Best .223 for a first owner

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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bigpete » 22 Nov 2022, 10:01 am

Hell,I don't even want a heavy gun even if I'm shooting from a vehicle.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 22 Nov 2022, 10:28 am

As OB said pete, horses for courses.
We all have different tastes.
Some people like big fat Harleys that weigh as much as a small moon and handle like a pig on a skateboard, I prefer bikes that go and handle like a bike, not an overloaded ferry.

Vive la difference mate.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by deye243 » 22 Nov 2022, 1:55 pm

Lazarus wrote:As OB said pete, horses for courses.
We all have different tastes.
Some people like big fat Harleys that weigh as much as a small moon and handle like a pig on a skateboard, I prefer bikes that go and handle like a bike, not an overloaded ferry.

Vive la difference mate.

Haha I hear you on that one about the bikes I also prefer bikes that handle like bikes and sound like they go like the Clappers instead of an elongated fart
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 22 Nov 2022, 2:24 pm

deye243 wrote:
Lazarus wrote:As OB said pete, horses for courses.
We all have different tastes.
Some people like big fat Harleys that weigh as much as a small moon and handle like a pig on a skateboard, I prefer bikes that go and handle like a bike, not an overloaded ferry.

Vive la difference mate.

Haha I hear you on that one about the bikes I also prefer bikes that handle like bikes and sound like they go like the Clappers instead of an elongated fart


I recently watched a video comparison, below, of the notes of the Panigale V4S and the Aprilia RSV4 factory.
Needed some quite time alone afterwards :oops:

If you twisted my arm, I could be persuaded on this one though, as a second string, after the Ducati.

I wouldn't mind one as a dedicated dirt bike.

315629971_502295835251951_5542019229342200398_n.jpg
315629971_502295835251951_5542019229342200398_n.jpg (190.92 KiB) Viewed 2109 times


https://youtu.be/B1GFKovFofc
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Oldbloke » 22 Nov 2022, 2:26 pm

That bike is it 223cc ? :lol: :unknown:
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by JohnV » 22 Nov 2022, 8:44 pm

bigpete wrote:Hell,I don't even want a heavy gun even if I'm shooting from a vehicle.


WEATHERBY VANGUARD VARMINT BLUED SYNTHETIC .223 REM short barrel .
The reason I go this over a Howa is that Howa have screwed up the .223 with the mini action . Not allowing any room to seat out projectiles . A slightly heavier barrel is good for shooting from a vehicle it steadies the hold , reduces barrel heating and lessens recoil . Hinged floor plate model never has magazine issues and you can usually extend the length of it to accommodate longer overall cartridges .
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bladeracer » 22 Nov 2022, 8:48 pm

JohnV wrote:
bigpete wrote:Hell,I don't even want a heavy gun even if I'm shooting from a vehicle.


WEATHERBY VANGUARD VARMINT BLUED SYNTHETIC .223 REM short barrel .
The reason I go this over a Howa is that Howa have screwed up the .223 with the mini action . Not allowing any room to seat out projectiles . A slightly heavier barrel is good for shooting from a vehicle it steadies the hold , reduces barrel heating and lessens recoil . Hinged floor plate model never has magazine issues and you can usually extend the length of it to accommodate longer overall cartridges .


I agree about the mini-action but they do still offer .223 in the short-action don't they?
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Troyus » 22 Nov 2022, 10:51 pm

As to the OP the Lithgow is a great, Aussie made gun. The howas are good bang for buck but that doesn’t make them better than a Lithgow or other great guns. Know however that the Lithgow is on the heavier side of things.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bigpete » 23 Nov 2022, 6:08 am

JohnV wrote:
bigpete wrote:Hell,I don't even want a heavy gun even if I'm shooting from a vehicle.


WEATHERBY VANGUARD VARMINT BLUED SYNTHETIC .223 REM short barrel .
The reason I go this over a Howa is that Howa have screwed up the .223 with the mini action . Not allowing any room to seat out projectiles . A slightly heavier barrel is good for shooting from a vehicle it steadies the hold , reduces barrel heating and lessens recoil . Hinged floor plate model never has magazine issues and you can usually extend the length of it to accommodate longer overall cartridges .


I've done PLENTY of shooting from a vehicle,and stand by my choice. My weatherby vanguard 22-250 standard weight barrel is plenty heavy enough,especially when it has a torch mounted to it.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by JohnV » 29 Nov 2022, 6:18 pm

bigpete wrote:
JohnV wrote:
bigpete wrote:Hell,I don't even want a heavy gun even if I'm shooting from a vehicle.


WEATHERBY VANGUARD VARMINT BLUED SYNTHETIC .223 REM short barrel .
The reason I go this over a Howa is that Howa have screwed up the .223 with the mini action . Not allowing any room to seat out projectiles . A slightly heavier barrel is good for shooting from a vehicle it steadies the hold , reduces barrel heating and lessens recoil . Hinged floor plate model never has magazine issues and you can usually extend the length of it to accommodate longer overall cartridges .


I've done PLENTY of shooting from a vehicle,and stand by my choice. My weatherby vanguard 22-250 standard weight barrel is plenty heavy enough,especially when it has a torch mounted to it.

I never said it was required I just said a heavier barrel is ok for shooting out of a vehicle and your not carrying it about either .
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Royalfriz » 04 Dec 2022, 4:24 pm

Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 04 Dec 2022, 4:35 pm

Royalfriz wrote:Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?


That would depend on what you're hunting RF, and the range at which you hunt, but if you're new to shooting that's a pretty good start :drinks:
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bladeracer » 04 Dec 2022, 4:50 pm

Royalfriz wrote:Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?


It will depend on how large your target area is. On rabbits and foxes that would limit your shots to about 100m max.
How were you shooting? Off a bench or prone? Off a bag or bipod? With a rear bag?
Can you shoot significantly tighter groups at 50m or 100m?
In the field, leaning against a fence post or resting across a rolled up jacket for example, your groups will likely be larger than you'll see when shooting off a bench under perfect conditions.

150mm under field conditions would be fine for bigger stuff, like goats and deer, with more potent cartridges, like .308 or .30-06. But the .223 is on the light side for bigger targets. Virtually any .223 rifle should be easily capable of around 30mm at 100m, or 60mm at 200m.

If you're new at shooting you really need a decent .22LR so you can simply spend dozens of hours and thousands of shots practicing on different targets at different distances. What you learn with the .22LR will translate to other rifles.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bigrich » 05 Dec 2022, 4:23 am

Good advice blade :thumbsup:
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by JohnV » 05 Dec 2022, 7:50 am

A Tikka should shoot better than that . So my advice is get an experienced shooter to sort out your shooting technique . Also don't fire 15 shots quickly in one grouping you could be heating the barrel too much . 3 to 5 shots in a group tests the gun and load ok .
Avoid shooting at targets on windy days if you can . If you are using factory ammo try a few different brands as the gun will most likely prefer a certain brand but you need to have all the bugs out of your shooting style and setup so the better groups stand out .
Last edited by JohnV on 05 Dec 2022, 7:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 05 Dec 2022, 7:56 am

JohnV wrote:Avoid shooting at targets on windy days if you can .


I would disagree with that except during load development.

Wind is almost always a factor, practice in the wind is key to learning how to deal with it.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by JohnV » 05 Dec 2022, 7:59 am

Lazarus wrote:
JohnV wrote:Avoid shooting at targets on windy days if you can .


I would disagree with that.

Wind is almost always a factor, practice in the wind is key to learning how to deal with it.

It's one variable you don't need when trying to find the best load or learn the best shooting technique .
He can learn wind doping later . 150mm groups at 200 with a Tikka 223 , I think it's fair to say he is a learner and the less variables the better so he can recognize improvements .
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 05 Dec 2022, 8:09 am

That's a fair comment John.

Trigger and breathing techniques etc are no doubt at play with a 200mm group at 200m.

You were lightning quick on that reply, I edited mine straight away but you beat me to the draw :drinks:
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by JohnV » 05 Dec 2022, 8:19 am

The only other thing is , is he shooting standing offhand ? If so then the groups are not too bad .
I once coached a guy in Germany and he sent me images and videos of him shooting . Man it was horrible , like about a dozen things being done wrong and even the bench was a flimsy shaky mess. 6 months later with that all cleaned up and reloading advice he is now one of the best shots in his club . To sort out issues you need a lot of detailed information including images otherwise it is a lot of guessing . People should not be reluctant to post what they are doing even if it's wrong because we all had to learn from someone .
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 05 Dec 2022, 8:50 am

JohnV wrote:The only other thing is , is he shooting standing offhand ? If so then the groups are not too bad .
I once coached a guy in Germany and he sent me images and videos of him shooting . Man it was horrible , like about a dozen things being done wrong and even the bench was a flimsy shaky mess. 6 months later with that all cleaned up and reloading advice he is now one of the best shots in his club . To sort out issues you need a lot of detailed information including images otherwise it is a lot of guessing . People should not be reluctant to post what they are doing even if it's wrong because we all had to learn from someone .


That's it, the only stupid questions are the ones you don't ask
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Royalfriz » 05 Dec 2022, 9:31 am

bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?


It will depend on how large your target area is. On rabbits and foxes that would limit your shots to about 100m max.
How were you shooting? Off a bench or prone? Off a bag or bipod? With a rear bag?
Can you shoot significantly tighter groups at 50m or 100m?
In the field, leaning against a fence post or resting across a rolled up jacket for example, your groups will likely be larger than you'll see when shooting off a bench under perfect conditions.

150mm under field conditions would be fine for bigger stuff, like goats and deer, with more potent cartridges, like .308 or .30-06. But the .223 is on the light side for bigger targets. Virtually any .223 rifle should be easily capable of around 30mm at 100m, or 60mm at 200m.

If you're new at shooting you really need a decent .22LR so you can simply spend dozens of hours and thousands of shots practicing on different targets at different distances. What you learn with the .22LR will translate to other rifles.


I was using a pillow under the barrel and on my elbows. I was using a three round mag. Every three round group was about an inch to inch half groups. Every time I loaded up again my position obviously changed so I grouped the whole lot rather than each three round groups.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bladeracer » 05 Dec 2022, 10:22 am

Royalfriz wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?


It will depend on how large your target area is. On rabbits and foxes that would limit your shots to about 100m max.
How were you shooting? Off a bench or prone? Off a bag or bipod? With a rear bag?
Can you shoot significantly tighter groups at 50m or 100m?
In the field, leaning against a fence post or resting across a rolled up jacket for example, your groups will likely be larger than you'll see when shooting off a bench under perfect conditions.

150mm under field conditions would be fine for bigger stuff, like goats and deer, with more potent cartridges, like .308 or .30-06. But the .223 is on the light side for bigger targets. Virtually any .223 rifle should be easily capable of around 30mm at 100m, or 60mm at 200m.

If you're new at shooting you really need a decent .22LR so you can simply spend dozens of hours and thousands of shots practicing on different targets at different distances. What you learn with the .22LR will translate to other rifles.


I was using a pillow under the barrel and on my elbows. I was using a three round mag. Every three round group was about an inch to inch half groups. Every time I loaded up again my position obviously changed so I grouped the whole lot rather than each three round groups.


Nice, it sounds like the rifle is shooting very well then, you just need to work on your own input. Does your scope have parallax adjustment?
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Royalfriz » 05 Dec 2022, 10:24 am

bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?


It will depend on how large your target area is. On rabbits and foxes that would limit your shots to about 100m max.
How were you shooting? Off a bench or prone? Off a bag or bipod? With a rear bag?
Can you shoot significantly tighter groups at 50m or 100m?
In the field, leaning against a fence post or resting across a rolled up jacket for example, your groups will likely be larger than you'll see when shooting off a bench under perfect conditions.

150mm under field conditions would be fine for bigger stuff, like goats and deer, with more potent cartridges, like .308 or .30-06. But the .223 is on the light side for bigger targets. Virtually any .223 rifle should be easily capable of around 30mm at 100m, or 60mm at 200m.

If you're new at shooting you really need a decent .22LR so you can simply spend dozens of hours and thousands of shots practicing on different targets at different distances. What you learn with the .22LR will translate to other rifles.


I was using a pillow under the barrel and on my elbows. I was using a three round mag. Every three round group was about an inch to inch half groups. Every time I loaded up again my position obviously changed so I grouped the whole lot rather than each three round groups.


Nice, it sounds like the rifle is shooting very well then, you just need to work on your own input. Does your scope have parallax adjustment?


No mate. No parallax adjust. It’s just a cheap Bushnell scope
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Royalfriz » 05 Dec 2022, 11:06 am

bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:Hello. Just purchased a Tika 223. Zeroed it in at the range and got 150mm grouping with 15 rounds at 200m. That should be okay for hunting eh?


It will depend on how large your target area is. On rabbits and foxes that would limit your shots to about 100m max.
How were you shooting? Off a bench or prone? Off a bag or bipod? With a rear bag?
Can you shoot significantly tighter groups at 50m or 100m?
In the field, leaning against a fence post or resting across a rolled up jacket for example, your groups will likely be larger than you'll see when shooting off a bench under perfect conditions.

150mm under field conditions would be fine for bigger stuff, like goats and deer, with more potent cartridges, like .308 or .30-06. But the .223 is on the light side for bigger targets. Virtually any .223 rifle should be easily capable of around 30mm at 100m, or 60mm at 200m.

If you're new at shooting you really need a decent .22LR so you can simply spend dozens of hours and thousands of shots practicing on different targets at different distances. What you learn with the .22LR will translate to other rifles.


I was using a pillow under the barrel and on my elbows. I was using a three round mag. Every three round group was about an inch to inch half groups. Every time I loaded up again my position obviously changed so I grouped the whole lot rather than each three round groups.


Nice, it sounds like the rifle is shooting very well then, you just need to work on your own input. Does your scope have parallax adjustment?


Actually mate it does have parallax adjustment. I didn’t even notice it..
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by bladeracer » 05 Dec 2022, 11:10 am

Royalfriz wrote:Actually mate it does have parallax adjustment. I didn’t even notice it..


That may be the only problem then, set the parallax to 200m and try again. If the parallax is off when you hold your head in a different position behind the scope the reticle will be in a different spot on your target.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Royalfriz » 05 Dec 2022, 12:28 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Royalfriz wrote:Actually mate it does have parallax adjustment. I didn’t even notice it..


That may be the only problem then, set the parallax to 200m and try again. If the parallax is off when you hold your head in a different position behind the scope the reticle will be in a different spot on your target.[/quote

Thanks mate. I will give it a go. Much appreciated]
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by jpsauer88 » 11 Dec 2022, 6:32 am

Just get 24"
You loose about 100fps going to 20inch. If thatatters to you, and it does to me, go 24"
Do not put anything under barrel. Nothing should be touching your barrel. Under forend only.
Also try quality ammo (adi, outback)
See how you go.
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by JohnV » 12 Dec 2022, 4:58 pm

I can see now that his rifle support setup needs some work . Inexperienced shooters don't place enough importance on the correct support for the gun in the right places and the importance of setting up the same each time within reason .
Don't rest the barrel on anything , rest the stock forend on the front support and a pillow is a bit too spongy and sloppy .
Also a common mistake is allowing slings or sling screws to dig into the front and rear support . Front support should be firm but not a hard surface something like a sand bag .
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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Peterwho » 12 Dec 2022, 8:08 pm

This is a great thread and thank you to the OP for starting it. Lots to learn. What would the recommendations be for a decent 22LR as suggested by Blade?

Thanks

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Re: Best .223 for a first owner

Post by Lazarus » 13 Dec 2022, 7:38 am

G'day Peter

Lithgow LA101 if you have the budget.

Aussie made, deadly accurate.
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