M38 Swedish Mauser info please

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M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by goldiexxxx » 03 Dec 2018, 6:29 pm

Hi All,

Been interested in the Swedish Mausers for some time. Out of a whim, I had one put away at my local GS while waiting for the permit. She's no beauty, but I was only after a plinker, not a collector's example. This rifle is a 1942 version but what is odd, is that there doesn't seem to be a single serial number on any part that matches.
My question is around what the history of this rifle could be, both during its service life, or once imported to Australia, that could lead to so many differing parts eventuating on a single rifle? Is this fairly common, while matching serial number rifles are rare?
Still, the receiver and bore look in really good condition, so lets hope that it still shoots well.

Any and all info about the Swedish M38 will be most welcome.

Goldie
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 03 Dec 2018, 6:52 pm

most of the carl gustav m96 swede mausers were built between 1899 and the early 1920's . most had a 29 inch barrel , there was a carbine version for cavalry or artillery crews. with the threat of the nazi's the updated m38 came into being. new rifles were made by husqvana i've seen build dates from 1941 to 1942. i actually prefer these to the earlier gustav. existing gustavs in armory storage were reworked, with barrels being shortened. some had the bolt handle turned down , some did not.these were designated m38 and a new millitary round was designed, bullet weight was dropped to 140 gn from the 160 gr round nose. i think this round was designed for the sniper rifles, then adopted for all service rifles. the threaded end on barrels was for a flash hider that actually was for difusing the wooden blank bullets used in training. we ended up with most of the training rifles in australia, the better condition rifles with only a step down for the bayonet handle went to the US ( barstards ). when reworked in the armoury, it was common for a good rifle to be built from many parts. each time a rifle went through the official military gun smiths a crown was stamped into the woodwork, usually in front of the rear sling mount. i had a m96 that had 3 stamps in this area, so had been inspected and /or reworked 3 times. this info is as accurate as i can recall of the top of my head. i remember buying my first centre fire 33 years ago from Amart sports underwood queensland. it was a 1941 husky in amazing condition, for $69. i used to out shoot my mates scoped sporters 22/22 mag at 100 with military ammo and open sights. i'm kicking myself for getting rid of a accurate husky just recently. great qaulity rifles
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 03 Dec 2018, 7:11 pm

a good accurate load that duplicates the original military load , 44 gn of reloader 22 , 142 gn matchking seated at 3.100 inch. federal 210 primers. FPS should be 2400-2450. this powder load is at the bottom of the load range but caution is advised. my '41 husky came set up for a scope, i fitted a old bushnell trophy , and with amazing regularity, would consistantly shoot great groups at 100 :thumbsup:
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swede mauser load at 100
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by Supaduke » 03 Dec 2018, 10:53 pm

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M96 and M38
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I have a Carl Gustav M96 built in 1917, a beautiful and accurate rifle, mild recoil and pleasant sight picture.
I also have a 1942 Husky M38, short, light soft shooting. Also superbly accurate and a terrific rifle to introduce newbies to Milsurps.
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M38
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M96
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by No1Mk3 » 04 Dec 2018, 5:29 am

G'day goldixxx,
Just want to clarify a couple of points, first, the Kings name was Gustaf, no "v" at the end, CARL GUSTAF! The rifle was first converted from the m/96 starting in 1937, and these are usually (not always) found with the straight bolt of the 96. Husqvarna produced m/38 from 1941 until 1944, with both straight (on early production) and then bent bolts. The rise of Nazi Germany had no bearing on the adoption of the m/38, as it was intended for motorised troops, transport regiments and the Navy, plus the lessons of WW1 caused all the worlds armies to reduce the length of their service rifles, but they were never intended for the Cavalry which continued to use the m/94 Carbine. The cartridge introduced in 1941 was the standard Norwegian service round since 1925, and not introduced specifically for the m/38 which had been in production for 3 years already, but proved itself to be ballistically superior to the m/94 cartridge with it's 156g RN projectile, and bigrich's load would be only slightly lower than the original m/41 round, which would be duplicated by 46.4g of RL22 or ADI 2213SC for appx 2500 fps from the m/38. With regard matching numbers, you would find about 50% of Swedes won't completely match, most have been rebuilt by armourers and often a part will be number matched in electro pencil. It is normal to see this and I would not worry about your rifle. Lastly, correct designation, all Swedish Army equipment and arms should be preceded by a small "m" only, as I have done in this post. The capital "M" is only used for Naval equipment such as the M/15 bayonet, enjoy your rifle, they are a joy to shoot, Cheers.
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by Supaduke » 04 Dec 2018, 10:04 am

Mine was a special model made for Gustaf's brother Gustav, he kind of flew under the radar a bit, very rare model. Cough.
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 04 Dec 2018, 12:14 pm

Supaduke wrote:Mine was a special model made for Gustaf's brother Gustav, he kind of flew under the radar a bit, very rare model. Cough.


Wow! What a coincidence I got one by his brother also :lol: I only got rid of mine cause it peeved me that I can’t shoot open sights real good anymore. If I’m gunna shoot with a scope I might as well do it in a modern action. Which is where my Winchester comes in :thumbsup:
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by goldiexxxx » 09 Dec 2018, 9:19 am

Well, I got my new to me m38 home this week and out to the range yesterday. I'm already impressed with its accuracy using factory ammo. I had a 14" steel plate hanging at 200m, and once I worked out the required hold to the right needed, I just couldn't miss. I have since given the front sight post a little tap to zero for myself. The POI was not all over that 14" either, with a group of about 20 in around the size of a splayed hand. The rifle is definitely more accurate than my eyes are capable to see.
Ive done a tonne of reading online since this original post and have learned a lot more about these rifles and their markings. I was correct in thinking mine has been through an arsenal refit, and that its rare to find these rifles that have matching serial numbers.
So from what I have read about the markings, it has parts from all three manufacturers, including trigger guard / magazine box from an original 1899 - 1900 m96 Mauser Obendorf rifle. About 50% of the other parts are Husqvarna, the others are Carl Gustaf parts.
Husqvarna:
receiver 1942
rear sight
butt plate
barrel band springs
front barrel band
cleaning rod
bolt / bolt cocking piece
Carl Gustaf
bolt release / action stop
magazine floor plate
rear barrel band
sight hood
magazine follower
extractor claw / firing pin / bolt sleeve
Mauser
trigger guard / magazine box

I have not taken the rifle apart so not sure about the timbers other than they don't match timber type. I believe the barrel has been replaced with a new one as there is a number marking, indicating the last figure of the bore dimension (9), where I read that these replacement barrels were made from 1955 onwards. I also believe the refit was conducted at the Army Workshop Ostersund, and the original Army Inspector was Sten Stenmo (1 Oct 1942 - 31 Mar 1946).

So all in all, I'm excited about working up some hand loads for this rifle.
Goldie
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 09 Dec 2018, 10:45 am

they really are a great rifle aren't they. :D try that load of 44 gn reloader 22 , 142 match kings , 3.100 coal , fed 210 primers. it is a good accuracy load, point of aim might be different to the standard sights, but you can get a new front sight blade from "liberty tree" over ebay. they also have front sight hoods as well. i had no problems with buying these parts from the USA, and a mate of mine just got his enfeild front sight protector from them as well . just file and adjust the replacement front blade to suit, and put the original away for safe keeping. another trick i found is the earlier m96 gustaf has a lighter trigger than the later husky. i put a early trigger and spring assembly in mine and made it more pleasant to shoot . i may be mistaken, but from what i've seen , the gustafs have every part on the rifle serial numbered. even the cleaning rod. the later husky's don't have all parts numbered, just the main bits. the tilted crown stamp also indicates a husky part. the upright crown means it's gustaf. (not to be confused with rifles made by his brother ,karl gustav :lol: :lol: :lol: ). look for crown stamps on the bottom of the stock , just in front of the rear sling mount. it may give you a idea how many times it's been through the armourers . i had a m96 that had three such stamps . enjoy your swede and it's accuracy and feel pity for those poor enfield shooters :sarcasm: :lol: :lol: :lol:

DISCLAIMER , all info i've given is in a casual "off the top of my head" manner. if it's wrong i appologise . all hate mail over the enfield comment can be addressed to , bigrichdoesntcare.com.au . have a wonderful day one and all :lol: :lol: :lol: :drinks: :drinks: :thumbsup:
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by deanp100 » 09 Dec 2018, 10:56 am

It is not hard to understand the confusion. I just found an aust army defence document detailing the “carl Gustav “ recoilless rifle and then a us defence dept talking about the same weapon only with the F . No-one knows what’s going on.
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by deanp100 » 09 Dec 2018, 10:58 am

And apparently there was two kings over the centuries, one with a V and one with an F.
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 09 Dec 2018, 11:29 am

deanp100 wrote:It is not hard to understand the confusion. I just found an aust army defence document detailing the “carl Gustav “ recoilless rifle and then a us defence dept talking about the same weapon only with the F . No-one knows what’s going on.


it's "the swedish chef" syndrome. no one knows what the christ he's saying :lol: :thumbsup:
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 09 Dec 2018, 4:41 pm

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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 09 Dec 2018, 4:44 pm

sorry couldn't help myself. funny as after a few sunday arvo cans......
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by goldiexxxx » 11 Dec 2018, 3:51 pm

Something else that I have not been able to answer is the rear sight on my rifle as seen in the original post photos. All reading I've done, and all images I've been able to find online, do not mention or have examples of my sight.
Literature I've been able to find, mention categorically that only three rear sights are possible, and the only one that starts the range graduations at 100m, only goes up to 600m. The rear sight on my rifle clearly shows graduations from 100 - 800m.

Anybody got any info on this?

Goldie
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Re: M38 Swedish Mauser info please

Post by bigrich » 11 Dec 2018, 4:29 pm

it has a tilted crown stamp on it goldie, so most likely it's a husky part. i'm sure i had the exact same rear sight on my 1941 husky . maybe it's had it's sights recalibrated at some point. probably during a armoury refit ? another give away is whether or not there is a "T" stamped on the side of the front sight . from memory this was done to signify it was calibrated for the 1941 revised 140 grain ammo. this info is just of the top of my head, i think it's correct . but don't take it as gospel. you could always ask the swedish chef on my earlier post/link . he seems to specialize in bazookas :lol: :drinks: :drinks: :thumbsup:
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