350 Legend

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Re: 350 Legend

Post by bladeracer » 21 May 2023, 12:24 am

bigpete wrote:I honestly don't see how


Yes, quite right, the rebated rim is far too small. Don't know where I got that .450" figure from.

Will the Legend you can just load down to .38 Special for cheap shooting.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 21 May 2023, 10:24 am

Taking a breath....
Not using the 38/357 cases.........
maybe trying the 38/357 projectiles in the 350 Legend rimless case.(223 parent case).
Or did I miss something? I'm really not going to tempt fate
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by bladeracer » 21 May 2023, 10:37 am

madang55 wrote:Taking a breath....
Not using the 38/357 cases.........
maybe trying the 38/357 projectiles in the 350 Legend rimless case.(223 parent case).
Or did I miss something? I'm really not going to tempt fate


Yes, the .350 Legend uses the same bullets as the .38/.357 and larger rifle cartridges.
I don't know if the .223 is the parent case as the case head is .012" larger in the Legend. It would be interesting to know if we can make the brass from .223Rem brass. The rebated rim fits the .223 bolt face.

For some reason I had a figure of .450" for the Legend rim, .010" larger than the .38/.357 family. That was my mistake.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by No1_49er » 21 May 2023, 8:21 pm

Probably a good idea to go here and have a read. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.350_Legend
It does not have a parent case, and is not based on the 223 although it does have some similarities.
It was introduced by Winchester at the 2019 Shot Show, specifically for those States that require a "straight-walled" cartridge case for hunting.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by wrenchman » 22 May 2023, 7:46 am

i do like lee dies as well and have a lot of them also i do have a henry steel boy 357 i reload for and i do enjoy it a lot i have done a lot with it in loading and shooting it is the gun i like to take with me when walking the property in case i see some coyotes.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by straightshooter » 22 May 2023, 8:35 am

No1_49er wrote:........It does not have a parent case, and is not based on the 223 although it does have some similarities......

Yes and No
It looks like a lengthened 9mm Winchester Magnum but with a rebated rim to suit a standard 223 bolt face.
It could conceivably be made using a 224 Weatherby Magnum case but would involve many operations including turning the belt and rim to size.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 23 May 2023, 10:52 pm

Reloading this puppy....real interesting...apart from the lack of suitable powder..Step 1: size and de-prime...step 2: clean if I want....Step 3 ...prime...Step 4 "bell the case outh....Step 5: trim..Ahhh? do you trim before or after preparing the case mouth.If this thing head spaces on the case mouth, going have to be very fastidious. Annealing? I reckon yes if I have to "bell" the case mouth every time I reload. Step 6: there aint no step 6 because I aint got no powder!!!! ... Step 7 (Seat projectiles....I got those) but remember....No freakin powder!!!!!
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by bladeracer » 24 May 2023, 2:23 am

madang55 wrote:Reloading this puppy....real interesting...apart from the lack of suitable powder..Step 1: size and de-prime...step 2: clean if I want....Step 3 ...prime...Step 4 "bell the case mouth....Step 5: trim..Ahhh? do you trim before or after preparing the case mouth.If this thing head spaces on the case mouth, going have to be very fastidious. Annealing? I reckon yes if I have to "bell" the case mouth every time I reload. Step 6: there aint no step 6 because I aint got no powder!!!! ... Step 7 (Seat projectiles....I got those) but remember....No freakin powder!!!!!


Shouldn't need to flare it with jacketed bullets, only cast or plated.

Just keep them trimmed to a consistent length.

I'd experiment with AR2206H until you can get something faster. Heavy bullets should shoot okay with the rifle powder. Looks like the Legend is around the same case capacity as .38-40?
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by straightshooter » 24 May 2023, 8:24 am

Based on the cases water capacity I suspect 2206H will be too slow even with heavy projectiles and compressed loads. More likely 2205 or something a little faster and preferably double base would be optimum.
Looks like the forum will experience an extended period of entertainment with this one.

Edit:
Looking a little further in the wikipedia article I note that 180gn factory load delivers 2100fps.
I easily achieve more than 2200fps with a 180gn load in my 44 magnum with far less hassle.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by bladeracer » 24 May 2023, 10:01 am

straightshooter wrote:Based on the cases water capacity I suspect 2206H will be too slow even with heavy projectiles and compressed loads. More likely 2205 or something a little faster and preferably double base would be optimum.
Looks like the forum will experience an extended period of entertainment with this one.

Edit:
Looking a little further in the wikipedia article I note that 180gn factory load delivers 2100fps.
I easily achieve more than 2200fps with a 180gn load in my 44 magnum with far less hassle.


It'll be slower than using a pistol powder but should be usable until you can get pistol powder. I would think it'd make .357 levels at least. Having your name down on a pre-order for some AR2205 would be a good idea for any pistol shooter by now as they only do limited runs of it. A mate picked up a kilo of Vectan A0 last week, for which there is almost no load data so he has some experimenting to do.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by Billo » 24 May 2023, 11:15 am

I have zero interest in a 350 Legend but a 400 Legend sounds like my kinda fun :thumbsup:
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 25 May 2023, 4:13 pm

Billo wrote:I have zero interest in a 350 Legend but a 400 Legend sounds like my kinda fun :thumbsup:

I think its called a Bushmaster?
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by Billo » 25 May 2023, 8:18 pm

madang55 I dunno seems to be a thing....

https://winchester.com/Products/Ammunition/400-Legend
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 31 May 2023, 9:46 pm

Billo wrote:madang55 I dunno seems to be a thing....

https://winchester.com/Products/Ammunition/400-Legend

OOHH it does
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 26 Jun 2023, 6:32 pm

OK....358 projectiles do not work. .355 projectiles do work. What a difference .003 makes. Its all in the loaded case neck diameter. The chamber doesn't like the fatter neck. No problems with seating depth as well. All I (we) need is powder.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 28 Jun 2023, 10:48 pm

So. .358 projectiles do not work. after seating they cause an 'over-size' of the case and will not chamber. .355 projectiles do work. However, the case mouth MUST be lubricated prior to running through the expanding die prior to seating. If not, the process causes a minute collapse of the case and unwanted increase in the case dimensions, again causing difficulty chambering. So much fun this 350.....
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by Billo » 29 Jun 2023, 8:14 am

That sounds mildly annoying, does he expander get that stuck feeling when you try to insert ? or toug to remove madang55

Maybe pull the expander and give in a polish with some fine wet n dry, its what I do with all my expanders. My Lee 500 S&W expand was rough as and made a real difference.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 29 Jun 2023, 12:50 pm

Billo wrote:That sounds mildly annoying, does he expander get that stuck feeling when you try to insert ? or toug to remove madang55

Maybe pull the expander and give in a polish with some fine wet n dry, its what I do with all my expanders. My Lee 500 S&W expand was rough as and made a real difference.

Ref the Reloading topic. The idea of shot and graphite dip sounds good.
But...giving the expander a little polish wont hurt one bit.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by mickb » 09 Jul 2023, 12:18 pm

straightshooter wrote:Based on the cases water capacity I suspect 2206H will be too slow even with heavy projectiles and compressed loads. More likely 2205 or something a little faster and preferably double base would be optimum.
Looks like the forum will experience an extended period of entertainment with this one.

Edit:
Looking a little further in the wikipedia article I note that 180gn factory load delivers 2100fps.
I easily achieve more than 2200fps with a 180gn load in my 44 magnum with far less hassle.


yeah I reckon adi2206h will be way too slow for optimal. AR2207 and Rel-7 are faster powders, and I'd say they will all get the bullet out the barrel but probably way under a normal 357mag carbine power.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 12 Jul 2023, 8:48 am

Have done up some 2207's. Results at 25m, good enough. Primers look good, no brass problems. Have loaded up a few more and will extend out to 50/100/150 and take my Gideons with me. If all the indications are still good, with up .2gr a couple of times and take the beads as well.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 12 Jul 2023, 8:50 am

Have done up some 2207's. Results at 25m, good enough. Primers look good, no brass problems. Have loaded up a few more and will extend out to 50/100/150 and take my Gideons with me. If all the indications are still good, with up .2gr a couple of times and take the beads as well. I am able to seat the projectiles out with plenty of case room available. I could seat slightly deeper and watch for changes there as well.
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by mickb » 14 Jul 2023, 6:56 pm

I dont think 2207 will create pressure problems in 350 legend. It can handle compressed loads of actual pistol powders. Be interesting to see if you chrony those loads. My best is you will be somewhere around or below 357 mag lever action power.

Good to see you tried 2207 rather than 2206H at least. Some fellas seem to think because 2207 has a higher number, its slower. But its faster than both 2206 and 2206H. I remember one bloke on a thread was talking about trying rifle powders in his 44-40 and every post was about 2206H. I kept saying 2207 is a much faster powder and even posted the ADI burn rate chart, but he kept playing with the 2206H
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by deye243 » 14 Jul 2023, 7:14 pm

mickb wrote:I dont think 2207 will create pressure problems in 350 legend. It can handle compressed loads of actual pistol powders. Be interesting to see if you chrony those loads. My best is you will be somewhere around or below 357 mag lever action power.

Good to see you tried 2207 rather than 2206H at least. Some fellas seem to think because 2207 has a higher number, its slower. But its faster than both 2206 and 2206H. I remember one bloke on a thread was talking about trying rifle powders in his 44-40 and every post was about 2206H. I kept saying 2207 is a much faster powder and even posted the ADI burn rate chart, but he kept playing with the 2206H

Yes it's like 2219 and 2217 2218 the 2219 is way faster .
I often wonder how much they drink when they designate a number for powder .
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Re: 350 Legend

Post by madang55 » 17 Jul 2023, 4:04 pm

I have been told by a good source that 2205 2206 2206H 2207 2208 is the production number and has no relevance to burn speed. Just 2208 was developed later than 2207 etc.
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