1:8 twist 22-250

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1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 11:32 am

Gday all,just keen to hear some experiences and feed back on using a 1:8 twist barrel on a 22-250. I'm planning to rebarrel my 22-250 soon with one,I'd like to run a bit heavier projectiles than what I am at the moment. Currently anything I try over 55gn shoots like utter ******,mind you,I'm also thinking the barrel is possibly on its way out anyway. It was my late best mates and I've no idea how many rounds he put through it before he passed away,all I know is its 20 years old,I've had it for about 5 years,and I've probably put close to a thousand through it myself. So if anyone has the same potential set up I'd like to hear about it. Also,the gunsmith I spoke to today didn't seem that keen on a 1:8 twist barrel,he reckoned 1:10,so I'm also kinda wondering why that might be. I hopefully intend to use 70gn speer projectiles in it a lot,or either 64gn PowerPoint's or 65gn sierra gamekings. I just can't see why 1:8 would be so terribly bad to be honest. Cheers,Pete
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bladeracer » 18 Jul 2021, 3:27 pm

bigpete wrote:Gday all,just keen to hear some experiences and feed back on using a 1:8 twist barrel on a 22-250. I'm planning to rebarrel my 22-250 soon with one,I'd like to run a bit heavier projectiles than what I am at the moment. Currently anything I try over 55gn shoots like utter ******,mind you,I'm also thinking the barrel is possibly on its way out anyway. It was my late best mates and I've no idea how many rounds he put through it before he passed away,all I know is its 20 years old,I've had it for about 5 years,and I've probably put close to a thousand through it myself. So if anyone has the same potential set up I'd like to hear about it. Also,the gunsmith I spoke to today didn't seem that keen on a 1:8 twist barrel,he reckoned 1:10,so I'm also kinda wondering why that might be. I hopefully intend to use 70gn speer projectiles in it a lot,or either 64gn PowerPoint's or 65gn sierra gamekings. I just can't see why 1:8 would be so terribly bad to be honest. Cheers,Pete



I was looking at ADI's load data (keep in mind that I consider ADI load data to be no better than you'd get throwing darts at a powder graph) a while back wondering about heavier bullets in the .22-250.
I don't have a .22-250, or any interest in owning one, to be able to experiment with this myself.

According to ADI's data:
40gn - .223 3750fps - .22-250 4300fps +550fps
50gn - 3450fps - 3900fps + 450fps
60gn - 3150fps - 3550fps + 400fps
70gn - 3000fps - 3200fps + 200fps
80gn - 2850fps - ADI don't bother listing heavier bullets for .22-250
90gn - 2450fps -

As you can see, you are getting diminishing returns as bullet weight increases in the .22-250, to the point that there may be no advantage at all in using heavier bullets in a tighter twist. Going to an Ackley chamber and a longer barrel would be more useful I think.

.220 Swift numbers show a similar thing:
40gn 4100fps
50gn 3950fps
60gn 3550fps
70gn 3350fps

.223WSM:
40gn 4300fps
50gn 4000fps
60gn 3700fps
70gn 3500fps
80gn 3350fps

Doing research using other data may offer more relevant numbers though.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by Cooper » 18 Jul 2021, 4:27 pm

No experience with a 1 in 8 twist 22-250. But given the bullet weights mentioned a 1in 10 would fine. Not sure how long the 70gr Speer are? But a 1 in 12 would nearly work at 22-250 speeds.

I would tend to go with what the gun smith recommended. Buy maybe he just has a 1 in 10 barrel on the shelf?
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bladeracer » 18 Jul 2021, 4:35 pm

I had a look at Nosler data:
40gn - 3850fps - 4300fps +450fps
50gn - 3500fps - 3950fps +450fps
55gn - 3300fps - 3800fps +500fps
60gn - 3150fps - 3600fps +450fps
65gn - 2900fps - 3450fps +550fps
70gn - 2950fps - 3400fps +450fps
80gn - 2650fps - 3150fps +500fps
85gn - 2450fps - 3100fps +650fps

I've never used Nosler data so have no idea on its veracity, but it shows ~500fps higher velocity over the .223 at all bullet weights.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 4:54 pm

bladeracer wrote:
bigpete wrote:Gday all,just keen to hear some experiences and feed back on using a 1:8 twist barrel on a 22-250. I'm planning to rebarrel my 22-250 soon with one,I'd like to run a bit heavier projectiles than what I am at the moment. Currently anything I try over 55gn shoots like utter ******,mind you,I'm also thinking the barrel is possibly on its way out anyway. It was my late best mates and I've no idea how many rounds he put through it before he passed away,all I know is its 20 years old,I've had it for about 5 years,and I've probably put close to a thousand through it myself. So if anyone has the same potential set up I'd like to hear about it. Also,the gunsmith I spoke to today didn't seem that keen on a 1:8 twist barrel,he reckoned 1:10,so I'm also kinda wondering why that might be. I hopefully intend to use 70gn speer projectiles in it a lot,or either 64gn PowerPoint's or 65gn sierra gamekings. I just can't see why 1:8 would be so terribly bad to be honest. Cheers,Pete



I was looking at ADI's load data (keep in mind that I consider ADI load data to be no better than you'd get throwing darts at a powder graph) a while back wondering about heavier bullets in the .22-250.
I don't have a .22-250, or any interest in owning one, to be able to experiment with this myself.

According to ADI's data:
40gn - .223 3750fps - .22-250 4300fps +550fps
50gn - 3450fps - 3900fps + 450fps
60gn - 3150fps - 3550fps + 400fps
70gn - 3000fps - 3200fps + 200fps
80gn - 2850fps - ADI don't bother listing heavier bullets for .22-250
90gn - 2450fps -

As you can see, you are getting diminishing returns as bullet weight increases in the .22-250, to the point that there may be no advantage at all in using heavier bullets in a tighter twist. Going to an Ackley chamber and a longer barrel would be more useful I think.

.220 Swift numbers show a similar thing:
40gn 4100fps
50gn 3950fps
60gn 3550fps
70gn 3350fps

.223WSM:
40gn 4300fps
50gn 4000fps
60gn 3700fps
70gn 3500fps
80gn 3350fps

Doing research using other data may offer more relevant numbers though.


Fwiw,I dont care about whether it's 200fps or 600fps over a 223. Thats not a concern for me at all. The main aim for me is to be able to run a heavier bullet in case I come across game other than foxes. Also,just because thats what I want lol. Interesting to note that nosler chart,a lot different to ADI data !
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 4:57 pm

Cooper wrote:No experience with a 1 in 8 twist 22-250. But given the bullet weights mentioned a 1in 10 would fine. Not sure how long the 70gr Speer are? But a 1 in 12 would nearly work at 22-250 speeds.

I would tend to go with what the gun smith recommended. Buy maybe he just has a 1 in 10 barrel on the shelf?


He has 1:8 on the shelf too. The speers are reasonably long,obviously not as long as a boat tail but long enough. I have been reading a bit more on the subject and it does appear that OVERstabilisation can possibly be an issue,which is equally a problem.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 18 Jul 2021, 5:10 pm

bigpete wrote:Gday all,just keen to hear some experiences and feed back on using a 1:8 twist barrel on a 22-250. I'm planning to rebarrel my 22-250 soon with one,I'd like to run a bit heavier projectiles than what I am at the moment. Currently anything I try over 55gn shoots like utter ******,mind you,I'm also thinking the barrel is possibly on its way out anyway. It was my late best mates and I've no idea how many rounds he put through it before he passed away,all I know is its 20 years old,I've had it for about 5 years,and I've probably put close to a thousand through it myself. So if anyone has the same potential set up I'd like to hear about it. Also,the gunsmith I spoke to today didn't seem that keen on a 1:8 twist barrel,he reckoned 1:10,so I'm also kinda wondering why that might be. I hopefully intend to use 70gn speer projectiles in it a lot,or either 64gn PowerPoint's or 65gn sierra gamekings. I just can't see why 1:8 would be so terribly bad to be honest. Cheers,Pete


well pete , this is just my layman's opinion , but i think at the velocities that a 22-250 can push a projectile , a 1-8 twist may be twisting the projectiles too fast . can't remember where i read it , but too much rotational speed in a bullet can make it self destruct . i'm sure if i'm wrong someone will correct me

i beleive the standard twist for a 22-250 is 1-14 . it stands to reason that a 1-10 would be spot on for the heavier projectiles you want to run .
i recently sorta-kinda went through a similar thing with my 243 (yes , i remember you don't like 'em pete :D ) , in that i'm only interested in using projectiles in the 87-95 gn range . 87 vmax for longer range pest work, or switching to 95gn nosler bt's for pigs if necessary . standard twist in 243 is 1-10 , which is reaching it's limits to stabilise around the 95-100 gn projectile . IBI barrels from the bigC only come in 1-8 . yup great , my gunsmith agreed that twist should work better with the heavier projectiles than the standard ,and it does . it's only had 26 rounds through the barrel and the term "tackdriver" applies :D

so i reckon go with what your smith recommends , and bigpete will be a happy man :thumbsup:
Last edited by bigrich on 18 Jul 2021, 5:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by JohnV » 18 Jul 2021, 5:11 pm

The problem is the 22-250 is capable of some high velocities and if you start driving that same load and bullet into faster and faster twist rates the pressure can mount up quickly . Small diameter bores and bigger case loads of powder into faster twist barrels can spike pressure quickly . That's why the gunsmith does not like an 8 twist . The best idea is to use the minimum twist rate the bullet length needs to stabilize over the ranges used and don't go so heavy that the longer bullet will reduce powder room anyway .
The 65 grain Sierra GK will need a 1 in 10 at 3000 to 3300 fps span . What the max SAFE velocity and pressure will actually be in a 1 in 10 has to be found carefully .
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 18 Jul 2021, 5:16 pm

JohnV wrote:The problem is the 22-250 is capable of some high velocities and if you start driving that same load and bullet into faster and faster twist rates the pressure can mount up quickly . Small diameter bores and bigger case loads of powder into faster twist barrels can spike pressure quickly . That's why the gunsmith does not like an 8 twist . The best idea is to use the minimum twist rate the bullet length needs to stabilize over the ranges used and don't go so heavy that the longer bullet will reduce powder room anyway .
The 65 grain Sierra GK will need a 1 in 10 at 3000 to 3300 fps span . What the max SAFE velocity and pressure will actually be in a 1 in 10 has to be found carefully .


sometimes when you start "hot rodding" and custom building stuff the rule book can go out the window :unknown: i reckon your right about preasures and such during load developement :thumbsup:
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 5:16 pm

JohnV wrote:The problem is the 22-250 is capable of some high velocities and if you start driving that same load and bullet into faster and faster twist rates the pressure can mount up quickly . Small diameter bores and bigger case loads of powder into faster twist barrels can spike pressure quickly . That's why the gunsmith does not like an 8 twist . The best idea is to use the minimum twist rate the bullet length needs to stabilize over the ranges used and don't go so heavy that the longer bullet will reduce powder room anyway .
The 65 grain Sierra GK will need a 1 in 10 at 3000 to 3300 fps span . What the max SAFE velocity and pressure will actually be in a 1 in 10 has to be found carefully .


Ah ok. That makes sense.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 5:18 pm

bigrich wrote:
bigpete wrote:Gday all,just keen to hear some experiences and feed back on using a 1:8 twist barrel on a 22-250. I'm planning to rebarrel my 22-250 soon with one,I'd like to run a bit heavier projectiles than what I am at the moment. Currently anything I try over 55gn shoots like utter ******,mind you,I'm also thinking the barrel is possibly on its way out anyway. It was my late best mates and I've no idea how many rounds he put through it before he passed away,all I know is its 20 years old,I've had it for about 5 years,and I've probably put close to a thousand through it myself. So if anyone has the same potential set up I'd like to hear about it. Also,the gunsmith I spoke to today didn't seem that keen on a 1:8 twist barrel,he reckoned 1:10,so I'm also kinda wondering why that might be. I hopefully intend to use 70gn speer projectiles in it a lot,or either 64gn PowerPoint's or 65gn sierra gamekings. I just can't see why 1:8 would be so terribly bad to be honest. Cheers,Pete


well pete , this is just my layman's opinion , but i think at the velocities that a 22-250 can push a projectile , a 1-8 twist may be twisting the projectiles too fast . can't remember where i read it , but too much rotational speed in a bullet can make it self destruct . i'm sure if i'm wrong someone will correct me

i beleive the standard twist for a 22-250 is 1-14 . it stands to reason that a 1-10 would be spot on for the heavier projectiles you want to run .
i recently sorta-kinda went through a similar thing with my 243 (yes , i remember you don't like 'em pete :D ) , in that i'm only interested in using projectiles in the 87-95 gn range . 87 vmax for longer range pest work, or switching to 95gn nosler bt's for pigs if necessary . standard twist in 243 is 1-10 , which is reaching it's limits to stabilise around the 95-100 gn projectile . IBI barrels from the bigC only come in 1-8 . yup great , my gunsmith agreed that twist should work better with the heavier projectiles than the standard ,and it does . it's only had 26 rounds through the barrel and the term "tackdriver" applies :D

so i reckon go with what your smith recommends , and bigpete will be a happy man :thumbsup:


Interestingly enough, I considered just making it 250 savage,but then I'd need to buy new dies ! Lol
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bladeracer » 18 Jul 2021, 5:25 pm

bigpete wrote:Fwiw,I dont care about whether it's 200fps or 600fps over a 223. Thats not a concern for me at all. The main aim for me is to be able to run a heavier bullet in case I come across game other than foxes. Also,just because thats what I want lol. Interesting to note that nosler chart,a lot different to ADI data !


Yes, I understand that. I was just putting forward something I'd found when I was investigating the potential myself.
All load data are just ballpark data, there are too many variables in the loading technique to cover them all.
And nowadays it's too easy for companies to just feed numbers to a computer and totally ignore any real-world testing.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 18 Jul 2021, 5:26 pm

250 savage is a good caliber , so is 257 bob . actually , a wildcat in the same group i haven't heard much of is 308-25 . you could neck up 243 brass maybe :unknown:

anyway ,what your aiming to do with your 22-250 is acheivable , but going faster twist to stabilise heavier projectiles may drop some accuracy with lighter projectiles . ballistics is a compromise at times :D
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 5:35 pm

bigrich wrote:250 savage is a good caliber , so is 257 bob . actually , a wildcat in the same group i haven't heard much of is 308-25 . you could neck up 243 brass maybe :unknown:

anyway ,what your aiming to do with your 22-250 is acheivable , but going faster twist to stabilise heavier projectiles may drop some accuracy with lighter projectiles . ballistics is a compromise at times :D


I don't mind if I lose accuracy with lighter projectiles,I'm aware that I most likely will but thats more than fine.
I have considered 260 rem,250 savage,25-08,hell even 243 ! But the simplest and cheapest is to just stick with what I've got and set it up to run heavier pills. Plus....I am beginning to suspect she's worn out....
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bladeracer » 18 Jul 2021, 5:36 pm

bigrich wrote:well pete , this is just my layman's opinion , but i think at the velocities that a 22-250 can push a projectile , a 1-8 twist may be twisting the projectiles too fast . can't remember where i read it , but too much rotational speed in a bullet can make it self destruct . i'm sure if i'm wrong someone will correct me

i beleive the standard twist for a 22-250 is 1-14 . it stands to reason that a 1-10 would be spot on for the heavier projectiles you want to run .
i recently sorta-kinda went through a similar thing with my 243 (yes , i remember you don't like 'em pete :D ) , in that i'm only interested in using projectiles in the 87-95 gn range . 87 vmax for longer range pest work, or switching to 95gn nosler bt's for pigs if necessary . standard twist in 243 is 1-10 , which is reaching it's limits to stabilise around the 95-100 gn projectile . IBI barrels from the bigC only come in 1-8 . yup great , my gunsmith agreed that twist should work better with the heavier projectiles than the standard ,and it does . it's only had 26 rounds through the barrel and the term "tackdriver" applies :D

so i reckon go with what your smith recommends , and bigpete will be a happy man :thumbsup:


I found that 52gn bullets swaged from .22LR brass (a very thin jacket) will start to come apart over 3000fps in my 8"-twist barrel, at 3300fps none of these bullets reached the target. This is the region from 270,000rpm to 297,000rpm. The guy that made them was shooting them in a 12"-twist .22-250 at much higher velocities with no problems, but to make 270,000rpm in a 12"-twist requires 4500fps. I've shot 35gn Hornady bullets at 3900fps in my .223 with no problems, making 351,000fps, but commercially made bullets have thicker jackets. I haven't heard too many anecdotes of commercial bullets vaporising at "normal" velocities. Larger diameter bullets will suffer more, but it's harder to push them to such velocities.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bladeracer » 18 Jul 2021, 5:40 pm

bigpete wrote:He has 1:8 on the shelf too. The speers are reasonably long,obviously not as long as a boat tail but long enough. I have been reading a bit more on the subject and it does appear that OVERstabilisation can possibly be an issue,which is equally a problem.


I think over-stabilisation is more of a problem at longer ranges.
The bullet follows a trajectory arc, but if the bullet has too much spin, it will refuse to "steer" along the trajectory, and will take on a high angle-of-attack. The nose will be pointing above the flight line of the bullet, creating drag (like an aircraft flaring for landing), and destroying the BC of the bullet. It can still be accurate, it just won't follow any BC calculations.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 18 Jul 2021, 5:44 pm

Then thats not an issue either. I'm no sniper,and have no desire to pretend to be. Tbh I rarely shoot beyond 100m,and never beyond 200m. I have zero need to
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 18 Jul 2021, 5:48 pm

bladeracer wrote:
bigrich wrote:well pete , this is just my layman's opinion , but i think at the velocities that a 22-250 can push a projectile , a 1-8 twist may be twisting the projectiles too fast . can't remember where i read it , but too much rotational speed in a bullet can make it self destruct . i'm sure if i'm wrong someone will correct me

i beleive the standard twist for a 22-250 is 1-14 . it stands to reason that a 1-10 would be spot on for the heavier projectiles you want to run .
i recently sorta-kinda went through a similar thing with my 243 (yes , i remember you don't like 'em pete :D ) , in that i'm only interested in using projectiles in the 87-95 gn range . 87 vmax for longer range pest work, or switching to 95gn nosler bt's for pigs if necessary . standard twist in 243 is 1-10 , which is reaching it's limits to stabilise around the 95-100 gn projectile . IBI barrels from the bigC only come in 1-8 . yup great , my gunsmith agreed that twist should work better with the heavier projectiles than the standard ,and it does . it's only had 26 rounds through the barrel and the term "tackdriver" applies :D

so i reckon go with what your smith recommends , and bigpete will be a happy man :thumbsup:


I found that 52gn bullets swaged from .22LR brass (a very thin jacket) will start to come apart over 3000fps in my 8"-twist barrel, at 3300fps none of these bullets reached the target. This is the region from 270,000rpm to 297,000rpm. The guy that made them was shooting them in a 12"-twist .22-250 at much higher velocities with no problems, but to make 270,000rpm in a 12"-twist requires 4500fps. I've shot 35gn Hornady bullets at 3900fps in my .223 with no problems, making 351,000fps, but commercially made bullets have thicker jackets. I haven't heard too many anecdotes of commercial bullets vaporising at "normal" velocities. Larger diameter bullets will suffer more, but it's harder to push them to such velocities.


yeah blade, this is the sort of stuff and issues i was thinking of . bloody laws of physics hey ? :D
i'm of the opinion , in my 243 , cause i'm running a faster twist to stabilise my heavier projectiles i actually will get good accuracy with less projectile speed . i'm thinking that based on experience with other rifles, barrels get good accuracy at certain points of bullet forward speed and rotational speed . change one of these things and you have to adjust the other . twist rate is the change . faster twist so slow the forward speed a little . at least that's how it appears to me ya never stop learning . just my 2cents :thumbsup:
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by JohnV » 18 Jul 2021, 5:48 pm

Jacketed bullets blowing up can be caused by a few things .
Thin weak jackets .
Fractured jackets ( popped jacket )
Very hard brittle jackets
Rough deep engraving rifling .( cut rifling worst )
Long barrels .
High velocity / spin rate making the above more likely .
There is a couple of others I can't recall .
Usually a combination of the above will do it .
Berger had a problem some years back with it's target bullets with a thin J4 jacket blowing up in cut rifled barrels , Krieger I think . It was just a bad match of deep not so smooth lands and thin jackets driven hard . Now Bergers target bullet has a thicker jacket .
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by Wyliecoyote » 18 Jul 2021, 11:21 pm

JohnV wrote:Jacketed bullets blowing up can be caused by a few things .
Thin weak jackets .
Fractured jackets ( popped jacket )
Very hard brittle jackets
Rough deep engraving rifling .( cut rifling worst )
Long barrels .
High velocity / spin rate making the above more likely .
There is a couple of others I can't recall .
Usually a combination of the above will do it .
Berger had a problem some years back with it's target bullets with a thin J4 jacket blowing up in cut rifled barrels , Krieger I think . It was just a bad match of deep not so smooth lands and thin jackets driven hard . Now Bergers target bullet has a thicker jacket .



The problem as discribed with Berger bullets actually had nothing to do with barrels. The problem was clearly with J4 jackets being too thin and at that time there was an unfounded presumption that the jackets could be comprimised by rifling of certain types.
Specifically it was the 140 grain 6.5 VLDs coming apart in 6.5/284s during Fclass and 1000 yard BR matches. Not all were experiencing bullet blow ups at any time but many were seeing inexplicable bullets dropping out of the sky. Ogive slump from hard spin up was causing the bullets to change profile, altering BC and slowing up quicker destroying groups and scores. There was also some speculation that certain batches were having issues with midfolds, a major bullet manufacturing problem in any true VLD. Some also claimed that the change in DA could be a possible cause. While DA may be a consideration if running an 8.5 over an 8 twist and coming from high altitude down to sea level, the issue would have been instability and not disintegration. Interestingly many did run 8.5s to overcome the bullet failure only to have bullets tumble at levels below 500 ft. The easy cure at that time was 142 Sierra matchkings or Carterucio 142s, made on Sierra jackets.

Berger then re-evaluated its line and has since sold J4 and now produces bullets on thin, Target, Hunting etc or thick jackets, Hybrid etc designed to take higher spin rates. Stecker sent bullets out to well known shooters in various disciplines to test for Berger because they had no facility to test their bullets. The feedback over time has led to the current line of match bullets. To give you a very specific instance, the Berger 210 VLD Target was initially marked in their lineup as requiring an 8 twist to properly stabilise. Running that recommendation some big 30 cal magnums were having them come apart at speeds over 3k. At 2850 they were spectacular. Some shooters began experimenting with 10 , 11 and 12 twist barrels. The theory was simple, maintain the rpm by increasing the velocity in a slower twist rate to see what happens. Berger 210 VLD Target bullets are now universally shot from 11 twist barrels in the bigger magnums. There were failures in 8 twist barrels at higher velocities because the mechanical limits had been exceeded. Barrel configurations had nothing to do with the failures because they were seen to occur in every brand of barrel.
Barrels claimed to be causing blowups often came down to worn throats, belled muzzles through the use of barrel threads for muzzle brakes being too small in diameter or just belled out from wear which is quite common. Many shooters seem oblivious to the fact that this does happen quite regularly as a barrel ages.

There was some thought that an even number of lands may have contributed to bullet failures and uneven numbers like 5R and 5C didn't. Krieger makes any configuration one wants, and in many gunsmiths and shooters views, they are amongst the best internal finished barrels made.
To put it very simply, the three causes of bullet blow ups that happen within the parameters of design are a rough throat or worn bore tearing jackets, belled out muzzles and lastly the bullet itself not being fit for purpose. Suggesting some barrel brands or configuration may or may not cause bullet failure is purely hearsay and not based on any anecdotal data. The very same barrels accused of being the culprit are now setting records with the new-found jacket designs. Specifically 4 groove Krieger cut rifling barrels and Hybrid bullets. The 4 groove configuration being claimed by some to key in the bullet core from deeper bullet engraving thus having the effect of the jacket and core rpm differential minimised quicker leading to better accuracy. Theory of course but these barrels win a lot and set records continually beyond proportion.

The cartridge in the OPs question, the 22/250, or in my experience, the Ackley versions in both 29 and 40 gegree shoulders, were used a bit in the early days of Fclass. Using 8 twist barrels the 80 SMK at around 3200 to 3300 fps was good for a bit over 800 rounds where often after that point the owners dialled them back. It was not uncommon to get misses as the barrels aged, not a stray shot, but a bullet blowing up from a rough throat, bore etc. A 22/250 AI that saw 1200 rounds of competition was at about its limit and then some. Inspection of the bores of some of these barrels showed virtually no rifling for considerable inches. It amazed me they got as far as they did but proved that at some point the bullet jackets, the Sierras being as good as they are, just give up.

Another point, there is no such term as over stabilisation. A bullet is either stable or not. A bullet can be over spun (rpms beyond a required point of full stabilisation) to cause excess bullet dispersion from its line of departure or spun to the point of bullet failure. But being so, at its point of terminal flight, it was fully stable even if it did detonate. The phrase infers that it somehow attains a physical property beyond stabilisation.

If the OP chooses to go with a 22/250 and 8 twist barrel, there are many options to choose from right up to 80 grains. If you do choose to run light bullets i would suggest Nosler solid base bullets straight up. There are numerous 22x47 Lapuas running around using them in 8 twist barrels with speeds of the 40 and 50 grainers doing beyond 4300 fps. The solid base and tapered jacket design of these bullets makes them virtually oblivious to very high spin rates.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by Oldbloke » 18 Jul 2021, 11:56 pm

Perhaps crunch a few numbers here.

https://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by Grandadbushy » 19 Jul 2021, 12:06 am

G'day bigrich, mate i've had a 1-8 in 22-250 shot excellent with hornady 69gr projectiles also had one in 22-250 AI, problem i had with both was if you tried to go too light in projectiles they'd blow out i tried up to 80 gr but had no success one could talk about, i then rebarrelled both a year apart to 1-12 this was a more stable twist could still shoot 69gr but 60gr was perfect i then rebarrelled the AI to 1-10 but it was no better than the 1-8 or 1-12 the problem i found with trying to go from heavy to light projectiles in the same rifle in 250 with 1-8 was pressure and light to heavy was drop in poi in a big way i reckon if i was to do it again i would prefer to tighten the twist in a 223 to shoot heavier projectiles and shoot lighter as well there is a lot less pressures to worry about and with lighter projectiles you can get them moving as well my last barrel on the 250 sako was 1-14 i could go from 55gr to 40gr without altering my scope, it preferred the 55gr but i've now rebarrelled it back to 1-14 but it likes 50gr best i've tried to get it to shoot the 55's but i was wasting my time 3/4'' was best but the 50's shoot 5 into a 5cent piece so i'll stick with them mate the 22-250 in my opinion was designed to travel at speed for best effect with average weight projectiles once you start loading them up with weight and twist they die and produce high chamber pressures as was said above by someone, also barrel life is considerably less i believe a 243's would handle what you want better than the 250, just my point and experiences mate hope some may help :drinks:
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by deye243 » 19 Jul 2021, 3:41 am

The 22 250 was not a designed case it was merely a neck down 250 Savage .
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 19 Jul 2021, 4:47 am

Grandadbushy wrote:G'day bigrich, mate i've had a 1-8 in 22-250 shot excellent with hornady 69gr projectiles also had one in 22-250 AI, problem i had with both was if you tried to go too light in projectiles they'd blow out i tried up to 80 gr but had no success one could talk about, i then rebarrelled both a year apart to 1-12 this was a more stable twist could still shoot 69gr but 60gr was perfect i then rebarrelled the AI to 1-10 but it was no better than the 1-8 or 1-12 the problem i found with trying to go from heavy to light projectiles in the same rifle in 250 with 1-8 was pressure and light to heavy was drop in poi in a big way i reckon if i was to do it again i would prefer to tighten the twist in a 223 to shoot heavier projectiles and shoot lighter as well there is a lot less pressures to worry about and with lighter projectiles you can get them moving as well my last barrel on the 250 sako was 1-14 i could go from 55gr to 40gr without altering my scope, it preferred the 55gr but i've now rebarrelled it back to 1-14 but it likes 50gr best i've tried to get it to shoot the 55's but i was wasting my time 3/4'' was best but the 50's shoot 5 into a 5cent piece so i'll stick with them mate the 22-250 in my opinion was designed to travel at speed for best effect with average weight projectiles once you start loading them up with weight and twist they die and produce high chamber pressures as was said above by someone, also barrel life is considerably less i believe a 243's would handle what you want better than the 250, just my point and experiences mate hope some may help :drinks:


Thanks for the input on this subject GDB . There’s been a lot of science discussed on this, to hear from someone who’s been there and done it will be of use to bigpete who’s been pondering the issue.
Learned a bit more from the posters on this topic, I got involved in the discussion just for the knowledge.
It interested me cause I had a similar project jumping from 1-10 to 1-8 in my 243 . I’ve had great results from that . Hopefully bigpete’s project will work well too :thumbsup:
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 19 Jul 2021, 6:30 am

Oldbloke wrote:Perhaps crunch a few numbers here.

https://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/


Done that a couple of weeks ago. I believe they recommended ac1:7 twist!
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 19 Jul 2021, 6:33 am

bigrich wrote:
Grandadbushy wrote:G'day bigrich, mate i've had a 1-8 in 22-250 shot excellent with hornady 69gr projectiles also had one in 22-250 AI, problem i had with both was if you tried to go too light in projectiles they'd blow out i tried up to 80 gr but had no success one could talk about, i then rebarrelled both a year apart to 1-12 this was a more stable twist could still shoot 69gr but 60gr was perfect i then rebarrelled the AI to 1-10 but it was no better than the 1-8 or 1-12 the problem i found with trying to go from heavy to light projectiles in the same rifle in 250 with 1-8 was pressure and light to heavy was drop in poi in a big way i reckon if i was to do it again i would prefer to tighten the twist in a 223 to shoot heavier projectiles and shoot lighter as well there is a lot less pressures to worry about and with lighter projectiles you can get them moving as well my last barrel on the 250 sako was 1-14 i could go from 55gr to 40gr without altering my scope, it preferred the 55gr but i've now rebarrelled it back to 1-14 but it likes 50gr best i've tried to get it to shoot the 55's but i was wasting my time 3/4'' was best but the 50's shoot 5 into a 5cent piece so i'll stick with them mate the 22-250 in my opinion was designed to travel at speed for best effect with average weight projectiles once you start loading them up with weight and twist they die and produce high chamber pressures as was said above by someone, also barrel life is considerably less i believe a 243's would handle what you want better than the 250, just my point and experiences mate hope some may help :drinks:


Thanks for the input on this subject GDB . There’s been a lot of science discussed on this, to hear from someone who’s been there and done it will be of use to bigpete who’s been pondering the issue.
Learned a bit more from the posters on this topic, I got involved in the discussion just for the knowledge.
It interested me cause I had a similar project jumping from 1-10 to 1-8 in my 243 . I’ve had great results from that . Hopefully bigpete’s project will work well too :thumbsup:


I'll confess I am thinking 1:10 will be better now.
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 19 Jul 2021, 7:19 am

If it were me Pete, I’d go the 1-10. :thumbsup:
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigpete » 19 Jul 2021, 8:36 am

Geezus,I even briefly wondered maybe I should just go 243.....
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by Grandadbushy » 19 Jul 2021, 8:42 am

:thumbsup: sorry about the name mix up the text was for bigpete but hey not much difference from bigpete to bigrich :D :thumbsup: yeah spot on bigrich, i'd go 1-10 for what you are asking bigpete it'll handle at least 69gr projectiles down to 50gr comfortably i only stay with the 1-14 because the rifle is only used for dogs and smaller pests, with the 1-12 60gr was pretty much the limit of stability for me but would handle lower than 50gr comfortably ( i'm talking deadly accuracy here they will shoot heavier or lighter but accuracy, pressure and drop will weigh heavy if you do so) other people may have a different opinion but that's what i have learned from my experiences with trial and error and at the end of the day i've found that a good 55gr will kill almost anything up to medium game with a well placed shot :thumbsup: :drinks:
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Re: 1:8 twist 22-250

Post by bigrich » 19 Jul 2021, 9:18 am

bigpete wrote:Geezus,I even briefly wondered maybe I should just go 243.....


Yeah well, that’s what the 243 was intended for, long distance varmiter that can also serve as a white tail deer rifle. I don’t want to shoot light high velocity projectiles out of mine. Slower moving vmax 87’s will work for me for small pests , 95 grain for big pests. I realise there’s not much weight difference, but projectile performance due to bullet construction is the consideration.243’s aren’t known for a long barrel life. I’m using mine as a “little brother “ to my 270 . Less powder and recoil
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