best way to look after my new rifle

[colsta]

Hi guys i just bought my first brand new rifle Savage axis 308 stainless barrel with a synthetic stock what's some good tips on keeping it in like new condition
thanks

[Supaduke]

Easy.......coat it in grease and never use it

Rifles wear out, it's just how it is. All centrefires have a finite amount of rounds it can fire accurately.

For best longevity keep it clean, keep it lubed, keep all metal parts coated in some sort of barrier film. Ballistol, G96, Inox, hoppes. There are many others. Any reputable brand will basically do the same thing. Reapply it every few months if you don't use the rifle. Always clean your rifle after you use it, be it 1 shot or 100.

You will get all sorts of advice on how to clean your rifle. Everyone does it different, everyone thinks their method is best.

All you need to remember is
1) remove all contaminants
2) make sure all metal is coated in a film of oil. Bare metal exposed to oxygen oxidises (rusts)
3) moisture is bad
4) stainless is rust resistant, not rust proof
5) you want a light film of oil, not dripping off

[colsta]

thanks supaduke

[Slant225]

Great information. What type of bore brush is used and when?

[in2anity]

Great information. What type of bore brush is used and when?

Perhaps a more pertinent question; how often, if at all should one use a brush? Personally, particularly if when I'm shooting jacketed rounds (as opposed to cast-lead) I try to minimize the amount of brushing I do. Maybe one in five shoots do I brush, otherwise I just stick to patches. That said this is a highly debatable topic, and these are just my opinions.

[Oldbloke]

More info here.

https://ssaa.org.au/stories/stories-home.html

[bigfellascott]

I always use a brush each time I clean the rifles, generally I put a patch through a few times with the solvent of choice, let it sit for 10mins or so then scrub the bore with a bronze brush too loosen everything up a little let that sit for a few mins then patch out, reapply some solvent again let it sit then patch out until clean, I also use nylon brushes too, just depends how bad the bore is fouled as to what brush I use.

Then I clean all solvent out with Metho let it dry out for a few mins then put my oil down the bore to protect it, give the metal parts a wipe over with Inox/Lanox/sewing Machine oil - what ever is handy to me and then put it away until I'm ready to use it again, then I just patch the bore out to remove any oil etc, lube the bolt lugs and go shoot some ferals.

[happyhunter]

Rust and Politicians are a guns worst enemy. Keep the rifle lubed and dry in storage, clean the bore after every days shoot and think carefully before you vote.

[Mitch]

The way I do it:
Clean it every time it goes out

Patches with solvent till powder appears gone.
Foaming bore cleaner, sit for 15min
Then scrub with nylon brush
Then patch it until clean
Once happy with this run 2 patches through coated in oil.
Coat and wipe outside with G96
Store in safe

[Bigjobss]

Ever since I was a kid I used a combination of Hoppes solvent for the bore followed by Sweets oil after patching/brushing and Lanox for all external applicatione including the stock. Bit of sweets on the bolt too.
I have continued this system recently after getting back into the hobby, the smell of Hoppes brought back some memories!
Always patch out the oil before shooting.

I remember reading a rundown of a test where some guy coated a bunch of washers in the most popular gun oils he could find and left them out to elements, I can't remember what had the best anti-corrosive properties but I do remeber that Remoil was one of the worst.

[OODAH]

Rust and Politicians are a guns worst enemy. Keep the rifle lubed and dry in storage, clean the bore after every days shoot and think carefully before you vote.

This is perfect!

[in2anity]

My 2c for what it's worth, besides a single oil patch followed by a dry patch, I don't really "clean" barrels that are shooting cast lead. This applies to both 22s shooting match lead and centerfires shooting cast lead. Perhaps every 500 rounds will I give them a proper clean (with a brush and solvent). This is the strategy we employed when I was once in a target club shooting target 22s in my teens. If you're shooting more than once a week you don't even need the oil patch - it really does throw off that first sighter and it's only really needed for storage purposes. In fact you can just use a bore snake once a day instead in this scenario.

Jacketed loads; yeah after each day I'll run a few hoppes patches through followed up by an oil and dry, but nothing excessive. I've noticed no difference in accuracy and and barrel longevity taking this minimalistic approach. A lot more barrels are damaged due to excessive and aggressive cleaning than from burn-out. I always cringe when I see shooters scrubbing the bejeezes out of their barrels at the end of a day after perhaps only a mere 20 rounds. Again I might give it a good brushing after many hundred, but definitely not every shoot.

[bladeracer]

Jacketed loads; yeah after each day I'll run a few hoppes patches through followed up by an oil and dry, but nothing excessive. I've noticed no difference in accuracy and and barrel longevity taking this minimalistic approach. A lot more barrels are damaged due to excessive and aggressive cleaning than from burn-out. I always cringe when I see shooters scrubbing the bejeezes out of their barrels at the end of a day after perhaps only a mere 20 rounds. Again I might give it a good brushing after many hundred, but definitely not every shoot.

It depends primarily on what you're shooting.
High-velocity, tight-twist, small-bore is generally going to foul quicker than a low-velocity, big-bore with more relaxed twist rate. I lose accuracy significantly sooner in the .204 shooting 4400fps 24gn bullets than when I'm shooting 2400fps 32gn bullets.
Cleaning the bore more often simply makes for an easier job. You can leave it until it starts throwing shots, but expect the job to be that much tougher.

[in2anity]

Jacketed loads; yeah after each day I'll run a few hoppes patches through followed up by an oil and dry, but nothing excessive. I've noticed no difference in accuracy and and barrel longevity taking this minimalistic approach. A lot more barrels are damaged due to excessive and aggressive cleaning than from burn-out. I always cringe when I see shooters scrubbing the bejeezes out of their barrels at the end of a day after perhaps only a mere 20 rounds. Again I might give it a good brushing after many hundred, but definitely not every shoot.

It depends primarily on what you're shooting.
High-velocity, tight-twist, small-bore is generally going to foul quicker than a low-velocity, big-bore with more relaxed twist rate. I lose accuracy significantly sooner in the .204 shooting 4400fps 24gn bullets than when I'm shooting 2400fps 32gn bullets.
Cleaning the bore more often simply makes for an easier job. You can leave it until it starts throwing shots, but expect the job to be that much tougher.

Totally agree - but IMO I still don't think it's necessary to brush every clean. My friend shoots a .204, and he has literally never used a brush on it. He simply runs patches and hoppes till they come out clean. After close to 1000 rounds, it still shoots well under moa. Now I don't think ignoring the brush completely like this is a good idea - butI believe it should be used fairly rarely.

All that said I must say I'm not super experienced in the use of super fast modern calibers/cartridges, so I definitely respect everyone's opinion here.

[brett1868]

I thought I was champion barrel cleaner till I purchased a bore scope. Even with all the methods above I can almost guarantee the bore wont be spotless and free of contaminants. It's both amazing and depressing sticking the camera down the bore after a "Good" cleaning only to find copper and / or lead residue. I clean in the usual ways with solvent, brushing, patching, copper solvent, patching, then oiling but once I've done this I get a worn brush and wrap a bit of flannel around it. A few dabs of JB boreshine then back into it, replacing the patch every 10-20 strokes and repeating the process. When appropriately "Shiny" on the inside ill hit it with a squirt of Bore Scrubber and nylon brush before patching dry and oiling ready for storage. I'm never sure how long a rifle will sit in the safe between uses so I tend to over oil the bores and wipe down all metal with a oily rag just for my own piece of mind.

[in2anity]

I thought I was champion barrel cleaner till I purchased a bore scope. Even with all the methods above I can almost guarantee the bore wont be spotless and free of contaminants. It's both amazing and depressing sticking the camera down the bore after a "Good" cleaning only to find copper and / or lead residue. I clean in the usual ways with solvent, brushing, patching, copper solvent, patching, then oiling but once I've done this I get a worn brush and wrap a bit of flannel around it. A few dabs of JB boreshine then back into it, replacing the patch every 10-20 strokes and repeating the process. When appropriately "Shiny" on the inside ill hit it with a squirt of Bore Scrubber and nylon brush before patching dry and oiling ready for storage. I'm never sure how long a rifle will sit in the safe between uses so I tend to over oil the bores and wipe down all metal with a oily rag just for my own piece of mind.

Wow sounds like you sure get em shiny. But when it comes to accuracy, are you sure the shinier your barrel is, the more accurate it is? I mean, in a lot of the data I've gathered over the years, I've found most rifles actually like a bit of fouling before they really settle down to reach their intrinsic accuracy. In fact I never take a rifle into the field unfired after a clean...

[bladeracer]

Totally agree - but IMO I still don't think it's necessary to brush every clean. My friend shoots a .204, and he has literally never used a brush on it. He simply runs patches and hoppes till they come out clean. After close to 1000 rounds, it still shoots well under moa. Now I don't think ignoring the brush completely like this is a good idea - butI believe it should be used fairly rarely.

All that said I must say I'm not super experienced in the use of super fast modern calibers/cartridges, so I definitely respect everyone's opinion here.

I agree, brushing is only necessary if there is copper or lead to remove.
I don't clean the bore every time I take a rifle out, I log how many shots I took and then clean based on that.
If I'm shooting high-velocity .204 loads I try to clean the bore at 30 rounds, as accuracy is going away by then. With the low-velocity rounds I probably won't clean at all until I'm ready to shoot the high-vel's again. My .204 is approaching 1000rds as well.

[bigfellascott]

I thought I was champion barrel cleaner till I purchased a bore scope. Even with all the methods above I can almost guarantee the bore wont be spotless and free of contaminants. It's both amazing and depressing sticking the camera down the bore after a "Good" cleaning only to find copper and / or lead residue. I clean in the usual ways with solvent, brushing, patching, copper solvent, patching, then oiling but once I've done this I get a worn brush and wrap a bit of flannel around it. A few dabs of JB boreshine then back into it, replacing the patch every 10-20 strokes and repeating the process. When appropriately "Shiny" on the inside ill hit it with a squirt of Bore Scrubber and nylon brush before patching dry and oiling ready for storage. I'm never sure how long a rifle will sit in the safe between uses so I tend to over oil the bores and wipe down all metal with a oily rag just for my own piece of mind.

Yes Brett what gets seen with a borescope cannot be unseen! not a good idea to look down bores unless you want to be as someone pointed out earlier they are designed to wear out and are a consumable item, just use them and enjoy them and when they are well and truly shot out either replace the barrel or buy another rifle.

I reckon some people do more damage than good when it comes to cleaning bores at times, you see them scrub the crap out of it like nobodies business then dick around doing this that and every other thing and still can't shoot for s**t anyway

[brett1868]

I thought I was champion barrel cleaner till I purchased a bore scope. Even with all the methods above I can almost guarantee the bore wont be spotless and free of contaminants. It's both amazing and depressing sticking the camera down the bore after a "Good" cleaning only to find copper and / or lead residue. I clean in the usual ways with solvent, brushing, patching, copper solvent, patching, then oiling but once I've done this I get a worn brush and wrap a bit of flannel around it. A few dabs of JB boreshine then back into it, replacing the patch every 10-20 strokes and repeating the process. When appropriately "Shiny" on the inside ill hit it with a squirt of Bore Scrubber and nylon brush before patching dry and oiling ready for storage. I'm never sure how long a rifle will sit in the safe between uses so I tend to over oil the bores and wipe down all metal with a oily rag just for my own piece of mind.

Yes Brett what gets seen with a borescope cannot be unseen! not a good idea to look down bores unless you want to be as someone pointed out earlier they are designed to wear out and are a consumable item, just use them and enjoy them and when they are well and truly shot out either replace the barrel or buy another rifle.

I reckon some people do more damage than good when it comes to cleaning bores at times, you see them scrub the crap out of it like nobodies business then dick around doing this that and every other thing and still can't shoot for s**t anyway

I've got a few barrels that'll cost in excess of 4k each to replace so I tend to look after them very well. I'm not so anal on every rifle, just those where it counts and all the pistols. Generally damage caused by cleaning can be attributed to not using a bore guide, wrong chemicals or leaving them in too long or damaging the crown. Projectiles traveling > 3000fps will do far more damage then a proper cleaning with bronze brushes, Hoppes, Sweets etc etc as in it'll get shot out before worn out by scrubbing My 300Wby Mag is a copper fouling monster but others are fine, I do follow a regime of barrel break in but that's another contentious subject. "Let the barrel dictate the cleaning regime" is my approach, some will foul more then others and will require a little more time or aggressive approach to cleaning.

Like any topic, it's all BS without pictures so I downloaded the pictures from the bore scope as an indication of just how much crap can be left behind. Each barrel had been quite well cleaned using solvent and brushes and appeared fine to the naked eye. Bring on the bore scope....

Below pic is from a Colt Gold Cup 45ACP shooting 200gr Hornady XTP's. Gave the barrel a "good" cleaning with solvent, brushing, patching etc etc. It's "Clean" but still signs of fouling and copper.

After a good regular clean.

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Same spot up close after cleaning with JB's Non Embedding Bore Cleaning Compound (just checked the name on the tub) - I love this s**t, guaranteed not to damage the bore and picture proves results.

After JB's

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Approx 200 rounds of 122gr Coated LRN. Notice the thickness of the lead fouling, could have brushed it for hours and still not removed it all.

Walther Q5 Match after "Cleaning".

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Oh so shiny

After JB's

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I'm cleaning on average 6-8 barrels a week at the moment (5 from just last nights fun) and I'm still learning and improving. A clean rifle is a happy rifle and happy rifles shoot better then grumpy ones

[bigfellascott]

Yeah ya gotta look after em if they cost $4k! I think people get a bit over worried about all this stuff, fair enough if you are into high end comp shooting and every little detail helps get the best out of your shooting etc, but for the average bloke who rolls up to a range for a bit of plinking etc or goes for a shot in the bush every now and then well it's not so important to be that anal about it, a little rough patch of carbon or a bit of copper etc isn't world ending in that situation.

I ran the 22-250 for around 120 shots I think it was before I decided to give it a clean and it was still shooting like a demon, a mate and I put up a target at 270m and I had a couple of shots to see where it was shooting at that distance and both shots landed almost touching which surprised me and my mate too cos the ol Howso out shot his flash Sako with a Maddco big arsed heavy barrel on it.
I can't remember why I hadn't cleaned it for so long as normally I would after each time I went out (I may have been doing some culling work or been to the range, too long ago to remember now My 204 has a couple of patches of carbon present in the bore, but it shoots fine for my need so I figure I will just leave it be and when and if it really starts shooting badly I will get some of the JB's and give it a good ol scrub and see how that effects it (if it ain't broke leave it alone type thing for me)

Did you go to the last 50cal shoot? I know John and Michelle did but can't remember how they went now.

[brett1868]

Did you go to the last 50cal shoot? I know John and Michelle did but can't remember how they went now.

You'd have thought the organisers would have emailed the previous competitors about the upcoming shoot, advertised it better or even update their website with information / dates of upcoming shoots. I only found out about it a week before on a post on AHN and already had plans to go bush for furry target shooting so I didn't go. The last update on the Mildura LRSC site is from June, nothing in there about the last 2 competitions. I wasn't overly impressed with the organisation of the last shoot having been told that it was factory ammo only, then to find out halfway through the day that some were using match prepped reloads as they had asked the organiser for permission. Mildura is 11hrs and 1009km each way from home and to compete on a Saturday costs me close to $3000 in lost pay, fuel, accommodation and ammo so for that kind of investment I want a level playing field.
It's no secret that I wasn't overly happy with my score but considering 2 other much better shooters then I finished within 1 point of me using my rifle and ammo I'm confident I shot to the capabilities of the rifle on the day by finishing mid field. Project 50 is due back in Sydney late January so I'll make the next comp in Mildura if I can find out when its on, I can't lose if I'm the only shooter in a class My next project is currently being debated in Canberra due to the nature of the cartridge involved, the update from Border Force yesterday was that I should get an answer within the next 2 weeks. The US F.C.S.A titles are scheduled for June 30 next year in New Mexico so all going to plan I'll compete there in the heavy gun class and possibly "King of the 2 Mile" if I can get a rifle built in time which is very doubtful at the moment.

[in2anity]

Yeah ya gotta look after em if they cost $4k! I think people get a bit over worried about all this stuff, fair enough if you are into high end comp shooting and every little detail helps get the best out of your shooting etc, but for the average bloke who rolls up to a range for a bit of plinking etc or goes for a shot in the bush every now and then well it's not so important to be that anal about it, a little rough patch of carbon or a bit of copper etc isn't world ending in that situation.

And even if you are shooting comp, the type of comp you are shooting will dictate your cleaning regime. How much of a difference do you truly think a "shiny" bore will make vs a "clean" bore. For example in a 3-position comp, considering 99% of error comes from the user, IMO rigorous cleaning vs moderate cleaning will make an immeasurable difference. Granted a select few types of comps at the very highest of levels may demand a strict regime, but how many of us on here can claim to be operating at that level?

For most of us pinking across the bonnet of a ute, or even popping a goat at 300m with a .204, a simple regime (with some brushing once in a while) is more than enough to maintain excellent accuracy.

[bigfellascott]

Did you go to the last 50cal shoot? I know John and Michelle did but can't remember how they went now.

You'd have thought the organisers would have emailed the previous competitors about the upcoming shoot, advertised it better or even update their website with information / dates of upcoming shoots. I only found out about it a week before on a post on AHN and already had plans to go bush for furry target shooting so I didn't go. The last update on the Mildura LRSC site is from June, nothing in there about the last 2 competitions. I wasn't overly impressed with the organisation of the last shoot having been told that it was factory ammo only, then to find out halfway through the day that some were using match prepped reloads as they had asked the organiser for permission. Mildura is 11hrs and 1009km each way from home and to compete on a Saturday costs me close to $3000 in lost pay, fuel, accommodation and ammo so for that kind of investment I want a level playing field.
It's no secret that I wasn't overly happy with my score but considering 2 other much better shooters then I finished within 1 point of me using my rifle and ammo I'm confident I shot to the capabilities of the rifle on the day by finishing mid field. Project 50 is due back in Sydney late January so I'll make the next comp in Mildura if I can find out when its on, I can't lose if I'm the only shooter in a class My next project is currently being debated in Canberra due to the nature of the cartridge involved, the update from Border Force yesterday was that I should get an answer within the next 2 weeks. The US F.C.S.A titles are scheduled for June 30 next year in New Mexico so all going to plan I'll compete there in the heavy gun class and possibly "King of the 2 Mile" if I can get a rifle built in time which is very doubtful at the moment.

That's a bummer mate I guess they are new to the whole thing so some issues will be inevitable I guess. She's an expensive hobby alright. I think John mentioned something about the comp in the us too a while back not sure if he will be going or not.

He also had some issues with factory ammo to going by his post on AHN.

[colsta]

thanks for all your help guys

[straightshooter]

Just a comment on the use of JB paste and other abrasive cleaners.
Have you ever wondered what that black stuff is on your patch when you have used JB paste?
It is called barrel steel.
JB paste has it's uses but only if you use it very sparingly particularly if you have a hand lapped match grade barrel.
Yes it might remove some stubborn fouling but only at the cost of abrasion on other parts of the barrel without fouling.

[brett1868]

Just a comment on the use of JB paste and other abrasive cleaners.
Have you ever wondered what that black stuff is on your patch when you have used JB paste?
It is called barrel steel.
JB paste has it's uses but only if you use it very sparingly particularly if you have a hand lapped match grade barrel.
Yes it might remove some stubborn fouling but only at the cost of abrasion on other parts of the barrel without fouling.

Yes it's abrasive but so fine that it'd take more cleans then the life of the barrel to damage it. There's never been a report of JB's damaging rifling in over 50 years and while not perfect, it another cleaning tool in the arsenal. Not every rifle of mine gets the full effort required with JB's but I do use it on the pistols cause barrels are cheap, easily replaced and it does a good job. My BR barrel is hand lapped so doesn't get the JB treatment because you can have a barrel that's too shiny which isn't necessarily a good thing, Butch's bore shine gets the job done perfectly in this case.
Barrel cleaning is one of those contentious issues amongst shooters, bit like which caliber is best for Deer I generally follow the recommendations made by Daniel Lilja as he has a proven track record of world titles , Olympic gold and dead insurgents.