Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Bolt action rifles, lever action, pump action, self loading rifles and other miscellaneous longarms.

Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 10 Nov 2021, 7:49 pm

Not a review, just a few thoughts. I am fortunate enough to be able to have both the Australian made Warwick WFA1L and the Oceania Precision SP15.

Both cost about the same. You wont get much change for 4 grand.

The Oceania is lighter. In fact with a 14inch barrel it is very light at only 2.7kg(without scope or loaded mag). It feels like a toy but you could easily carry it all day out in the scrub. The Warwick with a 16inch barrel feels to me at nearly 3.5kg. It has a much heaver hand guard compared to the Oceania.

Both are incredibly well made solid rifles that shoot very accurately. I sighted in at 100m and was shooting out to 400m with ease. They are both chambered in 223 Wylde so they can shoot 5.56 NATO and 223Rem safely. The Oceania comes with a dust cover which is a nice feature.

In Queensland both are bolt action category B rifles. The Warwick is fitted with a FABA(Forward Action Bolt Assist) kit which is made in South Australia an only requires an allen key to instal or uninstall. The FABA kit slides on to the rail of the fore end and a hook is attached to the charging handle. So you can keep your hand on the fore end and slide it back to extract the spent round and move it forward to load a new round. This motion causes the charging handle to move back and forth keeping it a bolt action instead of a traditional pump.

If you are in the market for an Australian made rifle and can only choose one. I would probably have to say the Warwick. Whilst I believe the Oceania is a more accurate and better feeling rifle the Warwick has the ability to essentially be a pump and a bolt action with the installation of the FABA kit. Thus it can fulfil two different roles. Both are not bench guns and are designed for scrub use to take an accurate shot at a dog or a small pig and allow a few quick follow up shots. Both could be used in IPSC or some other kind of practical shooting sport.

Thanks for reading.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 10 Nov 2021, 7:55 pm

The Warwick is made in Victoria and the Oceania in New South. Whilst being made in New South they still cant own them down there which must be frustrating.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 10 Nov 2021, 9:33 pm

Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:The Warwick is made in Victoria and the Oceania in New South. Whilst being made in New South they still cant own them down there which must be frustrating.


I don't think the tiny market for these makes it that big a problem.
If they were realistically priced, and offered something other than "pretend AR15" then they'd have a market, and then it would be frustrating to not be able to own them. Not many shooters are interested in the design, and of those that might be, few are willing to pay such a premium for it.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by scoot » 11 Nov 2021, 6:39 am

What's the difference between Oceania's sp15 and sp25.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 11 Nov 2021, 9:39 am

bladeracer wrote:
Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:The Warwick is made in Victoria and the Oceania in New South. Whilst being made in New South they still cant own them down there which must be frustrating.


I don't think the tiny market for these makes it that big a problem.
If they were realistically priced, and offered something other than "pretend AR15" then they'd have a market, and then it would be frustrating to not be able to own them. Not many shooters are interested in the design, and of those that might be, few are willing to pay such a premium for it.



It is a small market but it is good that we have local manufactures. I did see the owner of Waraick post that whilst he has demand from NSW he is kept busy from QLD, SA, NT and VIC. So even if it was legal in NSW they could not service them.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 11 Nov 2021, 9:41 am

scoot wrote:What's the difference between Oceania's sp15 and sp25.


Think AR10 and AR15. The sp15 is a small frame like the ar15 and comes in 223, 300blk and I believe 350 ledgend. The sp25 is a large form like the ar10 and comes in 308 and 6.5creadmore.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by scoot » 11 Nov 2021, 12:05 pm

Roger that, thanks.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Gun-nut » 11 Nov 2021, 2:27 pm

How's the reliability between the two? I know Ozziereviews had issues with his oceania that he reviewed that caused quite a storm.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 11 Nov 2021, 2:42 pm

Gun-nut wrote:How's the reliability between the two? I know Ozziereviews had issues with his oceania that he reviewed that caused quite a storm.



Perfect. I have had no dramas.

That review from Ozzie is very misleading and he should make a correction but he is to arrogant. That particular rifle in question was fairly used and not well maintained.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by MontyShooter » 11 Nov 2021, 4:06 pm

Given the waitlist for a Warwick, I'd say the market for it is big enough already. Had mine for about 5 years and love it.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by InisBineest » 11 Nov 2021, 9:27 pm

I've had my WFA1L for a few years not, even bought a separate upper to run 223 and 300blk +FABA interchangeably and it's brilliant for my purposes. I'd love to have an SP-15 as well, but as mentioned, neither brand are cheap. I can say for me, worth every cent. And being cheaky, I purchased a trigger from OP to fit in my Warwick, a small but welcome improvement at the time (although I believe WFA1L rifles now come with a nicer two stage trigger, compared to the heavy single stage mine was supplied with)
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by keenstalking22 » 13 Nov 2021, 2:37 am

The Oceania is also M-lok... what happens if you try to jury rig the FABA kit to it?

I really wanted to purchase the Oceania but was devastated when they said they only made left hand charging models. I really wanted a nice handy rifle I could use for a bit of fun and hunting, but in my opinion the wfa1l is too heavy to do this optimally.

I dont understand you right handers using the rifle like that but what ever. I only hope they regain saneness and release right hand charging models or ambidextrous ones again.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 13 Nov 2021, 5:43 am

keenstalking22 wrote:The Oceania is also M-lok... what happens if you try to jury rig the FABA kit to it?

I really wanted to purchase the Oceania but was devastated when they said they only made left hand charging models. I really wanted a nice handy rifle I could use for a bit of fun and hunting, but in my opinion the wfa1l is too heavy to do this optimally.

I dont understand you right handers using the rifle like that but what ever. I only hope they regain saneness and release right hand charging models or ambidextrous ones again.


I haven't looked at the design, but is it difficult to modify to ambidextrous charging?
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by keenstalking22 » 14 Nov 2021, 3:20 am

bladeracer wrote:
keenstalking22 wrote:The Oceania is also M-lok... what happens if you try to jury rig the FABA kit to it?

I really wanted to purchase the Oceania but was devastated when they said they only made left hand charging models. I really wanted a nice handy rifle I could use for a bit of fun and hunting, but in my opinion the wfa1l is too heavy to do this optimally.

I dont understand you right handers using the rifle like that but what ever. I only hope they regain saneness and release right hand charging models or ambidextrous ones again.


I haven't looked at the design, but is 8t difficult to modify to ambidextrous charging?


Not impossible but a lot of work to convert a non ambidextrous one into an ambidextrous model. You would need to cut a line into the upper reciever for the bolt handle to follow, and then drill into the bolt carrier group something to accept a bolt handle.

They actually made a model like this, but then quickly discontinued it. Which sounds dumb as it sounds outright superior.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 14 Nov 2021, 9:06 am

I would start by fabricating a U-shaped stirrup attached to the bolt handle, extending along the right side of the receiver, then looping across the top of the hand guard to the left side, with a knob on the end of it. If that works okay then look at a pic-rail mount to stabilise it. You can extend the left side back as far as you want, or even make it adjustable.

.Maybe they found having two slots weakened the receiver or allowed too much gas to blow out of the receiver.

Something that really annoyed me with the Yarra Sheila design was their insistence on a bloody forward assist. Additional machining that serves zero purpose on a design they were trying to bring to market for half the cost of the competition is idiocy. I found that to be going pretend-AR at the expense of sound design. Same as using AR mags, which are not cheap or readily available here, unlike many better options, again crippling the design to try to be "the AR you have when you can't have an AR". Concentrate on building a great design at a great price and forget about AR's.

keenstalking22 wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
keenstalking22 wrote:The Oceania is also M-lok... what happens if you try to jury rig the FABA kit to it?

I really wanted to purchase the Oceania but was devastated when they said they only made left hand charging models. I really wanted a nice handy rifle I could use for a bit of fun and hunting, but in my opinion the wfa1l is too heavy to do this optimally.

I dont understand you right handers using the rifle like that but what ever. I only hope they regain saneness and release right hand charging models or ambidextrous ones again.


I haven't looked at the design, but is it difficult to modify to ambidextrous charging?


Not impossible but a lot of work to convert a non ambidextrous one into an ambidextrous model. You would need to cut a line into the upper reciever for the bolt handle to follow, and then drill into the bolt carrier group something to accept a bolt handle.

They actually made a model like this, but then quickly discontinued it. Which sounds dumb as it sounds outright superior.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 14 Nov 2021, 10:17 am

Come on Bladeracer AR mags are everywhere, well they are in Queensland at least. A fair few rifles now use them. The point of the AR platform is the modulability. The AR buffer tube allows you to put on any butt stock you like and the same goes with the pistol grip and the handguard. They are a small frame rifle designed for modulability and a huge array of “aftermarket” parts to suit each individual user.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 14 Nov 2021, 11:16 am

Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:Come on Bladeracer AR mags are everywhere, well they are in Queensland at least. A fair few rifles now use them. The point of the AR platform is the modulability. The AR buffer tube allows you to put on any butt stock you like and the same goes with the pistol grip and the handguard. They are a small frame rifle designed for modulability and a huge array of “aftermarket” parts to suit each individual user.


I am a fan of the AR modularity for sure, all my hunting rifles use AR components. But I can't believe 5rd and 10rd AR15 mags are "common" anywhere in Oz, what platforms use them?

But designing a rifle for the Australian market, focused on looking like an AR15, is just stupid and drives the cost up for zero benefit. If we all had AR mags already then it would make some sense. You drive the cost up and further reduce your potential market to a handful of people that want an AR15 but can't have one, most of whom won't pay more than $1500 for the pleasure, when there are plenty of higher-quaility, cheaper, more useful options on the market.

We don't need a non-semi-auto AR15 for any reason. AR's were never that common here anyway, even when they were legal. It's ridiculous to try to create a market for a less-useful, dumbed-down, more expensive version of something that never had a following even in its uncrippled state to begin with.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by InisBineest » 14 Nov 2021, 11:35 am

bladeracer wrote:
Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:Come on Bladeracer AR mags are everywhere, well they are in Queensland at least. A fair few rifles now use them. The point of the AR platform is the modulability. The AR buffer tube allows you to put on any butt stock you like and the same goes with the pistol grip and the handguard. They are a small frame rifle designed for modulability and a huge array of “aftermarket” parts to suit each individual user.


I am a fan of the AR modularity for sure, all my hunting rifles use AR components. But I can't believe 5rd and 10rd AR15 mags are "common" anywhere in Oz, what platforms use them?

But designing a rifle for the Australian market, focused on looking like an AR15, is just stupid and drives the cost up for zero benefit. If we all had AR mags already then it would make some sense. You drive the cost up and further reduce your potential market to a handful of people that want an AR15 but can't have one, most of whom won't pay more than $1500 for the pleasure, when there are plenty of higher-quaility, cheaper, more useful options on the market.

We don't need a non-semi-auto AR15 for any reason. AR's were never that common here anyway, even when they were legal. It's ridiculous to try to create a market for a less-useful, dumbed-down, more expensive version of something that never had a following even in its uncrippled state to begin with.


I guess in the end, you don't have to like it or buy it, but the groups selling them seem to be doing ok, so there must demand enough. I agree, the prices of them are crazy high, but I was willing to pay it for a unique Aussie manufactured rifle that does all I need it to, and a bit more:)

As for AR mags, can you name a more common or accessible magazine? 10 round AR mags can go for as little as $30 in Qld, and not much more down in Vic.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 14 Nov 2021, 12:08 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:Come on Bladeracer AR mags are everywhere, well they are in Queensland at least. A fair few rifles now use them. The point of the AR platform is the modulability. The AR buffer tube allows you to put on any butt stock you like and the same goes with the pistol grip and the handguard. They are a small frame rifle designed for modulability and a huge array of “aftermarket” parts to suit each individual user.


I am a fan of the AR modularity for sure, all my hunting rifles use AR components. But I can't believe 5rd and 10rd AR15 mags are "common" anywhere in Oz, what platforms use them?

But designing a rifle for the Australian market, focused on looking like an AR15, is just stupid and drives the cost up for zero benefit. If we all had AR mags already then it would make some sense. You drive the cost up and further reduce your potential market to a handful of people that want an AR15 but can't have one, most of whom won't pay more than $1500 for the pleasure, when there are plenty of higher-quaility, cheaper, more useful options on the market.

We don't need a non-semi-auto AR15 for any reason. AR's were never that common here anyway, even when they were legal. It's ridiculous to try to create a market for a less-useful, dumbed-down, more expensive version of something that never had a following even in its uncrippled state to begin with.



I am going to throw it out there and say in my opinion the AR is the best platform rifle EVER! Its ease of use and modulability is why it has been the best military rifle since the 1960s. Just because you are not a fan of the Australian made design does not mean other people are not. Yes the AR15 was not that common here but things change. Some people like it and want to own one. Some ARs in America cost 2.5 thousand American dollars(Daniel Defence). Whilst others cost 500 American dollars. Some people are willing To pay more for different things. We the consumer don't make the laws we just navigate them as best we can. There is clearly a market for them because they are always nearly sold out.

AR mags fit in the Remington 7615(pump action) and the newish Ruger Americans. SA and NT allow unlimited capacity for cat B. So they have the 30 round pmags on a normal A/B licence.

You make the below claim.
“We don't need a non-semi-auto AR15 for any reason”. Please watch the below clip and tell me you could compete with a traditional throw bolt. People need different things. Nobody should tell people what they need. Commies do that and ai know you are not one of those.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IFduY3 ... e=youtu.be
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 14 Nov 2021, 12:52 pm

I agree with you, the AR platform has proved for decades that is is an astonishingly capable military rifle, but you and I are not the military :-)

I'm using the term "need" in it's marketing sense, we don't need to make one because there is no market for it, at least not a market that could sustain production. If an Aussie designed a straight-pull carbine, with detachable mags, pic rails, folding stock, etc, that stood as it's own design, while utilising AR accessories, there's no reason it should cost $4K+. In my opinion, the price blows out by trying to make a faux-AR, instead of simply making a similar design, without trying to be a pretend AR. How many 7615's have sold in Australia compared to the WFA? I would consider the 7615 to be the more useful design, and at a far more realistic price.

If you, or anybody else _wants_ one, that's your choice, nothing to do with needs, and I won't throw any obstacles in your way or decree you shouldn't be allowed to have one, the same if you wanted an actual AR15, or M16. I have zero problem with anybody having semi-auto, or full-auto firearms if that gives them their giggles, and they're not going to cause trouble to anybody else.

They sell out because they make very few of them, and I believe often pre-ordered?
Do you know how many have been sold in Australia so far?

As I don't have any interest in shooting competitions, I have zero interest in being "competitive" in it, but I bet I would have at least as much fun as you if I shot that competition with a conventional bolt rifle :-)

I have long said that we need to make our IPSC compatible with _practical_ situations here, under our laws, that is the basis of _practical_ competition. It is not a practical scenario that an Aussie is likely to find themselves in a situation involving semi-auto rifles. Three-Gun here should be a handgun, a bolt, pump, or lever rifle, and a double, lever or straight-pull gun. Despite what the media tells us, handguns are common enough here that we see them virtually every day, and could certainly find ourselves in a crap situation trying to use one to save lives. AR15's not so much, by the time one of those arrives at a crime scene, everybody that was going to be a victim already is.



Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:Come on Bladeracer AR mags are everywhere, well they are in Queensland at least. A fair few rifles now use them. The point of the AR platform is the modulability. The AR buffer tube allows you to put on any butt stock you like and the same goes with the pistol grip and the handguard. They are a small frame rifle designed for modulability and a huge array of “aftermarket” parts to suit each individual user.


I am a fan of the AR modularity for sure, all my hunting rifles use AR components. But I can't believe 5rd and 10rd AR15 mags are "common" anywhere in Oz, what platforms use them?

But designing a rifle for the Australian market, focused on looking like an AR15, is just stupid and drives the cost up for zero benefit. If we all had AR mags already then it would make some sense. You drive the cost up and further reduce your potential market to a handful of people that want an AR15 but can't have one, most of whom won't pay more than $1500 for the pleasure, when there are plenty of higher-quaility, cheaper, more useful options on the market.

We don't need a non-semi-auto AR15 for any reason. AR's were never that common here anyway, even when they were legal. It's ridiculous to try to create a market for a less-useful, dumbed-down, more expensive version of something that never had a following even in its uncrippled state to begin with.



I am going to throw it out there and say in my opinion the AR is the best platform rifle EVER! Its ease of use and modulability is why it has been the best military rifle since the 1960s. Just because you are not a fan of the Australian made design does not mean other people are not. Yes the AR15 was not that common here but things change. Some people like it and want to own one. Some ARs in America cost 2.5 thousand American dollars(Daniel Defence). Whilst others cost 500 American dollars. Some people are willing To pay more for different things. We the consumer don't make the laws we just navigate them as best we can. There is clearly a market for them because they are always nearly sold out.

AR mags fit in the Remington 7615(pump action) and the newish Ruger Americans. SA and NT allow unlimited capacity for cat B. So they have the 30 round pmags on a normal A/B licence.

You make the below claim.
“We don't need a non-semi-auto AR15 for any reason”. Please watch the below clip and tell me you could compete with a traditional throw bolt. People need different things. Nobody should tell people what they need. Commies do that and ai know you are not one of those.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IFduY3 ... e=youtu.be
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by linkoln » 14 Nov 2021, 2:36 pm

Communism_Is_Cancer wrote:The Warwick is made in Victoria and the Oceania in New South. Whilst being made in New South they still cant own them down there which must be frustrating.

Warwick make m4's and mp5's that no one in the country can own.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by scoot » 14 Nov 2021, 2:37 pm

Not to buy into the argument..........but AR style mags here in SA are available in nearly all shops and cheaper than most conventional or AICS mags. Faaaar easier and cheaper than trying to get aics mags, which I thought would be more popular.
I find this to be completely logical since I have 3 aics pattern rifles and zero ar style. :crazy:
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 14 Nov 2021, 2:40 pm

scoot wrote:Not to buy into the argument..........but AR style mags here in SA are available in nearly all shops and cheaper than most conventional or AICS mags. Faaaar easier and cheaper than trying to get aics mags, which I thought would be more popular.
I find this to be completely logical since I have 3 aics pattern rifles and zero ar style. :crazy:


Same here, four AICS platforms, no AR's.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by MontyShooter » 14 Nov 2021, 4:24 pm

I have so many ar mags. They are dirt cheap so no issues in rattle canning or cerakoting a few to see how they come up. My Warwick is by far my most entertaining rifle to shoot.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by bladeracer » 14 Nov 2021, 4:38 pm

MontyShooter wrote:I have so many ar mags. They are dirt cheap so no issues in rattle canning or cerakoting a few to see how they come up. My Warwick is by far my most entertaining rifle to shoot.


I assumed most AR mags would be prohibited in Victoria due to our 10rd detachable CatB capacity? Is NSW 10rd or 5rd for CatB?
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by MontyShooter » 14 Nov 2021, 5:29 pm

The ar mags are sold as 10 round here in Vic. The big 30 round ones have a plastic insert which limits the spring compression so only 10 rounds fit in them.
Whilst it looks cool in videos, more than 10 rounds in the mag starts to get heavy fast.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by linkoln » 15 Nov 2021, 12:19 pm

MontyShooter wrote:The ar mags are sold as 10 round here in Vic. The big 30 round ones have a plastic insert which limits the spring compression so only 10 rounds fit in them.
Whilst it looks cool in videos, more than 10 rounds in the mag starts to get heavy fast.


Yeah when you buy them from cleavers the base plate is permanently melted on so you can't tamper with the limiter. I bought a mag a few years ago from them and it was a mess, they have gotten a lot better at making the melted part look a bit nicer.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Martimus » 27 Nov 2021, 8:19 pm

Seems like the advantage of the WFA having a Faba kit would be easily negated by someone making a FABA kit for the OCE rifles... a 20" OCE Sp25 In 6.5 with a FABA kit!? now we're talking.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by Communism_Is_Cancer » 29 Nov 2021, 6:59 pm

Martimus wrote:Seems like the advantage of the WFA having a Faba kit would be easily negated by someone making a FABA kit for the OCE rifles... a 20" OCE Sp25 In 6.5 with a FABA kit!? now we're talking.


Yes a FABA kit for the Oceania would be great. I believe the Oceania is the better of the two.

I believe Jeff (the maker of Oceania) is designing a 9mm pump action. That would be a fun little carbine.
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Re: Aus made Warwick vs Oceania

Post by InisBineest » 30 Nov 2021, 6:41 am

I'm hanging out for Jeff's lever release 22! Similar to A22r/CZ515 but with less plastic and based of the 10/22 for modularity. I'd say "shut up and take my money" but that would falsely imply I had money:P
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