straightshooter wrote:bigrich wrote:
unfortunately, a lot of guns are built to a budget not qaulity these days . ya get what ya pay for. pretty rude of the importer not backing what he's selling but
I've got some news for you.
All guns are built to a budget!
It's just that some budgets are bigger than other budgets.
bigrich wrote:straightshooter wrote:bigrich wrote:
unfortunately, a lot of guns are built to a budget not qaulity these days . ya get what ya pay for. pretty rude of the importer not backing what he's selling but
I've got some news for you.
All guns are built to a budget!
It's just that some budgets are bigger than other budgets.
which brings us back to the other part of that statement "ya get what ya pay for " JMHO out of the posters choices, i still put howa as my choice in a earlier post anyway
bigfellascott wrote:Yeah sometimes I wonder about that statement, I've got a $1400 Ruger Hawkeye and honestly the Howa's s**t all over it for smoothness and most importantly accuracy, and I got 2 Howas for the price of the Ruger! Sometimes I think marketing is what makes some things seem like they are somehow worth more than they perhaps should be, not always but sometimes.
JimTom wrote:Yep you do get what you pay for. I have never owned a Howa however it would be hard to ignore all the positivity they receive on this forum. Sounds like a great bit of kit considering its price tag.
Nevertheless, I have owned a fair few different brands of rifle, Winchester, Savage, Brno, CZ, Lithgow, Tikka, Miroku, and Sako. The Sako is the most expensive and is the best rifle I own in the way of accuracy, trigger, and action, all spot on straight from the box. Exactly what you would expect given the price you pay. In my eyes though totally worth the extra dollars.
bigrich wrote:JimTom wrote:Yep you do get what you pay for. I have never owned a Howa however it would be hard to ignore all the positivity they receive on this forum. Sounds like a great bit of kit considering its price tag.
Nevertheless, I have owned a fair few different brands of rifle, Winchester, Savage, Brno, CZ, Lithgow, Tikka, Miroku, and Sako. The Sako is the most expensive and is the best rifle I own in the way of accuracy, trigger, and action, all spot on straight from the box. Exactly what you would expect given the price you pay. In my eyes though totally worth the extra dollars.
yeh well, this is my thoughts on things. there are some great budget rifles on the market , and yes, in these modern times due to labour costs, some cheaper rifles outperform more expensive ones . whatever fits and what your comfortable with is the bottom line i guess. firearm makers are like car makers, they've all had some good products, and some not so good. i'm of the opinion i'd rather have less guns , but of the best qaulity that i can afford. i mostly buy second hand, and try to sort through what's what with all the different makes and models and judge each individual rifle on it's own merits and condition. it's the only way i could afford the A7 308 sako i own now, and IMHO it's a far better rifle than the 308 ruger i traded, for my uses and tastes . judging by the responses this topic is as controversial as the old "what's better, ford or holden ?" these days i have a toyota deisel 4x4 back to the original topic, the howa would be my pick out of the rifles listed as choices
TassieTiger wrote:Marketing vs psychology vs experience vs tradition...makes for interesting conversation.
The thing with marketing as well is - if it’s truly successful, then you get more of that item into the marketplace and it becomes self perpetuating ie tikka rifles at the moment. Tikka marketing depaRtment deserve gold, they have marketed their T3’s very well...and they have saturated the market with adverts more than any other brand. So many are now out there and “working to their design brief” that it’s the first comment often mentioned around a campfire when taking great rifles for budget conscience - but reality is a little different as we all know...they have their issues just like any other brand.
It does fascinate me to a degree how we as consumers are manipulated by advertisers and then our purchases end up owning us...it’s bloody weird.
And merry Xmas to you good sir.
Cheers.
TassieTiger wrote:Marketing vs psychology vs experience vs tradition...makes for interesting conversation.
The thing with marketing as well is - if it’s truly successful, then you get more of that item into the marketplace and it becomes self perpetuating ie tikka rifles at the moment. Tikka marketing depaRtment deserve gold, they have marketed their T3’s very well...and they have saturated the market with adverts more than any other brand. So many are now out there and “working to their design brief” that it’s the first comment often mentioned around a campfire when taking great rifles for budget conscience - but reality is a little different as we all know...they have their issues just like any other brand.
It does fascinate me to a degree how we as consumers are manipulated by advertisers and then our purchases end up owning us...it’s bloody weird.
And merry Xmas to you good sir.
Cheers.
bigfellascott wrote:bigrich wrote:bigfellascott wrote:bigrich wrote:I don’t know how large the deer in tassie are, but a good second hand Swede 6.5 Mauser isn’t expensive ,can be very accurate and will do the job
Their fallow so easy to tip over.
maybe for the poster a second hand swede 6.5 would be good, or a second hand 243 of some description . either way with a decent scope both could be had for under a grand . not trying to be a smart @ss to the OP, but .30 seems a bit heavy for deer that size . JMHO
There are plenty of cheap options out there, as for cal yeah I think a 243 would suit nicely.
Or he could try some of the 110gn offerings out there to suit the 308, that might be a more versatile offering in the end (do they have projectile weight requirements in tas for Deer?)
TassieTiger wrote:Yes, I would buy another steyr - but only because of my other 223 steyr that has proven to me that they can make a fine shooting rifle.
If this 06 had have been my first steyr, yes, my confidence would have been slain - I agree. That being said - my complaints with the steyr, match very closely what another member is encountering with his light weight tikka 308...yet - he has chosen to accept that rifles accuracy and not advertise its shortcomings...another colleague of mine is currently trying to get a 270 tikka shooting better than 3 Moa and struggling worse than I ever was...so, should a person consider an alternate brand to both tikka and steyr as a result...
As a returning shooter after many many years away, before knowing anyone within the sport or what was going on in shooting forums or even attending a lgs - the first rifle brand that caught my attention was tikka...full page magazine spreads, huge MOA guarantee posters at gun shops, decals everywhere - got me asking the question about the brand - and yes, I quickly learned that they are held in high regard...it was predominantly reason that I bought one. Chicken or egg?
Would be an interesting poll for the forum...each member is given $2k to go shopping for a new deer rifle package. Vote for 1 of 10 packages ranging from westherby, howa, tikka, Mauser, axis, steyr, Remington, Winchester etc plus scope...would tikka be a clear winner with a $500 scope or would the Mauser m18 be a winner with a $900 scope or would the savage be a winner with a $1400 scope and 2 slabs of cascade draught?....someone smarter than me should set it up ?
bigrich wrote:geez goose, sambar ? yeh, well, i should think 30-06 as a starting point. 30 cal, known for it's load flexability and shoots the heavier projectiles better than a 308. load her up with a 180- 200 grain nosler partition and you would be good to go i reckon. load down to a lighter quicker expanding slug for the smaller deer in tassie. maybe some others on here have a different view on it, but the 30-06 would be a great choice
bigfellascott wrote:Yeah I reckon in the old days "what you paid for you got was probably right" but this day and age things have caught up well and truly in regards to a lot of things. I've spend $1500 + on a Tikka and $1800 on a 2nd hand Sako and I can honestly say it won't ever happen again, I've gotten better results accuracy wise out of my cheap arse Howas FFS! yes they aren't as well finished but FMD seriously who cares if they aren't as flash, the bloody things shoot real well for me compared to they more expensive and fancied and over hyped ones I've purchased these things are a breeze to get to shoot well and for the $$ they have shot amazingly "Out of the Box" and still do - sadly my experience of "What you pay for you get" hasn't come close to what it should have been, far from it infact and quite the opposite (make of that what you will but there seems to be a few others who have had similar experiences regarding what they spend in relation to the results they have achieved so far, not only in relations to rifles but scopes and all manner of firearms related things.
The "Hype and salesmanship doesn't always add up to a great out come despite what does are outlayed. And that is a fact backed up by a friend who also works in a well known gunshop wo has worked there many years - make of that what you will!
bigrich wrote:interesting idea on the $2k deer rifle package , how would you assess it though ?
Goose#24 wrote:Yeah that's what I was thinking, think I may just have to get a second job and just buy one of everything suggested to settle it easily! Think that may be a problem solver.
TassieTiger wrote:The parameters for the polling would be a realistic budget for rifle and scope - the budget would have to be capped at an amount that precludes someone from say buying a high end rifle and $100 scope...so maybe $1500 is a better number to preclude sako, etc.
You’d have to offer up a decent amount of “rifle/scope packages” for ppl to choose from and calibre would be irrelevant.
If you could get 20-30 voters then you’d start to see a trend of favoured rifle combinations for a given discipline.
Your not going to please everyone and some ppl will want various weird scopes / set ups but if you match mainstream rifles to mainstream scopes you capture the majority of peeps opinions.
I don’t think it would be as clear cut as ppl might think eg ppl would have to choose only their fav combo out of...howa with a Leopold 6-18 vs a tikka with a Bushnell 3/9 vs a steyr with a red field 4/18 vs a savage with a vortex 4/12 and so on...total value new has to be 1500 or under.
On other forums you could set up a poll but I’m on a phone whilst pc gets sorted so not sure if it’s an option here at present.
bigrich wrote:sorry to hear you haven't had a good run with some stuff scott
bigfellascott wrote:Yeah sometimes I wonder about that statement, I've got a $1400 Ruger Hawkeye and honestly the Howa's s**t all over it for smoothness and most importantly accuracy, and I got 2 Howas for the price of the Ruger! Sometimes I think marketing is what makes some things seem like they are somehow worth more than they perhaps should be, not always but sometimes.