and make 12.5ft/lbs of felt recoil. A wooden stock or aluminium chassis will reduce it further still.
I have the 7mm-08 Ruger American 22" in an MDT chassis with folding stock, bipod and ten-round mag at 5.15kg, offering 9.6ft/lbs of recoil - about midway between shooting an iron-sighted rifle in .223 and .243. It's very, very mild.

I forgot earlier to add that using a sling wrapped around your support arm also reduces the recoil felt at your shoulder.

[flashman]

Ok didn't think to modify my existing stock, bugger more food for thought ,which way will I jump..

[bladeracer]

There is no need to buy a new stock. In fact it might not be heavy enough.
All you need is a zip lock bag or sock and some lead shot. Jam it inside the plastic sock with packing to stop it moving. Easy easy.

There's not a lot of difference between a poly stock and a lami stock.
On the Ruger American Rimfire the stocks weigh 0.84kg and 1.09kg - 250gms is all the difference is.
I agree, it'll be easier to significantly increase the weight of the poly stock.

[bladeracer]

Something else worth considering perhaps is the powder you're using. The weight of the powder is part of the "projectile".
In a 4.5kg 30-'06 shooting a 168gn bullet at 2800fps, you can use 48gn of BM8208 or 58gn of AR2209.
The BM8208 makes 15.4ft/lbs of recoil energy, the AR2209 makes 17.5ft/lbs - 14% more felt recoil for exactly the same terminal performance.

[flashman]

Powder I'm using . 47.5 AR2208-165 gr Nosler ballistic tip,or 53gr AR2209-165 Speer GrandSlam ,all with Norma brass,both shoot well in my gun with good results

[duncan61]

7mm/08 sounds perfect.I have 2 loads for my 7mm Rem Mag one is 100 gr Sierra and the other 168 gr Match King and the felt recoil is massive on the heavier bullet.

[flashman]

Duncan61,7mm/08 ,trying to save my shoulder mate ,good all round though, got a lot of good ideas just a matter of doing some experimenting with my 30/06 loads ,see what l can do the stock ".....

[Oldbloke]

Powder I'm using . 47.5 AR2208-165 gr Nosler ballistic tip,or 53gr AR2209-165 Speer GrandSlam ,all with Norma brass,both shoot well in my gun with good results

Try dropping the powder down to about 43 gr of ar2208. That is about starting load for 30-06

I'm loading 44.2 gr ar2208 with 180gr projectile and mild to shoot.