Short barrel, largish caliber

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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 07 Dec 2018, 8:14 pm

That 260 sounds awesome. I think I'm back to the start - it's between creedmoor and 7mm-08. My inclination is to use 140 projectiles for deer. That is in my current ignorant state. So what is the better calibre for projectiles 110 - 140? That's where I'm at :)
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 07 Dec 2018, 8:28 pm

It looks like the CM is really popular - everyone seems to love it. Apparently it has a slight advantage with BC (bullet coefficient?) over the 7mm-08. 7mm-08 has better barrel life. Creedmoor has awesome reputation for accuracy. It would be easier to live with. The tikka in CM is 1:8 twist which seems to suit heavier rounds than 110 - 140. Decisions. Anyway, I'm close, and I imagine a lot of you will think they're all good choices - LA-102 in CM, T3X in CM or 7mm-08.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 07 Dec 2018, 8:54 pm

I was wrong re the tikka t3x varmint. They have 6.5 x 55. It's strange - they seem to have all calibres except 6.5 creedmoor. That's the stainless, the blue varmint has different calibres again - still no 6.5 creedmoor. https://www.berettaaustralia.com.au/fir ... tainless--
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by SCJ429 » 07 Dec 2018, 8:58 pm

I wouldn't say that the Creedmoor is any sort of benchmark for accuracy. Is isn't bad but it isn't going to win any accuracy competitions at any distance. It is on par with other 6.5mm cases such as the 260, 6.5x47 Lapua, or the 6.5x55 Swede. You would shoot 140s for the 6.5 or if you go for the 7mm the 180s are the way to go.

If you want to shoot short range, under 300 metres you can get away with some lighter flat based bullets. You don't have as my choices as you would with a 6mm or a 30 cal.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by TassieTiger » 07 Dec 2018, 9:20 pm

Yep. I was about to buy a CM when the LGS showed me the 260 custom he had to unload reasonably quickly. Sent me scurrying home to research the heck out of 260 ballistics, barrel lengths, custom loads, etc - I didn’t haggle on price being asked, the only caveat being it was a refund if it couldn’t do what he claimed....which was a little outrageous tbh. But it not only met those claims, but exceeded them (FYI - claims were 3 inch groups at 500-600m with specific load). However - it’s not perfect. It runs a muzzle B, and is noisey as a 30/06. Top end loads recoil like factory 308 as well. The 260 lapua brass is gorgeous, but a bit exy. I’ve also used 308/243 brass.
With the “quoted” speeds - it will apparently shoot(need borrow chrono to confirm), I am at least mindful it might chew a barrel but x that bridge if and when...the fact is the ppl that built this knew a LOT more than me.
I can’t comment on the 7/08 but have read and heard only good things and the 6.5cm speaks for itself.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 07 Dec 2018, 10:31 pm

TassieTiger wrote:Yep. I was about to buy a CM when the LGS showed me the 260 custom he had to unload reasonably quickly. Sent me scurrying home to research the heck out of 260 ballistics, barrel lengths, custom loads, etc - I didn’t haggle on price being asked, the only caveat being it was a refund if it couldn’t do what he claimed....which was a little outrageous tbh. But it not only met those claims, but exceeded them (FYI - claims were 3 inch groups at 500-600m with specific load). However - it’s not perfect. It runs a muzzle B, and is noisey as a 30/06. Top end loads recoil like factory 308 as well. The 260 lapua brass is gorgeous, but a bit exy. I’ve also used 308/243 brass.
With the “quoted” speeds - it will apparently shoot(need borrow chrono to confirm), I am at least mindful it might chew a barrel but x that bridge if and when...the fact is the ppl that built this knew a LOT more than me.
I can’t comment on the 7/08 but have read and heard only good things and the 6.5cm speaks for itself.


The rifle you found is a find. It's like one of those stories, an eh holden sitting in someone's shed since the 70's. I'm tending toward the CM. It will buy me some time. I can buy factory loads and keep the brass - start reloading down the track. It's quite common; not as common as the 308 but not bad. And cheap. Easy to do I think. I'm in the ball park, and thanks to everyone's input I've got a small list, which is good. I can sit on it for a while. The good thing about it is if I see something in my short list at the right price I'm ready to grab it :)
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 07 Dec 2018, 10:41 pm

TassieTiger - where abouts do you range shoot for distance? My range is only 200m (Franklin), which I intend to explore fully with the .22 :)
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by bladeracer » 07 Dec 2018, 11:03 pm

Urastus wrote:It looks like the CM is really popular - everyone seems to love it. Apparently it has a slight advantage with BC (bullet coefficient?) over the 7mm-08. 7mm-08 has better barrel life. Creedmoor has awesome reputation for accuracy. It would be easier to live with. The tikka in CM is 1:8 twist which seems to suit heavier rounds than 110 - 140. Decisions. Anyway, I'm close, and I imagine a lot of you will think they're all good choices - LA-102 in CM, T3X in CM or 7mm-08.


BC is great for long-range as it hangs on to velocity and energy better.This may be required to keep a bullet supersonic at the target for precision (if you are using a bullet that goes unstable as it transitions), or for hitting an animal with maximum energy. For pure target work though I'm not sure it's all that important. High-BC shoots flatter, but for targets, you already know exactly what the range is and you're dialing in the elevation to suit, so it doesn't matter if it shoots like a mortar.

I love the 6.5mm bullets and have five 6.5mm chamberings so far, but not 6.5CM as yet. It will happen but it's not a priority.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by bladeracer » 07 Dec 2018, 11:04 pm

Urastus wrote:I was wrong re the tikka t3x varmint. They have 6.5 x 55. It's strange - they seem to have all calibres except 6.5 creedmoor. That's the stainless, the blue varmint has different calibres again - still no 6.5 creedmoor. https://www.berettaaustralia.com.au/fir ... tainless--


I have 6.5x55mm and I don't know that there's actually any advantage to the Creedmoor over it, unless you are buying a modern rifle and prefer a short action, as I do.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by in2anity » 08 Dec 2018, 7:11 am

I honestly think your overthinking it - in the digital world the CM vs 7/08 vs 260 vs 308 might appear different, but in reality they will all shoot exceptionally over medium and longer ranges (if your rifle and load is tuned).. There are far bigger variables such as windage and shooter error that will make you realize the comparison of these different specifications is much less of a significant factor than you might imagine... And you have to think about the cost of running it - 308 will be far cheaper to run, whether it be handloads or factory (but especially factory). Granted the 308 might jump a bit more, but if you get a decent brake and the rifle is on the heavier side, you can still get back on target in time to see the impact for shots 300m and beyond... I dunno, personally I'd be steering clear of 260 simply due to ammo/projectile availability. The other three - take your pic. But I say all things considered, the venerable 308 is tried-and-tested - the latest projectiles really aren't far behind the leaders. I say get a nice heavy barrel on a proven action, don't skimp on your optics, and then go out and shoot. There is a long road to travel before the characteristics of the CM vs 308w become a truly relevant factor...
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by TassieTiger » 08 Dec 2018, 8:49 am

Urastus wrote:TassieTiger - where abouts do you range shoot for distance? My range is only 200m (Franklin), which I intend to explore fully with the .22 :)


I’ve 290 hectares of Bush / plantation trees with crop protection permits about 30 mins from home.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by marksman » 08 Dec 2018, 9:01 am

just go for a 6mm dasher and be done with it :lol:
shoot the 100-107gr projies at 3000fps and kill heaps of paper and fallow
heres a 260 next to a 6mm dasher, the little case that could :lol: :drinks:

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buy a 243 in varmint config, dock the barrel to 20-22 and rechamber to 6mm dasher, jobs done :thumbsup:
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Gamerancher » 08 Dec 2018, 10:01 am

Mate, if you want a rifle to target shoot and hunt with, one chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor wouldn't be a bad choice. There are plenty of good quality, off the shelf rifles available in it at your stated price point. 24 inch barrel is fine. 1 in 8 is a pretty standard twist for 6.5mm. From what I saw last time I was down there, (Oct '17), Tasmanian gunshops seem to have a good supply of factory ammo in 6.5 Creedmoor at reasonable prices.
The cartridge is popular due to it's inherent accuracy, ( the thing all 6.5's have in common), availability of quality off the shelf ammo, it's reloadability, and most importantly, it's efficiency. It produces very similar performance to other 6.5's but using less powder. This means, lower felt recoil, longer barrel life and less report or muzzle blast.
6.5 bullets are available from all major manufacturers in a wide variety of styles and weights from 90 through to 160 grains, giving you a lot of choices when it comes to reloading.
By the way, I do own and shoot a rifle chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor, unlike some of the other fellas giving advice on it here. :unknown: I shoot high power metallic silhouette out to 500m with it. I have also put plenty of holes in critters with it and it does the job well!
More than happy with it for all of the reasons stated above, (apart from the factory ammo, I have never used factory ammo),
It hands down out-shoots both of my 7-08's set up for the same task and is a lot more pleasant to shoot. :thumbsup:

Also, despite the naysayers, considering the fact that the cartridge was designed specifically for the U.S High Power National Match, it has the runs on the board when it comes to winning at that and various other matches, ( e.g. 2011 Snipers Hide Cup winner and runner up both used it as well as two others in the top 10, this match is shot at varying distances out to 1000 yards), you won't be at any disadvantage choosing it to have a go at target shooting. :drinks:
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 08 Dec 2018, 10:13 am

in2anity wrote:I honestly think your overthinking it - in the digital world the CM vs 7/08 vs 260 vs 308 might appear different, but in reality they will all shoot exceptionally over medium and longer ranges (if your rifle and load is tuned).. There are far bigger variables such as windage and shooter error that will make you realize the comparison of these different specifications is much less of a significant factor than you might imagine... And you have to think about the cost of running it - 308 will be far cheaper to run, whether it be handloads or factory (but especially factory). Granted the 308 might jump a bit more, but if you get a decent brake and the rifle is on the heavier side, you can still get back on target in time to see the impact for shots 300m and beyond... I dunno, personally I'd be steering clear of 260 simply due to ammo/projectile availability. The other three - take your pic. But I say all things considered, the venerable 308 is tried-and-tested - the latest projectiles really aren't far behind the leaders. I say get a nice heavy barrel on a proven action, don't skimp on your optics, and then go out and shoot. There is a long road to travel before the characteristics of the CM vs 308w become a truly relevant factor...


:D I was expecting that, and you're right, of course. It is a real nit picking luxury to have expertise and experience here to advise. My own desires come into it too of course to steer things in general. And it's been a refinement of thought. I'm pretty settled now and all is good. Because of the reloading, to buy me some time, I'll focus on finding a creedmoor. That it's good on the range and hunting, no massive recoil (apparently). I didn't give recoil much thought. I used to shoot shotgun and .22 when I was a kid; my shoulders have copped a lot of damage since then (one keeps me awake). And I think it's a choice I will keep, not regret and look again. The 7mm-08; I would have chosen this if I was already into reloading.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 08 Dec 2018, 10:17 am

marksman wrote:just go for a 6mm dasher and be done with it :lol:
shoot the 100-107gr projies at 3000fps and kill heaps of paper and fallow
heres a 260 next to a 6mm dasher, the little case that could :lol: :drinks:

Image

buy a 243 in varmint config, dock the barrel to 20-22 and rechamber to 6mm dasher, jobs done :thumbsup:


:D :D I can understand the addiction of speed. It really appeals to me. 3000 fps - whew!
Last edited by Urastus on 08 Dec 2018, 10:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Urastus » 08 Dec 2018, 10:23 am

Urastus wrote:
marksman wrote:just go for a 6mm dasher and be done with it :lol:
shoot the 100-107gr projies at 3000fps and kill heaps of paper and fallow
heres a 260 next to a 6mm dasher, the little case that could :lol: :drinks:

Image

buy a 243 in varmint config, dock the barrel to 20-22 and rechamber to 6mm dasher, jobs done :thumbsup:


:D :D I can understand the addiction of speed. It really appeals to me. 3000 fps - whew! It breaks the sound barrier nearly 3 x
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by marksman » 08 Dec 2018, 10:34 am

but the 6mm dasher absolutely kills the crudmoor in every way :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :drinks:

if you want pure precision do not buy off the rack, build it :thumbsup:
good luck with it and I hope it turns out what you expect it to be ;) :drinks:
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Re: Short barrel, largish caliber

Post by Gamerancher » 08 Dec 2018, 10:35 am

You'll be able to send 100 grainers out of a Creedmoor @ 3000+ f/s no worries.
Will make a big mess of those small insects you blokes down there call "roos". :lol:
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