Removing Squids.. larger bore

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Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by cracker » 13 Sep 2019, 11:17 pm

Well 3rd time iv had a squid load, this time on a .505 gibbs and im the goose this time as its my reload!

Poor powder burn or faulty primer? or iv done something wrong...unsure, warrants further study, my gun my fault. (edit dick head loader)

So first time i had squib was with a 458 winmag factory ammo and gun, winchester sorted it out and so they should no big deal, it happens. thank you firearms dealer im not mentioning.

Second time was a mates 9mm pistol his loads his gun and a squib, it happens.... also not really my problem, was easy enough. 4-5" barrel knocked it threw.

Today .505 gibbs 3rd shot, click... no bang... very small powder burn, thinking half charge...68g charge prob even not....takes two charges of 68 for 136g.. or bad primer... unsure, there was some powder when i pulled the bolt back, but i suspect only the primer went off... i had it on video... it sounds.. just like a primer...(ill upload it if anyone is interested, its some what funny... sound like a fart in a pipe)
keeping in mind i single stage hand load everything, but everyone makes mistakes. my gun my problem. perhaps a phone call and i didnt charge the case.

Anyway, whats the standard method of removal of a projectile from a bore, it looks like its only just left the case... was thinking a 12mm piece of wooden dowel and a hammer... tried that with my .458 and gave up basically straight away because...well the guns expensive and i dont want too stuff it... worst case off to a gun smith.. how ever im not sure who id use in victoria now because i believe kudu has retired... dam shame.

im not sure what squibs are like on small bores... but over near an .5" like .458 and .505 think its a bastard, just due to surface area

Any suggestions on removing the squib would be great...
Cheers, Tom
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by pomemax » 13 Sep 2019, 11:32 pm

If you reload at some point you will get them .
I have a brass rod that will fit in a 243/308 barrel just so i just wack the pointy end with the brass rod and a steel hammer (Bunnings if they dont have brass rod brass threaded rod ) dont try hitting the rod with a rubber hammer it will not move but a short sharp smack specialy if just in left the case remove the bolt try with your cleaning rod to touch the back of the pill see just how far in it is if it was just a primmer it will not be far in at all.
wood will just bounce on the pill
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 13 Sep 2019, 11:43 pm

I use aluminium rod from Bunnings for 6.5mm and bigger. For the smailer ones I just use cleaning rods to push them out. I don't think I've ever had to hammer one out.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by cracker » 14 Sep 2019, 12:48 am

thanks for the reply fellas, appreciate it, dont want to go damage my stuff.
pretty disapointed in my self to be honest..its prob my mistake

i had a fail to fire with a 375h&h, "light strike"(loaded in feb) off Ithe model 70, it would have near on 80-90 rounds threw it now,last lot were really hot too,( 69grains of 2208 over 300grains from memory so good) first failure, pretty upset with my self. but what do you do...id put that down to faulty primer the gibbs i dont i recon i suffed up with the .505
the .505 i put down to my failure iv done something wrong, the .375 odd primeri i recon... they are hot .375's but iv worked them up..... and never had an issue... and not being funny ever time i pick up the model 70 in 375h&h i relish how much nicer it is then the cz550 in 458 winmag/lott or .505gibbs.
any case thanks for the replies ill try and remove the big slug tomorrow
thanks, Tom
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by cracker » 14 Sep 2019, 12:49 am

bladeracer wrote:I use aluminium rod from Bunnings for 6.5mm and bigger. For the smailer ones I just use cleaning rods to push them out. I don't think I've ever had to hammer one out.

cheers mate off to the big green shed tomorrow
tom
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by cracker » 14 Sep 2019, 12:54 am

pomemax wrote:If you reload at some point you will get them .
I have a brass rod that will fit in a 243/308 barrel just so i just wack the pointy end with the brass rod and a steel hammer (Bunnings if they dont have brass rod brass threaded rod ) dont try hitting the rod with a rubber hammer it will not move but a short sharp smack specialy if just in left the case remove the bolt try with your cleaning rod to touch the back of the pill see just how far in it is if it was just a primmer it will not be far in at all.
wood will just bounce on the pill

just disappointing is all after all the effort. its not far in the bore at all, i took film of it because it was at like 20yards... and i didnt hear it but the gun goes "pffooot"
1st shoot picked the target up and threw it up .5m and backwards 1m....
i just didnt get it threw ear muffs.. thanks for the input appreciate it.
Tom
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 14 Sep 2019, 7:39 am

cracker wrote:
pomemax wrote:If you reload at some point you will get them .
I have a brass rod that will fit in a 243/308 barrel just so i just wack the pointy end with the brass rod and a steel hammer (Bunnings if they dont have brass rod brass threaded rod ) dont try hitting the rod with a rubber hammer it will not move but a short sharp smack specialy if just in left the case remove the bolt try with your cleaning rod to touch the back of the pill see just how far in it is if it was just a primmer it will not be far in at all.
wood will just bounce on the pill

just disappointing is all after all the effort. its not far in the bore at all, i took film of it because it was at like 20yards... and i didnt hear it but the gun goes "pffooot"
1st shoot picked the target up and threw it up .5m and backwards 1m....
i just didnt get it threw ear muffs.. thanks for the input appreciate it.
Tom


I had a .243 bullet park itself right at the muzzle, just the red tip sticking out. I pulled the bullet from another round and fired it out with the charged case.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by straightshooter » 14 Sep 2019, 7:56 am

At first I thought this thread might be about fishing but eventually I came to this....
"I had a .243 bullet park itself right at the muzzle, just the red tip sticking out. I pulled the bullet from another round and fired it out with the charged case."
Definitely not a very smart thing to do and extremely poor example for anybody to follow, even if it did really happen as described.
At that point in the barrel the bullet most likely would come out with just the gentlest prod of a cleaning rod.
The events leading to the situation haven't been described but if it was due to a primer only load the bullet would possibly have simply fallen out if the barrel was tipped over.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 14 Sep 2019, 8:22 am

straightshooter wrote:At first I thought this thread might be about fishing but eventually I came to this....
"I had a .243 bullet park itself right at the muzzle, just the red tip sticking out. I pulled the bullet from another round and fired it out with the charged case."
Definitely not a very smart thing to do and extremely poor example for anybody to follow, even if it did really happen as described.
At that point in the barrel the bullet most likely would come out with just the gentlest prod of a cleaning rod.
The events leading to the situation haven't been described but if it was due to a primer only load the bullet would possibly have simply fallen out if the barrel was tipped over.


Explain to me exactly which part of this could possibly be dangerous? I have done it several times with zero problems, as have many shooters for several centuries now. Do you know how you remove a ball when you discover you forgot to charge your muzzleloader before seating the ball? You unscrew the nipple, trickle black power into the space behind the ball, reinstall the nipple, cap it, and shoot it out.

All it does is make the cartridge case as long as your barrel, 22" in this case, so pressure is very low.
It happened while I was experimenting to see how low I could take the velocity. It's buddies were making about 275fps so I can only surmise that that is the velocity required to push the bullet about 24", I happened to find one laying on the ground when I went to check the target.

How on earth do you envisage a bullet that has enough friction in the bore to hang onto the bullet despite a powder charge pushing it down the bore, suddenly giving up that friction to be able to drop out of the barrel under gravity? Yes, a gentle prod with a rod will usually remove sqibbed bullets as they've already been swaged into the rifling at that point, but I didn't have a rod with me.
Last edited by bladeracer on 14 Sep 2019, 8:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by madang55 » 14 Sep 2019, 2:29 pm

Had a stuck proj in a martini many moons ago. I was just going to use an appropriately sized metal rod and then I asked the right question of the right person.
As it was only just into the lands, he suggested iuse a good steel cleaning rod so that the contact with the pointy end of the proj is made by the 'female" threaded end of the rod. If I was to use a flat ended rod of some kind, and the proj was really stuck, I ran the risk of flattening out the proj inside the barrel. By using the recessed end of a rod, the proj was being cupped and better pressure points created around the proj. It worked
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 14 Sep 2019, 3:06 pm

madang55 wrote:Had a stuck proj in a martini many moons ago. I was just going to use an appropriately sized metal rod and then I asked the right question of the right person.
As it was only just into the lands, he suggested iuse a good steel cleaning rod so that the contact with the pointy end of the proj is made by the 'female" threaded end of the rod. If I was to use a flat ended rod of some kind, and the proj was really stuck, I ran the risk of flattening out the proj inside the barrel. By using the recessed end of a rod, the proj was being cupped and better pressure points created around the proj. It worked


I doubt it's possible to have a bullet so well stuck that it'd get tighter by pushing it through, certainly not a cast bullet. I'll use a cleaning rod on the small calibers, but I wouldn't risk a $70+ rod if I don't have to, a length of 6mm aluminium rod or dowel is a better idea.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by madang55 » 14 Sep 2019, 3:57 pm

Cheers, I have a few lengths of stainless I have collected. They'll do the trick
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by Blr243 » 14 Sep 2019, 7:08 pm

I also had a hornady parked at the muzzle with just the red tip protruding..... I did not think to use a charge to get it out. I was in the field on a dam at dark waiting for more boars to arrive .... very annoying at prime time to have to pack up and head back to camp to sort it. I used a cleaning rod
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by duncan61 » 14 Sep 2019, 8:03 pm

I messed about with a Harrington and Richards single shot Hornet trying to get subsonic loads before Trailboss was around and stuck a 90 gn matchking halfway up the barrel.It pushed out reasonably easy.The same rifle is chambered in 45/70 so I felt safe experimenting
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by duncan61 » 14 Sep 2019, 8:22 pm

It never worked for me the 80 and 90 gn Matchkings went subsonic but sideways I knew nothing about rifle twist back then.I also loaded my 410 shotgun with a pair of 357 pistol bullets back to back but that did not work either they pretty much fell out the barrel
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by Stix » 14 Sep 2019, 11:08 pm

duncan61 wrote:I messed about with a Harrington and Richards single shot Hornet trying to get subsonic loads before Trailboss was around and stuck a 90 gn matchking halfway up the barrel.It pushed out reasonably easy.The same rifle is chambered in 45/70 so I felt safe experimenting

A 90 gn matchking in a hornet... :shock:
No wonder it got stuck...!!!... :lol:
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by duncan61 » 14 Sep 2019, 11:35 pm

I am sure I started with 4 gn AS50.At 6gn the bullet was subsonic but cut through the paper target sideways and I stopped messing with it
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bigpete » 15 Sep 2019, 1:12 pm

I can honestly say I've never ever ever had a squib load or a double charged load....
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by marksman » 15 Sep 2019, 2:10 pm

I farken love squids
here is a couple me and the boy removed not too long ago :lol: the one hard right is an arrow squid :drinks:

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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bigpete » 15 Sep 2019, 3:17 pm

Yum !
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by Bill » 15 Sep 2019, 4:32 pm

now thats a fair Squid haul !! got a favorite jig marksman ?
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by TassieTiger » 15 Sep 2019, 4:49 pm

When they are frenzied - Those arrow squid are one of the most violent creatures in the sea...and one of the hardest to clean lol.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 15 Sep 2019, 5:22 pm

bigpete wrote:I can honestly say I've never ever ever had a squib load or a double charged load....


I can honestly say the same, never an unexpected one. When you enjoy experimenting, squibs are part of the game. Just like motorcycle racing, if you aren't crashing you aren't learning :-)
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bigpete » 15 Sep 2019, 5:33 pm

Even when experimenting with subsonic 308,I managed to reach the desired result before I reached a squib...one advantage to my method of loading I guess
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 15 Sep 2019, 5:58 pm

bigpete wrote:Even when experimenting with subsonic 308,I managed to reach the desired result before I reached a squib...one advantage to my method of loading I guess


When your goal is tò identify the lowest viable charge weight, squibs are a virtual requirement, if it makes it out the muzzle how do you know you can't go lower :-)
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bigpete » 15 Sep 2019, 6:04 pm

I'd definitely agree with that lol
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by marksman » 16 Sep 2019, 8:44 am

Bill wrote:now thats a fair Squid haul !! got a favorite jig marksman ?


the listing on ebay has ended but this one is a real killer
apparently this one was made for port phillip bay type grass beds

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Harimitsu-S ... 1438.l2649
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by Tank » 18 Sep 2019, 6:33 pm

bladeracer wrote:
madang55 wrote:Had a stuck proj in a martini many moons ago. I was just going to use an appropriately sized metal rod and then I asked the right question of the right person.
As it was only just into the lands, he suggested iuse a good steel cleaning rod so that the contact with the pointy end of the proj is made by the 'female" threaded end of the rod. If I was to use a flat ended rod of some kind, and the proj was really stuck, I ran the risk of flattening out the proj inside the barrel. By using the recessed end of a rod, the proj was being cupped and better pressure points created around the proj. It worked


I doubt it's possible to have a bullet so well stuck that it'd get tighter by pushing it through, certainly not a cast bullet. I'll use a cleaning rod on the small calibers, but I wouldn't risk a $70+ rod if I don't have to, a length of 6mm aluminium rod or dowel is a better idea.


That all makes sense until you look at a cross section of a Martini Henry barrel. It swaged the proje from around .470 down to .450 in stages.....so it will be tighter.

Only squib I ever came across was using a mates 12g reloads.....they sort of just went pmmmf!....and the shot just ‘fell’ out the end of the barrel....thought it was hilarious at the time. Just plain dangerous really.

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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by bladeracer » 18 Sep 2019, 6:42 pm

Tank wrote:That all makes sense until you look at a cross section of a Martini Henry barrel. It staged the proje from around .470 down to .450 in stages.....so it will be tighter.

Only squib I ever came across was using a mates 12g reloads.....they sort of just went pmmmf!....and the shot just ‘fell’ out the end of the barrel....thought it was hilarious at the time. Just plain dangerous really.

Not to be recommended regardless of experience level for shotgun, rifle or handgun.


In that case you would push it toward the chamber.

I've heard of wads staying in the bore, not good.
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Re: Removing Squids.. larger bore

Post by Tank » 18 Sep 2019, 6:53 pm

Thinking on it.....how else would get a rod down a Martini unless it were a BSA International with a cleaning rod hole in the rear of the action.....
So....yeah Blade....attacking it from the muzzle should see it fall out practically....
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