Fella struggling with 30-06 off the bench

[mickb]

Gents I went to the range with an older friend and his new 30-06 rifle. Hasnt shot for 20 years , previous experience was SKK's and shotguns in the day, no scopes. Didn't go well at the range for him. Started wanting to shoot at 100m until I explained we start at 50m to get the scope on to target at least, then we can do some groups and reach out. Never got past 50m though, shots all over the shop. Tough old guy but I think the recoil was knocking him about firstly. Secondly he has never shot at a bench and wasn't getting his position right. Thirdly I think he expected to be able to do it all easily and was disgruntled and not really listening to my suggestions.

Any suggestions for older blokes reducing recoil at the bench? General tips? Thoughts on recoil from a 30-06 period for shooters in their late 50's? I also havent helped an older bloke learn before, I think its actually easier with younger or brand new shooters, they tend to listen to you! I was even thinking of just grabbing the gun and zeroing it for him myself at one point.

[Member-Deleted]

Try and get him to put a good recoil pad on the rifle for a start if it hasn't already got one

[bladeracer]

Gents I went to the range with an older friend and his new 30-06 rifle. Hasnt shot for 20 years , previous experience was SKK's and shotguns in the day, no scopes. Didn't go well at the range for him. Started wanting to shoot at 100m until I explained we start at 50m to get the scope on to target at least, then we can do some groups and reach out. Never got past 50m though, shots all over the shop. Tough old guy but I think the recoil was knocking him about firstly. Secondly he has never shot at a bench and wasn't getting his position right. Thirdly I think he expected to be able to do it all easily and was disgruntled and not really listening to my suggestions.

Any suggestions for older blokes reducing recoil at the bench? General tips? Thoughts on recoil from a 30-06 period for shooters in their late 50's? I also havent helped an older bloke learn before, I think its actually easier with younger or brand new shooters, they tend to listen to you! I was even thinking of just grabbing the gun and zeroing it for him myself at one point.

Did you have a go yourself to confirm the rifle will actually group with that ammo?

[bigrich]

Older people learning something new don’t like listening or learning from a younger fella at times cause their pride won’t allow it . As a tradesman I’ve had to train a lot of apprentice’s and TA’s over the years and older fellas are the worst. Make your suggestions to your older mate, and if he won’t listen that’s on him . Some people just have to learn the hard way I’m afraid

[Noisydad]

Load with trail boss. He’ll feel a significant reduction in recoil and muzzle blast.

[straightshooter]

Unexpected recoil or impact on body will induce a flinch in anybody regardless of how experienced a shooter that person may be.
Presumably the 30-06 is intended for hunting and not for small group crowing on a forum.
That being the case then the rifle should be shot off the bench much the same way as it would in the field.
Left hand gripping the forend while supported on a bag, firm grip on the pistol grip, right elbow on the bench and stock firmly into the shoulder. Care should be exercised with positioning the scope as far forward as eye relief will allow.
Groups might not be great but at least group center (if you understand the concept) will be much the same as when shot in the field from an average offhand position.

[deanp100]

Whoa on there fella. What’s with this been old in your fifties stuff.

[Stix]

My first thoughts are the same as blade & noisy...

Im curious to know what "shots all over the place" means--as in group size...
Also, what was the ammo--factory/handloads...???
New rifle not accurised with ideal ammo...?...or old n shot out...?
Scope mounts ok...?...everything tight...??

Sounds like more than recoil to me...
You dont have to be a long range or bench rest champion shooter to get a one inch group at 50, providing the rifle & ammo are accurate...

Having said that...trailboss loads can potentially help anyone one get a feel for a rifle & get intimate with the trigger without all the huff & flinch...

Sounds to me he was just pissed at a crap result...& combined with a sharp recoil can easy turn into a tense stiff bodied trigger yanking ball of frustratiin...we've all been there...hell ive wanted to hurl a good few rifles out on the range or into a paddock & have them blow up & burst into flames...

Rifle needs to be checked over, then ammo tested.
It could just be as simple as ammo...

[SCJ429]

Wear a heavy jumper, add weight to the rifle. Shoot a lighter projectile. Reduce the velocity of the projectile if hand loading. Practice a lot. Practice with a 243 before a 30 cal

A 30/06 is not a big recoiling round but if he cannot manage it try a muzzle break.

[TassieTiger]

I Agree with most of what’s been already said but I’d also consider the height of the bench..,
An older friend of mine has similar issues with his 300. He has a limb saver, recoil pad, etc but when we go bench shooting, by making the bench more upright, the butt of the rifle sits more into the shoulder like a walking / hunting shot position, rather than resting on the top of shoulder...

[in2anity]

shoot from offhand sitting or standing. use a stabilising sling to bring in your groups.

[Member-Deleted]

Lots of comments about ammo and loading etc, in reality even the most crap ammo will group reasonably at 50, but as said many times above, need more details otherwise it becomes "how long is a piece of string" having said that be aware that more shooters are more recoil sensitive than they care to admit, for some shooters what most consider a reasonably mild 30-06 is too much to handle, one of my shooting buddies is deadly with anything up to a .270 but go past that and he is all over the shop, but he admits it and recognises the issue.

[gordicans]

hard to know without being there ... did he have chocks under his wheelchair wheels for the recoil? how old was he? unless he had parkinson's I can't see it being an age factor ... pretty silly thread

[Wm.Traynor]

I swear by my P.A.S.T. Recoil Shield.
And I agree with TassieTiger's comment about bench height. The more upright you are, the easier it is to take recoil.
Having said all that, he will have to do some dry firing to settle himself down and practice his follow through.
Getting him to do all that might be a tetch deeficult if he's a bit cranky but Good Luck

[Member-Deleted]

hard to know without being there ... did he have chocks under his wheelchair wheels for the recoil? how old was he? unless he had parkinson's I can't see it being an age factor ... pretty silly thread

+1

[wrenchman]

put it in a shooting rest like a lead sled it will help suck up recoil

[PaddyT]

I only came back to shooting 2 years ago and am now 51, in my 20's i'd only shot in the field and had only shot a 22 a 222 and a 243. All of which were pretty heavy rifles from memory. The first rifle i bought was a 223 in a Tikka Lite and I was a bit suprised by the recoil and probably more by the noise. Took me a fair time to get used to it off the bench in particular. 2 years down the track i just finished sighting in my 3rd center fire- LA102 in 308 and managed two groups of less than 1/2 inch at 100- it does take a bit of getting used to . Actually starting to enjoy the recoil! But it did take me time - and I always dryfire before shooting at the range and often if I have a bad group ill dryfire until i feel im holding still again.Your mate probably needs to shoot a 22 for a bit in between shots with the 30-06.

[Blr243]

I’m only 50 and I don’t want to shoot a 3006 off the bench. And I never have in my life wanted to get booted around by a rifle Sometimes we just have to accept our age and physical limitations ...if we choose to shoot guns we can manage we will enjoy the sport and keep going till we are 90. ..if we push the boundaries of our physical limitations we are only going to get bruised , not enjoy it , and then we will be stuck at a men’s shed. Or at home listening to our wives

[bladeracer]

Lots of comments about ammo and loading etc, in reality even the most crap ammo will group reasonably at 50, but as said many times above, need more details otherwise it becomes "how long is a piece of string" having said that be aware that more shooters are more recoil sensitive than they care to admit, for some shooters what most consider a reasonably mild 30-06 is too much to handle, one of my shooting buddies is deadly with anything up to a .270 but go past that and he is all over the shop, but he admits it and recognises the issue.

Disagree, you can indeed have an ammo/rifle combo that won't group at all, even as very close range. It's worth testing different ammo and shooter before assuming the shooter is the cause.

I have loads that struggle to group 300mm at 50m, in a rifle that is capable of perfectly acceptable 100m groups with ammo it likes.

[Member-Deleted]

bladeracer, you serious 300 at 50, yes I suppose if you fired the 06 through a 12G, yes it is possible but highly unlikely based on any standard half decent rifle with standard factory ammo, but certainly not 300 at 50, if that was a result I got through a reload I would question my ability and go back to buying factory ammo, I have never ever seen a group that large and I worked in the industry for many years, also spent 15 years as a scout in ADF, now there you see some poor groups with 1st time recruits but even they didn't produce a 300mm group at 50

[bladeracer]

bladeracer, you serious 300 at 50, yes I suppose if you fired the 06 through a 12G

You done much work with cast bullets? Can be a bastard getting them to shoot

I'm specifically referring to my Marlin .44 Mag, but I've seen similar with other rifles. A member here recently had great difficulty trying to get his .30-06 to shoot heavy bullets, although it shot lighter bullets just fine.

[Member-Deleted]

bladeracer, you serious 300 at 50, yes I suppose if you fired the 06 through a 12G

You done much work with cast bullets? Can be a bastard getting them to shoot

I'm specifically referring to my Marlin .44 Mag, but I've seen similar with other rifles. A member here recently had great difficulty trying to get his .30-06 to shoot heavy bullets, although it shot lighter bullets just fine.

Not sure mate but he wasn't talking about cast bullets or .44 mag, he was talking about a standard 30-06 and not heavy cast bullets, but rather recoil. amazing how a thread like this can be distorted so much

[marksman]

sounds to me like the guy has a flinch and needs to setup right to be able to shoot properly, I would tell him then back off, its his ammo to waste
there also could be a problem with the rifle

if he hasn't shot a rifle for 20 odd years its a very big ask to expect him not to develop a flinch,
I wouldn't' crowd him give him time he will come and ask for help, then sight it in yourself, get it on paper at 100 for him

[bladeracer]

bladeracer, you serious 300 at 50, yes I suppose if you fired the 06 through a 12G

You done much work with cast bullets? Can be a bastard getting them to shoot

I'm specifically referring to my Marlin .44 Mag, but I've seen similar with other rifles. A member here recently had great difficulty trying to get his .30-06 to shoot heavy bullets, although it shot lighter bullets just fine.

Not sure mate but he wasn't talking about cast bullets or .44 mag, he was talking about a standard 30-06 and not heavy cast bullets, but rather recoil. amazing how a thread like this can be distorted so much

It wasn't distorted, I was offering a real-world example to refute your comment that even the worst ammo will still groùp. If I'd given up on my .44 and simply accepted that it wouldn't shoot, the rifle would've been wasted. Similarly with some of my milsurps that for various reasons are very fussy about bullet choice. I've done plenty of shooting where it's been impossible to hit an A4 sheet at 50m while testing different bullets to determine what my rifles prefer.

[TassieTiger]

My sauer light weight 30-06 recoils more than my friends light tikka 300win...and most ppl shoot their first shot out of it just fine but their second gets pulled 5 inches right...
I’ve videod ppl shooting it, and 95% close their eyes when pulling the trigger and some have simply said no thanks...the 06 can recoil too much for some ppl.

[SCJ429]

bladeracer, you serious 300 at 50, yes I suppose if you fired the 06 through a 12G, yes it is possible but highly unlikely based on any standard half decent rifle with standard factory ammo, but certainly not 300 at 50, if that was a result I got through a reload I would question my ability and go back to buying factory ammo, I have never ever seen a group that large and I worked in the industry for many years, also spent 15 years as a scout in ADF, now there you see some poor groups with 1st time recruits but even they didn't produce a 300mm group at 50

I have seen soldiers using a SLR shoot at a 100 metre figure eight target and not hit it at all with a full magizene. A few years ago now.

More recently I sat next to a guy with an Accuracy International chambered in 338 and his target at 100 looked like it was hit with a shotgun.

Go to any range and you will see some pretty ordinary targets, some of them may have been shot at 50m.

[bigfellascott]

Can I ask why he chose that Cal, is it for hunting or for range work?

[Stix]

Can I ask why he chose that Cal, is it for hunting or for range work?

Probably just one of those deluded boys who think the '06 makes up for their severe lack of penis...
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[bigfellascott]

Can I ask why he chose that Cal, is it for hunting or for range work?

Probably just one of those deluded boys who think the '06 makes up for their severe lack of penis...
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Possibly, it's certainly not a cal I'd choose to kill paper with, off hand it's fine but off a bench no thanks.

[Stix]

Can I ask why he chose that Cal, is it for hunting or for range work?

Probably just one of those deluded boys who think the '06 makes up for their severe lack of penis...
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Possibly, it's certainly not a cal I'd choose to kill paper with, off hand it's fine but off a bench no thanks.

Yea same...
Im not a fan of recoil at all... (but dont tell that to the '06 owners im trying to get a rise out of... )

3 shots of z 270 off a rock hard rest sitting on a concrete bench & im blinking & twitching my way home...