Scout Rifles?

[ScottyD]

Just curious as to any opinions about scout rifles (i.e. the rifle developed/promoted by American Jeff Cooper)

What say you guys?

[wrenchman]

i dont have a opinion good or bad its more about is it works well for you the nice thing is most companys that make them so if its not you can move a scope back on it.

[bigrich]

Betcha Jeff cooper had a 303 Jungle carbine I had a scoped 308 ruger gunsite that was a compact accurate rifle . Open sights don’t work for me. I moved it on as I like old time stuff, and even though it’s practical, there was too much plastic on it for my liking. I’m packing a 8x57 Mauser “carbine” now

[CAVEMAN]

I rate my 308 Ruger scout, the concept is interesting in its employment. But at the end of the day it is mainly a short handy rifle. It does kick and its loud, but its surprisingly accurate and you can run the scout scope or the more traditional scope setup. And the iron sights aren't bad for larger targets.

I like the exposed action as its easy to clear an obstruction or a miss fed round, and easy to top load. It points well feels natural in the shoulder and the laminate stock is sturdy as buggeries. It also chews up any ammo i don't worry about treating it like a princess from Russian steel cased to ADI 168's (the ADI actually grouped no better than cheap Federal for me). And i've fired some old milsurp 7.62 and dodgy 308 hand loads that all the cases cracked quite bad, but that big Ruger/Mauser action just took it all.

Treat it for what it is and not a 0.5 MOA bench queen and it will work wonders. But she is a tad heavy.

And the vortex 2-7 scope is brilliant for the price.

[SCJ429]

Wow that is some eye relief you have there. Did the rifle come with those mounts?

[CAVEMAN]

Yep, picatiny mounted forward of the receiver. Meant to be a low power long eye relief scope. To allow for broad field of view and rapid target acquisition, but also with new adjustable mag scopes you can dial it in for more precise work. My rifle is nearly to his specs, i'm still learning how to properly use a ching sling to stabilize my positions. And still maintain iron sights as a backup or for low light work.

The following video gives a good brief over view of Jeff Cooper's idea, its quite an interesting and utilitarian concept. Id sum it up as one rifle to do many thing but not necessarily any one thing perfectly. A jack of all trades.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x7N8hLI2yM

[bladeracer]

Just curious as to any opinions about scout rifles (i.e. the rifle developed/promoted by American Jeff Cooper)

What say you guys?

I struggle to think of a "scout rifle" in any definitive term. To me it's any short, light, bolt-action that won't allow a conventional scope mounting, and ideally, with a detachable box mag. But I also consider lever-action carbines to be "scout rifles" in essence.

I have a scout scope I use for load development on rifles difficult to mount conventionally, and it certainly improves accuracy, but I really haven't gotten comfortable trying to use it in the field.

[bladeracer]

Wow that is some eye relief you have there. Did the rifle come with those mounts?

The barrel-mounted scope is usually the first thing that describes a "scout rifle", long eye relief, but not as long as a pistol scope.

[mickb]

Caveman which vortex scope is it, is that one their actual 'scout' models. I'm curious to know what the published eye relief is.

I'm looking at scopes for a lever action. The yanks have a lot of affordable options including ultralight handgun scopes in 2x20mm etc. Some have eye relief in usable ranges. Nothing affordable like that in Australia so I am trying to find the next lightest options.

[CAVEMAN]

https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-crossfire-ii-2-7x32-vplex-moa-scout-scope.html

That's the one, i picked it up for $235 on special. They take a bit of a knocking too, as shooting off a post with a scout scope typically ends up with it bumping the post on recoiling. But even with that i haven't bothered it at all.

[bladeracer]

Caveman which vortex scope is it, is that one their actual 'scout' models. I'm curious to know what the published eye relief is.

I'm looking at scopes for a lever action. The yanks have a lot of affordable options including ultralight handgun scopes in 2x20mm etc. Some have eye relief in usable ranges. Nothing affordable like that in Australia so I am trying to find the next lightest options.

I use an NCStar 2-7x32.

[bladeracer]

This popped up today in my YT subs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5rbshECK0Y

[ScottyD]

Thanks for the helpful comments everyone. They do strike me as being a decent handy quick aiming rifle, likely a good candidate for my purposes. I’ve been starting to focus on something in .243 (especially Winchester Model 70), but I don’t think I could bring myself to get a scout rifle in anything other than .308

I’m also curious about lever options, particularly the Marlin 1895 in 45-70. It seems to almost fit into the category of handy mid-range scout fife, but I’ve ruled it out mainly due to the cost of ammunition.

[ScottyD]

This popped up today in my YT subs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5rbshECK0Y

This is a brilliant review of the Styer Scout, thanks bladeracer

I also enjoyed his review on the Savage 11

[ScottyD]

Yep, picatiny mounted forward of the receiver. Meant to be a low power long eye relief scope. To allow for broad field of view and rapid target acquisition, but also with new adjustable mag scopes you can dial it in for more precise work. My rifle is nearly to his specs, i'm still learning how to properly use a ching sling to stabilize my positions. And still maintain iron sights as a backup or for low light work.

The following video gives a good brief over view of Jeff Cooper's idea, its quite an interesting and utilitarian concept. Id sum it up as one rifle to do many thing but not necessarily any one thing perfectly. A jack of all trades.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-x7N8hLI2yM

I like your Ruger caveman, good to hear the Scout concept is working well for you

Great video too, it’s one of the ones that got me so interested in these rifles.

[bigrich]

Here’s my new scout rifle project, 1903 oberdorf made “Turk “ 8x57 Mauser, the barrels pretty sad, but it will still shoot under 2” @ 100 with the apparture rear sight. There’s no rifling for about the first two inches past the throat somebody went to a lot of effort to sporterize this a long time ago, it’s been bedded and numerous tweaks done to it . I’m still sussing it out , it’ll probably get rebarreled . I’ll probably keep it 8x57, but 358 win does have appeal . It’s nice to point with a 20” barrel too

[Stix]

Nice flooring look BR... ...Spotted Gum...?

Nice little rifle too...go smack some goats with it before you re-barrel...

[CAVEMAN]

Could that be re barreled to 308, and does it still have stripper clip guides?

I've played with the idea of building a bespoke scout on a K98 or SMLE, converted to 308 and utilizing stripper clips. I feel that feeding by stripper clips fits perfectly in the guise of a scout rifle, by being able to carry extra shots easily without the necessary bulk or expense of magazines.

Even looked at modifying the Ruger action, but since there investment cast i don't think they would like having the rear of the receiver notched out.

[bigrich]

Nice flooring look BR... ...Spotted Gum...?

Nice little rifle too...go smack some goats with it before you re-barrel...

the floors vynal , ol' mate . it's bin a bit hard to get out for a hunt lately , all my contacts have bin real busy . it'd be overkill for goats , one of the hottest factory loads is s&b , 196 gn at almost 2600 fps . i tried PPU 175 gn loads that are quite mild so far . the peep sight on it works for me. it's fun snap shooting with it

[bigrich]

Could that be re barreled to 308, and does it still have stripper clip guides?

I've played with the idea of building a bespoke scout on a K98 or SMLE, converted to 308 and utilizing stripper clips. I feel that feeding by stripper clips fits perfectly in the guise of a scout rifle, by being able to carry extra shots easily without the necessary bulk or expense of magazines.

Even looked at modifying the Ruger action, but since there investment cast i don't think they would like having the rear of the receiver notched out.

if ya want something with stripper clips , a mauser is probably not a bad idea. these early "turk" mausers are a oberdorf ( germany) made action that is a little shorter than the other mauser actions . this rifle was originally 7.65x53 as per other oberdorf mauser for argentine, chile , brazil and others .it's very slick and in very good condition for a turk , it would lend itself very well to 308 based calibers . 358 win is a option for me but the 8x57 is a great old round in it's own right . the history of old milsurps is very interesting , and i'm kicking myself for not grabbing some cheap winchester made P14's when i saw some . early rugers m77's have a very nice slick action , but i wouldn't try notching one for stripper clips . i had also considered a 6.5 swede for a scout project , but a 8mm mauser would have heavier hitting power up close . i wouldn't discard the idea of a 303 scout either

[Stix]

Nice flooring look BR... ...Spotted Gum...?

Nice little rifle too...go smack some goats with it before you re-barrel...

the floors vynal , ol' mate . it's bin a bit hard to get out for a hunt lately , all my contacts have bin real busy . it'd be overkill for goats , one of the hottest factory loads is s&b , 196 gn at almost 2600 fps . i tried PPU 175 gn loads that are quite mild so far . the peep sight on it works for me. it's fun snap shooting with it

lol...you crack me up..so innocently missed everything i meant....!!!...

Go back & have a read...I did say "flooring look" ol'mate...!!...
It looks like a "spotted gum" look...just though being your house you might know...not that it matters... ...i just like your (Qld) Spotted Gum mate thats all...laying a deck in it as we speak...


As for the gun... ...If a goat is overkill for it, then go kill a rabbit with it then...i dont care... . ..but surely you gotta smack something with it before you re-barrel it...

Dont you always want to blood a rifle...? ...hell i do...!!!
Good thing i dont like rocks...id still be out there trying to hit a goat...or a bunny with my first rock...& you'd still be wondering what i was doing playing fetch with myself & one particular rock...

Just go smack something with it BR...(& i dont mean the dirty girl around the corner... )

[CAVEMAN]

Ammo cost is what sells me on 308, I like that's it's a good price in comparison to other calibers and readily available.

A 303 or 8mm would be lovely, but ammo availability and price is what turns me away.

[bigrich]

Nice flooring look BR... ...Spotted Gum...?

Nice little rifle too...go smack some goats with it before you re-barrel...

the floors vynal , ol' mate . it's bin a bit hard to get out for a hunt lately , all my contacts have bin real busy . it'd be overkill for goats , one of the hottest factory loads is s&b , 196 gn at almost 2600 fps . i tried PPU 175 gn loads that are quite mild so far . the peep sight on it works for me. it's fun snap shooting with it

lol...you crack me up..so innocently missed everything i meant....!!!...

Go back & have a read...I did say "flooring look" ol'mate...!!...
It looks like a "spotted gum" look...just though being your house you might know...not that it matters... ...i just like your (Qld) Spotted Gum mate thats all...laying a deck in it as we speak... :thumbsup

As for the gun... ...If a goat is overkill for it, then go kill a rabbit with it then...i dont care... . ..but surely you gotta smack something with it before you re-barrel it...

Dont you always want to blood a rifle...? ...hell i do...!!!
Good thing i dont like rocks...id still be out there trying to hit a goat...or a bunny with my first rock...& you'd still be wondering what i was doing playing fetch with myself & one particular rock...

Just go smack something with it BR...(& i dont mean the dirty girl around the corner... )

what's wrong with the dirty girl round the corner stix ? yeah i take people quite literally and wear my heart on my sleeve ya jokes went over my head . i get out to hunt and have a poke around any chance i get mate . the 8mm is a 100-150 yard proposition with iron sights for me but

[bigrich]

Ammo cost is what sells me on 308, I like that's it's a good price in comparison to other calibers and readily available.

A 303 or 8mm would be lovely, but ammo availability and price is what turns me away.

well, i understand some folks are on a budget , i reload and don't worry about the cost too much. it's par for the coarse to enjoy some of the old and unique calibers . i spent 30 years spending money on restoring/ modifying old cars. this firearm thing is cheaper 308 is a very good flexable all round caliber, i like old school calibers . 222 rem , 6.5x55 and now 8mm mauser are in my safe . i also have 243 as it's a great all rounder for most stuff i shoot . don't be shy to go after a caliber that takes ya fancy caveman . 35 whelen maybe ?

[Tac308]

I like the concept a lot, heavy fairly powerful rounds, short barrel, robust construction, 10 round capacity, reasonable accuracy at short - mid ranges and relatively cheap to feed.

Another Ruger Scout owner here, I do believe they are a tad over priced for what you get, the action on mine is like the nasty between the legs of a sloppy ol mole left in the dodgy bar at closing time. Took me ages to get the Sob the feed from both the stock MAG and the polymer versions, but after much working now 98% result. The action is clunky and will baulk if treated gently, it's a case of treat it rough, not softly, and it works. The safety is like engaging reverse in the top loader 4 speed, but again, it's more solid than it is refined.

I've shot goats, loads of deer, zillions of pigs, roo, possums, rabbits, dogs, cats, and a couple of bigger things, and it kills everything. Heavier pills can be a tad destructive on meat animals if not placed with care. Cheap to feed compared to a lot, but hold over required for longer ranges can get silly. It does push through light foliage in the scrub quite good though.

It's fired a couple of thousand rounds of 150-180gr ammo and is no less accurate than the first few up the spout, the little barrel is made from some reasonable steel. The bead blasted SS finish is still perfect, although the laminate stock is scarred from countless spotlighting, bush bashing, side by side and even a few helo jaunts.

It bangs pretty darn loud, and the muzzle flash under the light is welding flash intense. But recoil is tame which bellies the 308 impact energy at scrub ranges.

It's easy to transport and Ive flown domestically with it many times, the short hard case is a snack cruising through airports and on various transport, even buses and trains lol.

Mines got a burris illuminated Reticle 4-9 scope, Harris bipod, I fit the laser designator for crop protection duty when not using the big niteforce.

Did I mention the benefit of 308win when the dead start walking the earth Appocolypse ammo ftw.

[ScottyD]

I like the concept a lot, heavy fairly powerful rounds, short barrel, robust construction, 10 round capacity, reasonable accuracy at short - mid ranges and relatively cheap to feed.

Another Ruger Scout owner here, I do believe they are a tad over priced for what you get, the action on mine is like the nasty between the legs of a sloppy ol mole left in the dodgy bar at closing time. Took me ages to get the Sob the feed from both the stock MAG and the polymer versions, but after much working now 98% result. The action is clunky and will baulk if treated gently, it's a case of treat it rough, not softly, and it works. The safety is like engaging reverse in the top loader 4 speed, but again, it's more solid than it is refined.

I've shot goats, loads of deer, zillions of pigs, roo, possums, rabbits, dogs, cats, and a couple of bigger things, and it kills everything. Heavier pills can be a tad destructive on meat animals if not placed with care. Cheap to feed compared to a lot, but hold over required for longer ranges can get silly. It does push through light foliage in the scrub quite good though.

It's fired a couple of thousand rounds of 150-180gr ammo and is no less accurate than the first few up the spout, the little barrel is made from some reasonable steel. The bead blasted SS finish is still perfect, although the laminate stock is scarred from countless spotlighting, bush bashing, side by side and even a few helo jaunts.

It bangs pretty darn loud, and the muzzle flash under the light is welding flash intense. But recoil is tame which bellies the 308 impact energy at scrub ranges.

It's easy to transport and Ive flown domestically with it many times, the short hard case is a snack cruising through airports and on various transport, even buses and trains lol.

Mines got a burris illuminated Reticle 4-9 scope, Harris bipod, I fit the laser designator for crop protection duty when not using the big niteforce.

Did I mention the benefit of 308win when the dead start walking the earth Appocolypse ammo ftw.

Great review of the Ruger, thanks for that. I'm guessing most scout rifles would have similar characteristics, perhaps a bit smoother action with say a Styer . Still seems pretty interesting though (especially when the dead arise )

[8x57]

Betcha Jeff cooper had a 303 Jungle carbine I had a scoped 308 ruger gunsite that was a compact accurate rifle . Open sights don’t work for me. I moved it on as I like old time stuff, and even though it’s practical, there was too much plastic on it for my liking. I’m packing a 8x57 Mauser “carbine” now

Bigrich tell us a bit more about your Mauser carbine .

[Stoney]

The true " Scout " rifle is of course the " Lee Enfield Jungle Carbine ". Short barrel, 10 round mag, slick Enfield action. $100 Jeff Cooper modelled his " Scout Rifle " off of that gun. Literally the bolt action gun you would want, hands down, when the s**t hits the fan.

[linkoln]

Is the Remington 700 considered a scout rifle even with a 20 inch barrel? It will be the next rifle i purchase.

[CAVEMAN]

Not really, it would need iron sights preferably and the ability to mount a forward mounted long eye relief scope. If you had some work done to it but not really.