breaking in/sighting in for first time

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breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Member-Deleted » 08 Apr 2015, 10:41 pm

Hi guys. just wanted to find out a bit more about breaking in a new rifle and sighting in. To start with I have only shot a small handful of times and have never cleaned or sighted in a rifle. I have bought a new rifle and have been trying to get some help getting it "run in" with an experienced shooter bur due to times and commitments it's been very hard and I'm getting impatient. So I wanted to do the break in and sighting in myself. I have watched many videos and read many articles so I am fairly confident, so do u guys think I will encounter any issues? I was thinking of doing 1 shot clean for the first 10 shots, then 2 shots clean for the next 10 shots. Then a clean for every 10-15 shots after that. Also, should I use sweets solvent for the 1st clean or should I stick with the less potent hoppes? And finally do rifle ranges provide a vice to sit the rifle in? Or do I need my own? Cheers guys. Also do you sight in after you have broken in the barrel? Or during the break in
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by handofcod » 08 Apr 2015, 11:45 pm

This is probably shooting heresy but I wouldn't bother breaking it in. I haven't on any of my rifles and they all shoot an inch or under at 100m. Just got out and shoot the thing, clean it when you get home. Make sure you clean out the gunk that they have in there for storage first though.

Sighting in is a bit more complicated but there are really only two things to remember, one, shoot at something close and work progressively out, people that I've seen having problems usually have their target too far away. And two, shoot at least three shots between adjustments to your scope. Don't chase the point of impact around the target by shooting once and adjust just for that shot.

Have fun!
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by brett1868 » 09 Apr 2015, 12:07 am

Welcome, you have come to the right place for answers but first up some questions.
What calibre / type rifle you shooting? I'm assuming bolt action
Scoped or open sights? I'm assuming scope.

How I do it..."Bore Sighting"
Ensure bolt face, chamber and barrel are free of oil by pushing a few dry patches through from the chamber. If it's a new rifle then give it a good cleaning to rid it of any grease / oil from the bore & bolt face.

1. Ensure the scope & mounts are securely attached to the rifle and rings loctited. I've seen $4000 scopes damaged from sliding through rings that won't securely fitted. Wasn't my scope but I've been bitten on the ass by a loose rail.

2. Gently - Key word is "GENTLY" wind the elevation all the way up then count the clicks to the bottom then come half way back, this centres the reticule in the centre of travel. Repeat the same step for windage. Your scope should now be centred, most come cantered from the factory but I like to check this for myself.

3. A bipod and small bag are generally helpful to steady the rifle during sighting in but some old footy socks stuffed with rice or similar work just as well. A bag of dry dog food worked well for one member. Improvise, adapt & over come.

4. Remove the bolt and look down the bore at the target, adjust the bipod / bags so it's steady on target. Look through the scope and adjust the windage / elevation till they line up with the target visible through the bore.

5. Refit bolt, fire 3 rounds - all going to plan you should have 3 holes very close to each other but my not necessarily be in the bullseye.

6. Draw a the smallest circle possible around the group and measure from the centre of it to the point of aim. Assuming your using a scope with 1/4 or .25 MOA per click and your target is at 100 yards. For each inch you need 4 clicks of adjustment, say for example your 1.5 " high & 3" left you need to wind 6 clicks down on the elevation and 12 clicks to the right on windage.

7. Shoot another 3 rounds and fine tune as necessary.

8. Recheck scope and mounts to ensure they haven't "shot loose" and check on a regular basis as part of your cleaning regime.

9. Give it a good post shooting clean and oil.

Barrel break in is one of the great controversy's of shooting, some do it, some don't but it's generally accepted that a properly broken in barrel will shoot straighter for longer. check what the manual suggests as procedures vary from brand to brand and materiel used. The important thing is not to get the barrel too hot, you should be able to wrap your hand around it without getting burnt. The shoot 1, clean for the first 10, then shoot 2 then clean for the next 20 and then 5 & clean for the next 20 before increasing the shots between cleans is one approach used by McMillan for break in. Without knowing the type, brand or materiel of your barrel makes it difficult. The most important thing is to not over heat it during the break in procedure.

Others will offer advice and opinions which may differ to mine so read them all, talk to your dealer and develop a procedure that works for you and your rifle.

Enjoy
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Mick280 » 09 Apr 2015, 1:43 am

I had an old gunsmith mate of mine (He's also a SSAA Shooting instructor) Give me a barrel break in method Half a dozen odd years ago when my young bloke come of age and got interested and gave me an excuse to get back into shooting.
It goes as follows.
As the other boys have said,Give it a good clean , Couple of wet patches of your Hoppes No 9 will do the trick,Then I usually give mine a dozen or so runs through with a nylon brush and patch it out until clean.
Clean your bolt , Some may frown at me for this but I use Wurth's Brake Cleaner for this task ( Good high pressure spray,Gets rid of all the factory s**t in and around your locking lugs and extractor, Let it dry and soak it in a small tub of oil ( I use Sweets Gun Oil ) for 10 or 15 mins , Take it out and let it sit and drain for a while and wipe it of with a bit of rag. ( DON'T FORGET TO GREASE YOUR LOCKING LUGS ).
Break In - With a box of your chosen Factory Ammo ( 20 - 25 Rounds depending on cal ) shoot a magazine full , 3 or 4 shots,what ever the mag capacity , Give it a quick clean ( Get your solvent into the barrel while it's still hot )
Repeat this until box is empty.
I sight in while I'm doing this , The blokes at my LGS are pretty good at a rough bore sighting job when setting my glass up ( Usually within about 6 to 8 inches of centre at 100 yds.Get an A4 sheet cardboard ( Not White , To Bright ) sit a beer can in the centre,Draw around it , colour in with marker ( I use red ) Sraight to the 100 yd Mark and set it up on a clean , light surface,Back of an old real estate sign does the job.
Rifle nice and secure on bags or rest with bolt out , look down barrel , adjust rifle , bags or rest until your beer can is in the centre of your barrel picture.Very carefully without moving your set up , Look through your scope and dial your crosshairs in the centre of your beer can.Shoot , Haven't not hit the A4 Sheet yet , Just bring it in from their.
I've used this break in method on all of my bolt actions and after load development , If I'm doing my part will all put 3 shots on a 5c piece at 100yds.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Member-Deleted » 09 Apr 2015, 7:23 am

Thanks for the prompt responses guys, very helpful! Definitely pointing me in the right direction so hopefully all goes well! Just a bit more info, my rifle is a Browning A Bolt II composite stalker chambered in .223rem. The scope is zeiss Terra 4-12X42. The ammo I will be using is Hornady 55gr soft tips. Also this may sound silly but do the ranges provide targets for you to shoot/sight in at? Or do I need to buy my own. Was thinking of going to the SSAA range in little river (victoria) cheers
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by brett1868 » 09 Apr 2015, 7:36 am

Member-Deleted wrote:Thanks for the prompt responses guys, very helpful! Definitely pointing me in the right direction so hopefully all goes well! Just a bit more info, my rifle is a Browning A Bolt II composite stalker chambered in .223rem. The scope is zeiss Terra 4-12X42. The ammo I will be using is Hornady 55gr soft tips. Also this may sound silly but do the ranges provide targets for you to shoot/sight in at? Or do I need to buy my own. Was thinking of going to the SSAA range in little river (victoria) cheers


Most ranges will have a selection of targets for sale so you should be fine. Take a black marker pen to circle your shots when you check the target so you know whats new. Some use small black / white stickers to cover the holes which will save you money on targets. I use the SSAA A3 size sheet that has 6 circular target on it. Alternatively there's plenty of good targets that can be downloaded and printed right here http://enoughgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1156

Good caliber and scope to start off with which should provide you with many years of enjoyment. One of the keys to accuracy is to relax, breathe and a gentle squeeze on the trigger.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by handofcod » 09 Apr 2015, 8:05 am

Yep little river has a selection of targets but more importantly they also have wire stands for you to hammer into the ground. Byo hammer. That ground can be rock hard if it hasn't has any rain.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by bigfellascott » 09 Apr 2015, 8:35 am

I assume you are using a scope? if so this is how I sight the rifle in.

Setup a target at say 10 or 20m or there abouts, take a shot, whilst keeping the xhairs on the Point of aim I then adjust the xhairs to where there bullet hole is, scopes now lined up with the bore and its just a matter of a fine tune at say 100m to get the vertical where you want it.

Saves heaps of time and ammo by doing it that way and usually only required around 2-3 shots all up!

Watch the video link - it will explain how its done, very quick and simple and it works - been doing it that way for years!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiOpQY2ORo4
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by TheDude » 09 Apr 2015, 9:15 am

That's how I sight mine in too. Just need a nice stable rest.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by bigfellascott » 09 Apr 2015, 10:03 am

TheDude wrote:That's how I sight mine in too. Just need a nice stable rest.


Works a treat hey. I see people farking around adjusting here there and everywhere and still can't get it sorted right, mind blowing how some go about sighting in their rifles :lol:

Had 2 fella's a while back trying to get a bullet on paper at 100m - they were shooting here there and everywhere and just couldn't seem to get a hole on paper so I suggested they bring the target into the 25m range put a mark in the centre of the target, look down the bore and make sure the target can be seen and take a shot, then do the adjustments I described above, they were shocked at how easy it was to get it all sorted by doing it that way and they were shooting groups in no time then :lol:

I probably should have stepped in earlier so they didn't waste boxes and boxes of ammo but I figured they'd have some idea of how to go about it all (I think they were police officers or rangers or something like that from memory) :unknown:

Either way they were clueless and the barrel, well she was running red hot :lol: :lol:
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Blackened » 09 Apr 2015, 11:54 am

handofcod wrote:This is probably shooting heresy but I wouldn't bother breaking it in.


Brace for impact! :lol:
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by handofcod » 09 Apr 2015, 12:27 pm

Blackened wrote:
handofcod wrote:This is probably shooting heresy but I wouldn't bother breaking it in.


Brace for impact! :lol:


LOL, just my dumb opinion. I haven't yet been sufficiently convinced that shooting and cleaning in a set number of iterations produces any discernible effect compared to say shooting 20 rounds slowly and then cleaning. I'm sure there is detailed and in depth discussion on the changes that a barrel undergoes in it's initial firing but the real question I need answered is: "That's all great, but how is it that changes to a barrel are different and beneficial simply by slightly rearranging the exact same activities?". My thinking is that the accepted 'break in' process may let a barrel arrive at it's optimal performance sooner than if not followed but then the question is more about the 'lost' optimal shooting time and in a factory rifle used for shooting things, that is complete non issue. Might be different for a custom target rifle of course.

As always, YMMV. Just because I haven't been convinced doesn't mean that other people are wrong, just that I'm skeptical. :drinks:
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Lorgar » 09 Apr 2015, 2:18 pm

I'm with handofcod on this.

There are very capable BR shooters who will disagree, and they get good results, but I've seen no evidence that it measurably improves anything.

If it were the case it would be very simple for someone to take two of the same rifles and break one in, not break in the other and show the results with the broken in rifle performing better. I've never seen such a test and of the millions of shooters out there someone would have done it if this was the case.

1,000 people would have done it by now.

People take an new rifle, follow their chosen break in process, find the rifle shoots well and credit breaking it in for the accuracy. A comparison of 1 is no comparison at all.

I've sold my previous rifles and just use my Tikka sporter now. This is the first 4 shots from it.

Image

And it still shoots the same hundreds of rounds later. Putting 100 round through it first in increments of 1 or 5 or 10 or whatever someone says would have just been a waste of 100 rounds and hours of my time.

If anyone has anything more than anecdotes which suggest the contrary I'm all ears.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Gwion » 11 Apr 2015, 3:58 pm

My understanding of the reason for the "shoot one, clean" method is in case there is any burring on the rifling or throat. The first round will loosen it and then you clean it so the next round doesn't pick up the loose bur and damage the barrel. So doing this a number of times is supposedly helping with a final "polish" of the barrel internals and, as mentioned above, minimising fouling. This is what i get from a number of articles and books i've read.

If i had a new barrel or rifle, i'd probably do it just to be on the safe side and do load development at the same time. So far i've only had a new 22lr and didn't get that anal about it but did do a 5/clean x3 then 10/clean for the first 50 rounds, just to be safe. Didn't think it was a waste of ammo because i would have put those rounds through to play with the rifle, anyway.

My 223 was second hand so who knows what the previous owner did.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by bluerob » 12 Apr 2015, 11:47 am

I've always wondered about the "breaking in" of brand new rifles, given that the factory usually shoots a few through before leaving the factory. Same applies to hand guns. My Tikka also came with a test target and a brass case.

When I bought a H&K Elite in 9mm (when you could buy them new in Australia, but, not any more it seems?), they came with a test target where 4 shots had been fired (in the middle at 25m....).
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Herdsman » 13 Apr 2015, 11:43 am

Gwion wrote:Didn't think it was a waste of ammo because i would have put those rounds through to play with the rifle, anyway.


If you're doing something with it while breaking it in fair enough

I think why most guys say it's a waste is some people don't use the break-in rounds to practice their technique or load dev.

They just feed and pull the trigger shooting nothing and waste 100 rounds.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by anthillinside » 13 Apr 2015, 6:06 pm

Just do what feels right.
New technology changes the way rifles are made and old habits die hard.
The religious 1 shot clean .. 5 Shot clean etc might have been valid back in the day when metallurgy was more of an art than a science and there was no 0.0001 CNC machines, but you can still get hand crafted so ….
50 years ago a new car had a rather specific run-in procedure, now just “drive away no more to pay” well almost.
If you buy Lamborghini your going to treat it differently to a Ford.
I just treat it nice and keep it clean and it works fine for me.
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Monty » 14 Apr 2015, 1:37 pm

Herdsman wrote:They just feed and pull the trigger shooting nothing and waste 100 rounds.


Or more.

Some say 300 rounds, I've seen it said as high as 500 before a barrel is "usable" :roll:
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Gwion » 17 Apr 2015, 8:16 am

Herdsman wrote:
They just feed and pull the trigger shooting nothing and waste 100 rounds.


That's just crazy. :crazy: :wtf: Must have rocks in thier heads!
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Re: breaking in/sighting in for first time

Post by Lyam » 17 Apr 2015, 11:19 am

What they won't have is money in their wallet doing that.
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