Airport security and snap caps!

[Hollywood]

Checked my handgun case in for my flight today and whilst waiting for the plane security came and saw me and wanted to know if I had ammunition in my handgun. I said no and then they showed me a X-ray of my handgun case which showed 'bullets' (their words) in the magazine. It took quite a bit of explaining that they were inert rounds, snap caps, pretend bullets, (whatever makes them sound safer) but they eventually believed me and allowed the firearm on the aircraft. I offered to show them what snap caps were in an effort to teach the but they weren't having that! Never had that problem before, didn't know they X-rayed the case individually either.

[Mr.Seacucumber]

No more snap caps for you then! Haha lucky you didn't get arrested for immatation ammunition!

[<<Genesis93>>]

Honestly, that quite a stupid move if you intentionally left them in there. You know yourself they could have been mistaken for ammo, it could have turn out quite differently with handguns drawn on you, now that borderfarce officers CARRY, not to mention the no doubt many AFP/ response units who'd be there in a flash.

They dont muck around at the airports, I've had guns 'readied' on me for much less than carrying ammo looking 'things' in firearm (not in Aus)

[AusTac]

s**t happens why were they in there anyway? Just a safe place? Wern't they able to tell via said xray there was no powder? And ferrous / non ferrous metals show up different right?

[Hollywood]

I don't know about 'stupid', complacent perhaps. I've checked in the same firearm, in the same case, with the same snap caps several times before without any dramas. This occurred in Roma of all places, it's been through Brisbane many time without any issues.

As a pilot I am well aware of the restrictions on the carriage of firearms and ammunition on aircraft, I must admit though I'd never considerer the snap caps an issue before. Like I said, a little complacent perhaps.

[Die Judicii]

Really, although a shock for you I think it was a good thing.
It shows that the authorities are trying to keep air travel as safe as possible for all concerned.

And, just because it was not at a major air terminal was even better.

[Hollywood]

I was surprised more than anything as I hadn't come across the issue before and I travel that same route with that same firearm every two weeks. They may have been training or something as there were a lot of security staff today for such a small terminal. It probably helped that I knew some of them also.

Aviation safety, for the most part, is an illusion. It's all about being seen to be doing something so Joe Public feels safer, much like a lot of the gun laws! CASA are a laughing stock at the moment with all of the regulatory changes they've introduced in the last couple of years that haven't worked and have cost the industry millions!

Anyway, I've learnt my lesson, the snap caps can stay home next time.

[happyhunter]

Pretend bullets like their pretend brains. They should understand that.

[Die Judicii]

Approx 2006 I had an experience with SkyAir (they went belly up) in FNQ.
I had prearranged the transport of a twin aluminium "air craft approved" firearms case containing a .308 and a 30/30
On the morning of my flight I presented myself and the letter of "pre approval" from the airline.

The first worrying sign of things not going to plan came when the departure staff told me that the case was maybe too big, and I would have to leave it behind.
After a rather heated response from myself, I argued that it was aircraft approved, and that it had already been pre approved.
They eventually conceded,,,,, and somehow suddenly decided that it would fit after all.

The next problem arose when the pilot took it upon himself to inspect the firearms and the case to make sure there wasn't any ammo in them.
When I opened the case, he peered at the rifles, and then said to me,,, "Where do you put the bullets in these things ?"

After trying real hard not to say YFI (you f*cking idiot), I showed him that they were all empty.
I didn't have the heart to tell him that the maximum allowed 5 kgs of ammo had already gone thru packed in my suitcase of clothes.
At that time, ammo was allowed in other checked in luggage as long as it was separate from any firearm. (Qantas)

I never could understand their ruling on that because they insisted it should be in the factory cardboard packets only.
I did query it with them by saying that normally, ammunition is to be stored in a locked and preferably steel container.
Not so, they said. It must be in the factory cardboard packets, and packed in between the clothes.

I haven't flown with firearms for quite a few years now, but I think NO AMMO at all is the rule now.
Can anyone verify that for my interest sake ????

[Hollywood]

You can take up to 5kg of ammo in your normal checked baggage with prior approval from the airline. You need to provide all the usual info, name, licence details, contact info, etc. You get an approval letter from the airline which you obviously need to bring with you when checking in.

The ammo needs to be in the original packaging but Qantas also say 'or equivalent'.

[<<Genesis93>>]

Pretend bullets like their pretend brains. They should understand that.

Until you prove to their pretend brains otherwise...... theyre real and would be treated as such.....

Those numbsculls refused to allow a key chain fob shaped like a pistol, 4cm long, onto a flight.....so even if you placed a snap cap in their hand its still 'real'

[AusTac]

Those numbsculls refused to allow a key chain fob shaped like a pistol, 4cm long, onto a flight

now thats some funny s**t

[Title_II]

Why on earth would you keep your handgun loaded with snapcaps?

I understand using them in drills, but that makes no sense.

[<<Genesis93>>]

Those numbsculls refused to allow a key chain fob shaped like a pistol, 4cm long, onto a flight

now thats some funny s**t

It was.... we were threatened with a call to the AFP, I suggested she call them, sooner rather than later... she did, then returned about 5min later suggesting I was very lucky in this instance as I would be allowed to continue ...THIS time... "but dont do it again".

I suggested that when she rang up the AFP commander at the airport and sought their presence as a passenger was trying to board a flight with a 4cm beretta pistol fob on a keyring.....it was met with a dial tone at the other end

[Oldbloke]

Lol I had to argue one day to take a 3" spanner look a like bottle opener on board one day. The people doing the checking simply dont know.
If you think about it firearms, knives, and explosives are specialised areas and a few days training that they get is bugger all. So they just do what they are told or think is best.

[Die Judicii]

Pretend bullets like their pretend brains. They should understand that.

Until you prove to their pretend brains otherwise...... theyre real and would be treated as such.....

Those numbsculls refused to allow a key chain fob shaped like a pistol, 4cm long, onto a flight.....so even if you placed a snap cap in their hand its still 'real'

Yep, and as Old Bloke said also,,,,

I was in the line up one day to go into the departure area when a bloke in front of me was stopped because he had an "Adjustable Wrench" key fob hanging off his keys.
It was about 2" long and made out of chrome plated plastic.
They totally refused to let him pass thru till he took it off and surrendered it to them.

Geez,,,,,,,,,,, I'd hate to get a whack on the back of the scone with that awesome weapon.

[coloradoboy]

stupid. I travel with firearms for flights from Denver to Anchorage for our summer hunt on our family's property. Even in Alaska, you never put any ammo or whatever crap in the mag or in the chamber or in the same rifle case. The TSA as incompetent as they are, it is reasonable for them to mistake it as live ammo.

and trust me we 3 boys look pretty hardcore with all the hunting supplies we bring out but you never pack ammo in the same container.

[Title_II]

That's not a TSA requirement. It's a requirement of some airlines, I think US Air maybe. When I travel I bring one handgun for self defense and very little ammo, like a box. I have the ammo and loaded mags in the same box as the gun. The TSA requirement is that the ammo is "enclosed," and I put mag covers over the loaded mags. In most states I am armed again before I leave the airport.

[Hollywood]

Why on earth would you keep your handgun loaded with snap caps.

They came with the gun when I bought it a few months ago. I've been leaving the magazines full of empty cases in an effort to relax the spring a bit as it is nigh on impossible to get the last (10th) round in from new. I chucked the snap caps in simply as a way to carry them! As I said, it's been through Brisbane airport many times without an issue, it's just not something I'd thought of as a concern.

Not sure what it's like in the States but our screening and security people don't carry firearms in the airports over here, only the Aus Federal Police do and they're only at the larger airports.

[<<Genesis93>>]

Borderfarce are now armed.... or at least permitted to be armed "for self defence"... so if you dont see them carrying yet.... expect it soon.

[AusTac]

Seems a little hardcore for customs to be armed, all they seem to is sit at a desk and shake down some luggage here and there, never heard of a customs officer " if only we had firearms "

[<<Genesis93>>]

The worst part is the absolute hypocrisy of us generally....we are hell bent as a 'collective' on demanding everyone treat everyone else as equals.... except for police, customs officers and certain other special people who are allowed to carry sidearms, not to protect others, but for themselves...'SELF DEFENCE', yet ordinary people are specifically prevented from the same.

[bluerob]

The worst part is the absolute hypocrisy of us generally....we are hell bent as a 'collective' on demanding everyone treat everyone else as equals.... except for police, customs officers and certain other special people who are allowed to carry sidearms, not to protect others, but for themselves...'SELF DEFENCE', yet ordinary people are specifically prevented from the same.

Your post reminded me of a forum signature or comment I read recently:

"I can't carry a police officer on my hip."

[Tindog]

so all guns have to be carried in separate and checked, then stowed with "checked baggage"?? can a hand gun in a locked case no ammo, cannot be taken as carry on baggage??

[MR. WINCHESTER]

What a depressing place this thread has migrated to ...

Please ( dear Lord ) don't allow my country to follow the rot of the f**ked up U.S.A.

Our police do a great job ( all things considered ) and there is zero need for CCW .... ATM

Please don't oil the squeaky wheel / pander to the wannabe Rambos.