223 reloading old topic revisited

[madang55]

So, I have a Howa 223 with the shorter, "heavy" fluted barrel. 1:8 twist rate. So far the 55gr SRoo work just fine, 2208 and better with 8208. Do I need it to be more accurate, of course I do, silly question. Evidence would suggest the ideal projectile weight for the 223 is 60-70grain and the 1:8 suggests it can deal with the heavier projectiles. TRUE or FALSE and same powders?

[bladeracer]

So, I have a Howa 223 with the shorter, "heavy" fluted barrel. 1:8 twist rate. So far the 55gr SRoo work just fine, 2208 and better with 8208. Do I need it to be more accurate, of course I do, silly question. Evidence would suggest the ideal projectile weight for the 223 is 60-70grain and the 1:8 suggests it can deal with the heavier projectiles. TRUE or FALSE and same powders?

The 55gn Gameking (SuperRoo) is a great bullet.

Not heavier bullets, longer bullets, up to around 1.200". My preference is the 80gn ELDM, relatively cheap and generally readily available, and Cleaver do occasional bulk specials. I've used AR2208 and BM8208 but my preference is AR2206H. The long bullets also need a long throat, and magazine if you want to be able to feed them, otherwise they take up a lot of room in the case, limiting potential velocity somewhat. If you're not shooting long-range, say 300m+, then I don't think there's that much advantage in the longer bullets, but they do buck wind better, and they do hit harder.

[madang55]

AH! throat length. Magazine length. What COL do you end up with. ELDM are match proj?

[deye243]

AH! throat length. Magazine length. What COL do you end up with. ELDM are match proj?

They might be a match bullet but in 22 calibre they behave like a v-max and as a long range hunting bullet 6.5 and 7mm is my experience the eldm has no equal I find most people who criticize their use don't use them past 500 yards or don't use them at all I live up here in East Gippsland country and the amount of people I talk to who regularly take big sambar stags with match King projectiles surprises even me as that bullet I would not use but an eldm or Amax I have and I always will .

Now back on topic which is unusual for me if you are going to use 75 grain or 80 grain eldm projectiles or other brands in that length and hoping to get some speed with a standard saami chamber don't use cci 400 or rem 6 1/2 primers the cup is to thin either use the 450 or the BM4 or the rem 7 1/2 as they six to seven thou thicker and can handle the pressure especially with a howa I get another 180fps with decent primers in all 4 223s I have with no issues.

[bladeracer]

AH! throat length. Magazine length. What COL do you end up with. ELDM are match proj?

I run them at 2.450" in AICS mags.
They are a match bullet but are used for hunting as well.

[SCJ429]

I am surprised by your love of the ELDM for competition Deye. You rarely see any plastic tipped bullets used for long range competition. I have found them difficult to tune compared to SMK or Bergers.

To get the most out of the OPs Howa, there are some budget bullets that shoot extremely well, like the 50 or 55 grain VMax or the Speer TNT which shoot 1/4 MOA out of a Tikka with a 1:8 twist barrel. It is way more RPM than you need but makes for explosive impacts. The other bullet I have had success with is the Sierra Blitz King.

If you want to shoot out to 1000 metres, a match bullet like the 80 grain Berger will be your friend. This is where the RPM that your 1:8 barrel can provide comes in handy.

[madang55]

Thankyou all. I don't think I will go past 69gr. The 55 SRoo's are decent proj and work well for me. I am just interested if accuracy improves with the heavier (longer) projectiles. I shall soon find out.

[bladeracer]

Thankyou all. I don't think I will go past 69gr. The 55 SRoo's are decent proj and work well for me. I am just interested if accuracy improves with the heavier (longer) projectiles. I shall soon find out.

At close ranges, under 300m or so, I doubt you'd measure a difference. The more aerodynamic bullets offer advantages over longer ranges, especially in wind.

[madang55]

Thankyou all. I don't think I will go past 69gr. The 55 SRoo's are decent proj and work well for me. I am just interested if accuracy improves with the heavier (longer) projectiles. I shall soon find out.

At close ranges, under 300m or so, I doubt you'd measure a difference. The more aerodynamic bullets offer advantages over longer ranges, especially in wind.

Well, I reckon me shooting at certain game over 200 would be off the table, so might as well stick with what I have. I will stick with the 6.5's and 308's if I expect the longer ranges to be involved. Thanks for the info

[Jorlcrin]

We use the ADI 69gn Matchkings on Hot Pork; out to around 150 metres.
Overseers Howa uses a 1:9" twist, and my Tikka CTR uses a 1:8" twist.

Not perfect(Match pills), but a well-placed shot with a 69gn is more likely to put larger pigs down.
We'd previously been finding the ADI 55gn SP(Gameking?) ammo was leaving craters on larger pigs, but often not leaving a mortal wound.
I need to get back in and load up a heap of the Rexem F-BOMB 69 BTHP pills; they work a LOT better on pretty much anything.
Just havent had time for reloading, so grabbing the factory ammo has kept us going for the time being.

Saw a dog @~180 metres a few days back; REALLY regretting not having the .308 or the 7-08 with me...

[madang55]

Great believer in the smaller the target the shorter the distance, the bigger the target, the BIGGER the bullet.

[Fester]

I like to keep the .223 cheap to load for so just use big boxes of 55gr Super roos.
The 24" medium sporter barrel is past it's best but still shoots a reasonable 300m group and often puts 3 of the 5 shots in a ragged hole at 100yds, used to put all 5 in on the best groups on any calm range day.

I tried a pack of 69gr Match Kings but the roo loads were as good at 200 so all I ever needed for practical .223 ranges.

I don't fully understand why they changed from 1:9 to 1:8 twist, but as long as 55s still shoot, we can't really complain.

[bladeracer]

I don't fully understand why they changed from 1:9 to 1:8 twist, but as long as 55s still shoot, we can't really complain.

I would guess because PRS became a thing and people might want to use longer VLD/ELD bullets for long-range shooting. I have yet to find any downside to 8"twist.

[Fester]

The only way a .223 could shoot long-range and buck the wind enough for decent scores in F-class is using a rifle like they build.
Truck axle, 1:7, single loading. and shooting real heavy projies.
To me, it defeats the main .223 purposes of cheap accurate shooting at .223 type ranges.

To shoot further a 6mm cal is the obvious choice and a 6.5 will be better again for less wind drift.

I like shooting steel plates at 500m working down to the 6" one but the little .223 was not that effective with wind effect and not hearing the gongs.

Using the 6.5 I see the hit, then hear it.
Can see the group and make a hold call for the smaller plates.
The PRS blokes like less recoil and why they are going 6mm now but they prob put muzzle breaks on everything anyway.

[bladeracer]

The only way a .223 could shoot long-range and buck the wind enough for decent scores in F-class is using a rifle like they build.
Truck axle, 1:7, single loading. and shooting real heavy projies.
To me, it defeats the main .223 purposes of cheap accurate shooting at .223 type ranges.

To shoot further a 6mm cal is the obvious choice and a 6.5 will be better again for less wind drift.

I like shooting steel plates at 500m working down to the 6" one but the little .223 was not that effective with wind effect and not hearing the gongs.

Using the 6.5 I see the hit, then hear it.
Can see the group and make a hold call for the smaller plates.
The PRS blokes like less recoil and why they are going 6mm now but they prob put muzzle breaks on everything anyway.

I don't think that many people shoot F-Class, more of us just enjoy banging gongs across paddocks for fun. Being cheap and accurate is why the .223 does get used for longer ranges. If you're shooting 500m with 55gn bullets then the wind will certainly be an issue, but 80gn bullets are much better. The 55gn Hornady soft-point has a BC of .235, the 80gn ELDM is .485. The 55gn will have about 1200mm of drift in a 10mph wind, the 80gn will have half that, much more doable, and it shoots flatter. This is despite being launched at lower velocity due to the extra weight. Hearing gong hits hundreds of meters away is difficult with any wind around, and worse if the wind is away from you.

I wouldn't bother with 6mm, either go to 6.5mm or 7mm, or try to work with the limited options in .277" bullets.