Milsurp buying tips/locations.

[Nomis]

G'day all,

In celebration of my licence application being sent off today (and so my wait begins), I'm wondering if people have any tips on where you've found the best places are to find milsurp rifles?

I've already put money down on an M96 Swedish Mauser but am on the lookout for more.

I've seen Claremont Firearms' website which seems to have a good range and Rebel Gun Works which seems over priced. Where else is good to look?

I suspect that a lot of deals would be found in random local gun shops who don't specialise in historic stuff. Would this be correct?

Let me know what your experience tells you and anything I need to know as a new collector.

Cheers.

[SCJ429]

If it were me I would go along to a military shoot at your local range and ask the old boys there if they know of anything they want to sell. These guys have been around and are happy to help where the gunshop needs to make a profit to stay in business.

[No1Mk3]

G'day Nomis,
Gun show at Altona Nth July 6th, Ballarat the week after on the 13th, Bendigo on the 24th of August, and Australian Arms Auctions at Boronia in November. We usually have someone in the Military Rifle Club selling something most months and 3 members are gundealers specializing in military firearms all of whom will be at Altona, in fact one of them runs the show. most dealers around town have military rifles pass through there hands fairly often but prices vary and they often notify their good customers first if any interesting or cheap rifles pop up. Claremont is very good, great to deal with also. Lawrance Ordnance in Sydney deals in top end stuff, priced up but only the best quality so it can be viewed as fair value, and Simon is also great to deal with and scrupulously honest in his descriptions. Shepparton show around March has very good militaria. Keep an eye on the websites particularly usedguns and ozguns, best of luck.

[Leadspitter]

Barry s firearms , in perth.

Plenty of military gear here , the place is like a museum , fair dinkum , a large part of the retail space is crammed with all sorts of ww1 machineguns and stuff

There is a ww2 sea mine in the car park out the front

Barry lives and breathes the military gear.

[Nomis]

G'day Nomis,
Gun show at Altona Nth July 6th, Ballarat the week after on the 13th, Bendigo on the 24th of August, and Australian Arms Auctions at Boronia in November.

I knew about the Melbourne and Ballarat shows but not Bendigo so thanks for the heads up. I'm in Shepparton so I'll head over to Bendigo and have a look when that one is on. Just need to make sure that I don't blow the future house deposit in my enthusiasm!

[bladeracer]

G'day all,

In celebration of my licence application being sent off today (and so my wait begins), I'm wondering if people have any tips on where you've found the best places are to find milsurp rifles?

I've already put money down on an M96 Swedish Mauser but am on the lookout for more.

I've seen Claremont Firearms' website which seems to have a good range and Rebel Gun Works which seems over priced. Where else is good to look?

I suspect that a lot of deals would be found in random local gun shops who don't specialise in historic stuff. Would this be correct?

Let me know what your experience tells you and anything I need to know as a new collector.

Cheers.

For collector value or for shootable examples? I'm not a collector, I just love owning and shooting them.

Usedguns, and trawling through shop websites. Ask your dealer if he has any customers that like mislurps, they might be looking to sell, and if he knows you're interested he might not turn somebody away that's selling something he otherwise wouldn't want on the rack. I bought three off a local guy that just buys them to play with then sells them on and buys something else. And join the SSAA (Victoria), Military Rifle Club. Message sellers on Usedguns, I messaged a dealer about an M1904/39 and scored my M95 Dutch Mannlicher instead. I got my M96 indirectly by following a Facebook group. Sign up for newsletters from dealers as well, that's how I got my M1903-A3. And drop into every gunshop you pass when you're out and about to see if they've got anything on their racks.

[Nomis]

For collector value or for shootable examples? I'm not a collector, I just love owning and shooting them.

Definitely looking for ones to shoot. I think they'll naturally appreciate in value over time but I really just like the idea of owning a piece of history and thinking about where it's been.

Being new to shooting I'm just very aware of not rushing into things and actually taking the time to try and identify what a rifle is worth etc. It seems to be a bit of a minefield.

[Urastus]

Don't have any answers. I wanted to post this somewhere though - I thought bladeracer might be interested? $62 with delivery - this is with a discount already applied. If you see below the price it shows "Pay only $52", then click on "Show me how". $10 delivery. Don't know if it is a good deal or not - it isn't my thing

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BRITISH-SURPLUS-WW2-LEE-ENFIELD-BAYONET-SPIKE-KNIFE-BAYONET-NEW-ALLOY-SCABBARD/272827374380?hash=item3f85c75b2c:g:fLEAAOSwEjlbUFK3

[bladeracer]

Don't have any answers. I wanted to post this somewhere though - I thought bladeracer might be interested? $62 with delivery - this is with a discount already applied. If you see below the price it shows "Pay only $52", then click on "Show me how". $10 delivery. Don't know if it is a good deal or not - it isn't my thing

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/BRITISH-SURPLUS-WW2-LEE-ENFIELD-BAYONET-SPIKE-KNIFE-BAYONET-NEW-ALLOY-SCABBARD/272827374380?hash=item3f85c75b2c:g:fLEAAOSwEjlbUFK3

Thanks for the thought Urastus, but I already have one of those, though that price is not too bad.
I am chasing a scabbard for a No.9 bayonet though if you come across one

I got a Swedish M96 bayonet out of the US last week.

[Nomis]

So, let's say I'm looking online (Ozgunsales etc) and I find a gun that I like for what seems an OK price but it's in another state. Is the normal process to ask for further photos etc or is it just cross your fingers and hope that the rifle is in the condition that they say it is?

I'm wanting to get an SMLE at some point. I don't really care about the manufacturer so that isn't a factor. What sort of price range should I be looking at? Gun store within driving distance has one for $850 (MkIII*, 1913, BSA). Had a very brief look at it the other day but not actually in a position to purchase yet of course. What should I be looking for to try and justify that price?

[bladeracer]

So, let's say I'm looking online (Ozgunsales etc) and I find a gun that I like for what seems an OK price but it's in another state. Is the normal process to ask for further photos etc or is it just cross your fingers and hope that the rifle is in the condition that they say it is?

I'm wanting to get an SMLE at some point. I don't really care about the manufacturer so that isn't a factor. What sort of price range should I be looking at? Gun store within driving distance has one for $850 (MkIII*, 1913, BSA). Had a very brief look at it the other day but not actually in a position to purchase yet of course. What should I be looking for to try and justify that price?

I guess I'm not too fussed. If it's in poor condition then at least I have it for parts. Some rifles can be in poor condition due to their service life, Arisakas for example never spent much time doing guard duty behind the lines, they were all in the thick of bombardment, salt water, flamethrowers, and spitting bullets thousands at a time. My Type38 is totally shot out, the bore slugs at .270" and won't even shoot .278" cast bullets with any accuracy. I've bought some .277" jacketed bullets for a final try at getting her shooting. If that fails then the last resort is an aftermarket barrel I picked up chambered in 7mm-08. I'll still have to find a good Type38, or a good original barrel, but while I'm looking I have this one to enjoy.

But I think generally, for a milsurp to be still on the market this long after leaving service, there's a good chance it still shoots okay. For me, even a poor example is better than no example at all, it doesn't have to impress me with tight groups. If you want accuracy then the M38 or M96 are your best bet.

[bladeracer]

I'm wanting to get an SMLE at some point. I don't really care about the manufacturer so that isn't a factor. What sort of price range should I be looking at? Gun store within driving distance has one for $850 (MkIII*, 1913, BSA). Had a very brief look at it the other day but not actually in a position to purchase yet of course. What should I be looking for to try and justify that price?

I didn't address this bit.
I would say if you can pick up a No.1 Rifle for $850, grab it.

[No1Mk3]

G'day Nomis,
Good SMLE's can still be found for $5 -600, good shooters but a bit dinged in the woodwork and non-matching numbers can still be found for less, about $3 - 400. For $850 I would want bright bore, very good wood and matching numbers. The very best examples can go north of a grand, and some specific collectibles such as a 1929 Lithgow can pass $2000. Last auction saw good shooting No1 Mk3's selling for between $250 and 450 + costs. As for that bayonet, way overpriced, No4 bayonets can still be found for $30 to $40 if you hunt around just a little, and $20 occasionally. Have a look at gunshows for bargain bayonets.

G'day bladeracer,
Sadly a thick throat (brass throat) scabbard for your No9 is going to cost about $40 + postage from Qld. I just recently sole Jeff Pannan both of my spares for $10 each before I found out what they are selling for! Still, if you want the thin throat model I have seen them here for $50 + or in the States for that much in US$. Remember this is the same scabbard as the L1A2 and L1A3 bayonet so if you don't have much success searching for No5 scabbard (plenty of hits on ebay) try L1A2, Cheers.

[bladeracer]

G'day Nomis,
Good SMLE's can still be found for $5 -600, good shooters but a bit dinged in the woodwork and non-matching numbers can still be found for less, about $3 - 400. For $850 I would want bright bore, very good wood and matching numbers. The very best examples can go north of a grand, and some specific collectibles such as a 1929 Lithgow can pass $2000. Last auction saw good shooting No1 Mk3's selling for between $250 and 450 + costs. As for that bayonet, way overpriced, No4 bayonets can still be found for $30 to $40 if you hunt around just a little, and $20 occasionally. Have a look at gunshows for bargain bayonets.

G'day bladeracer,
Sadly a thick throat (brass throat) scabbard for your No9 is going to cost about $40 + postage from Qld. I just recently sole Jeff Pannan both of my spares for $10 each before I found out what they are selling for! Still, if you want the thin throat model I have seen them here for $50 + or in the States for that much in US$. Remember this is the same scabbard as the L1A2 and L1A3 bayonet so if you don't have much success searching for No5 scabbard (plenty of hits on ebay) try L1A2, Cheers.

I think gunshow prices only apply for people that go to the shows, for the rest of us I think the prices tend to be higher
Auctions can bring you a bargain, if you don't mind waiting for it to happen, and are happy to still be empty-handed afterwards.

I still consider $850 to be a good price for a No.1 Rifle at a local dealer. Find one online for $750 and it's going to cost you $850 by the time you get it, even more in other states that charge exorbitant PtA fees, or from dealers like Miall's that charge ludicrous shipping fees.

I generally see the spike bayonets for around $50 plus shipping, so $50 delivered sounds good to me. I was given the No.9 bayonet so I don't mind paying for a scabbard, but I can't bring myself to buy a scabbard with another bayonet as I'll still be chasing another scabbard

Thanks for tip about the scabbards, might be useful.
Can you PM details on where I order this scabbard from in Qld?

[Nomis]

Last auction saw good shooting No1 Mk3's selling for between $250 and 450 + costs.

Thanks for the reply No1Mk3.
Which arms auctions should I be looking out for? I saw in another thread you mentioned Australian Arms Auctions but when I've gone to their website the say their next auction is in April of this year and an ad comes up looking for people to purchase the business so not 100% sure they are continuing operations.

Cheers.

[No1Mk3]

G'day Nomis,
AAA hold their auctions twice a year, usually 1st weekend of May and October, and this year at the end of April due to the venue having prior booking. Rolly wants to retire, he is well in his 70's and finds it all a bit much now, but the next auction will go ahead for sure after that we don't know. Problem with finding a buyer is finding someone with Rolands knowledge and standing in the collectors world, but even if a new person takes over it will be worthwhile to check out even if it shrinks in scale. Rolly had to start somewhere and I remember his auctions in years gone past that were a lot smaller and more select than now. The catalogue normally comes online about 3 to 4 weeks from the date of sale and half a dozen previous auctions and prices reached may be found on his website which can provide a good insight as to what can be found and what prices are being paid for a large range of collectible pieces. Cheers.

[Nomis]

Thanks for the info No1. I actually met Roland briefly at the Arms and Militaria show on the weekend. Seems like a nice bloke.
I also grabbed the printed catalogue for the last auction and am checking what the final prices were for some pieces.
I'll be attending the one in October fingers crossed! Seems like the place to get myself an SMLE.

[cracker]

Thanks for the info No1. I actually met Roland briefly at the Arms and Militaria show on the weekend. Seems like a nice bloke.
I also grabbed the printed catalogue for the last auction and am checking what the final prices were for some pieces.
I'll be attending the one in October fingers crossed! Seems like the place to get myself an SMLE.

its pretty bloody boring... i placed some bids online last time was easier.

[No1Mk3]

Thanks for the info No1. I actually met Roland briefly at the Arms and Militaria show on the weekend. Seems like a nice bloke.
I also grabbed the printed catalogue for the last auction and am checking what the final prices were for some pieces.
I'll be attending the one in October fingers crossed! Seems like the place to get myself an SMLE.

its pretty bloody boring... i placed some bids online last time was easier.

Boring cracker?
Not for me mate, I get to actually fondle $100,000 + guns I will never ever own, or rare things like the 16th Century German executioners axe at the last auction, meet other collectors and make networks of contacts that have yielded amazing pieces for my collection at very good prices over the years but most of all be on the spot when things I hadn't even thought about don't pull bids and I can snap up a bargain such as the last 3 auction pick ups, a Swede m96 for $300, a M1935 Turk Mauser for $165, a Brazilian M1908 Mauser for $200 etc. on top of what I was after to begin with. The new location at the Hungarian Club also has a restaurant that makes great goulash and has educated me about Hungarian beer and palinka! Cheers.

[Nomis]

Mate, you had me at sub $300 Mausers and then threw in beer and Hungarian food on top!

As I'm new to this whole thing, I'm a little confused as to why people would sell at this auction if some stuff sells so far below market value. If I was selling a Turkish Mauser, why sell it via auction and risk getting $150 for it when I could put it on Oz Gun Sales for $450?
Am I missing something?

Also, I assume that once you win an item, you just put in a PTA and they hold the firearm until you have the PTA ready?

In other news, my licence has been further delayed as Vic Police managed to put the wrong name on my payment form. I have had to physically mail it back to Melbourne so they can issue another one whenever they get around to it. If they don't lose it. Joy... Pure joy.

Cheers for the advice everyone!

[No1Mk3]

G'day Nomis,
If you are sure of a lot and have a PTA already then you can take it home, or Roly will hold it at the armoury in Moorabbin and you can pick it up from there. You can also arrange to have it sent to a dealer near you, but there are charges for this. Hope those useless sods at LRD get your licence sorted soon ,fingers crossed, Cheers.

[cracker]

Mate, you had me at sub $300 Mausers and then threw in beer and Hungarian food on top!

As I'm new to this whole thing, I'm a little confused as to why people would sell at this auction if some stuff sells so far below market value. If I was selling a Turkish Mauser, why sell it via auction and risk getting $150 for it when I could put it on Oz Gun Sales for $450?
Am I missing something?

Also, I assume that once you win an item, you just put in a PTA and they hold the firearm until you have the PTA ready?

In other news, my licence has been further delayed as Vic Police managed to put the wrong name on my payment form. I have had to physically mail it back to Melbourne so they can issue another one whenever they get around to it. If they don't lose it. Joy... Pure joy.

Cheers for the advice everyone!

most stuff gets pretty decent prices, 1911a1 etc arnt cheap.