Norinco JW-15A

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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Wm.Traynor » 29 Jan 2017, 4:34 pm

Buddy77 wrote:One thing ive heard most JW-15 owners do is "float" the barrel BUT! ive also read doin this can actually make it worse I'm guessing that they bed the action too. and that a pressure point in some cases need to be added. I dont really understand how you would find the pressure point IMO, forget it. Float the barrel and bed the action. and what you would do to rectify it. So off to do some more reading.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by happyhunter » 30 Jan 2017, 8:29 am

Title_II wrote:Yanks can't import Norinco. Thanks Clinton! :mad:

I need to email Trump and tell him to put that on his list of stuff to fix.


..yeah.. and thank Bush Jnr for expanding the ban on Norinco imports back in 2003.

I wouldn't put to much hope in the new POTUS. He no like China one bit.

Political rubbish aside, shame you can't buy JW-15s. They are great guns for the money.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Gwion » 30 Jan 2017, 9:47 am

Wm.Traynor wrote:
Buddy77 wrote:One thing ive heard most JW-15 owners do is "float" the barrel BUT! ive also read doin this can actually make it worse I'm guessing that they bed the action too. and that a pressure point in some cases need to be added. I dont really understand how you would find the pressure point IMO, forget it. Float the barrel and bed the action. and what you would do to rectify it. So off to do some more reading.


Bedding action and floating the barrel doesn't always work. My Sportco 22lr didn't like a floating barrel one bit, even with the action bedded. After experimenting with shims in the barrel channel, i found the right pressure point and epoxied some bracing in there. Improved rifle consistency out of sight.

I was emailing a custom gun maker in the States a few years ago and his theory was that the best accuracy comes from a fully bedded action and barrel; that is all along the barrel channel, effectively making the barrel shorter and stiffer and tightening the harmonics. He seemed to think that floating was the most common form of accurising because it was the cheapest, easiest thing to do on the production line. He had some nice rifles and solid comp results to back up his theory. I might trial it on a rifle one day.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Wm.Traynor » 30 Jan 2017, 2:12 pm

Gwion,
Don't let me discourage you from your experiment. FWIW however, I come from a background where Every barrel floats and has done since the Omark was introduced. Fifty years ago? :unknown:
I do agree that barrel floating is cheap c.f. fully bedded. But is it more accurate? The only way to find out would be to fully bed first, try it out, then float it and observe the results.
One more thing. If you want to "effectively" shorten the barrel, how about the so-called "glue job"? A few inches of barrel are epoxied in to the barrel channel, while the rest floats. :)
Just thought of something else. In the case where floating does not work in a rimfire. Try different ammo. Study the shape of the group for vertical dispersion. Recrown? Failing all that, give up and do what you did :) to the Sportco.

Would love to know how that project goes :thumbsup:
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Gwion » 30 Jan 2017, 2:35 pm

Wm.Traynor wrote:Gwion,
Don't let me discourage you from your experiment. FWIW however, I come from a background where Every barrel floats and has done since the Omark was introduced. Fifty years ago? :unknown:
I do agree that barrel floating is cheap c.f. fully bedded. But is it more accurate? The only way to find out would be to fully bed first, try it out, then float it and observe the results.
One more thing. If you want to "effectively" shorten the barrel, how about the so-called "glue job"? A few inches of barrel are epoxied in to the barrel channel, while the rest floats. :)
Just thought of something else. In the case where floating does not work in a rimfire. Try different ammo. Study the shape of the group for vertical dispersion. Recrown? Failing all that, give up and do what you did :) to the Sportco.

Would love to know how that project goes :thumbsup:


I was thinking of going the other way around when i rebarrel the Zasty with my new wildcat (if and when funds ever allow!). Rebarrel with light profile 1:14 twist 22cal barrel. Float barrel from 1 inch forward of action. Run full load development to find best accuracy. Bed barrel to end of barrel channel and do another round of load development to see if better accuracy is achieved. Depending on results, i can either leave it or refloat it. Will cost bugger all but a bit of time.

I know the practice of floating has been common wisdom for many many years, i just think it's interesting that this particular custom gun maker thought that a proper stock made of well seasoned and sealed timber, fully bedded, would give better accuracy than floating. His theory, not mine, but i am happy to test it. He did clarify that this only relates to centerfire for some reason and that either floating or pressure bedding is the way to go with rimfire.

I was going to mention gluing in my last post. Apparently the AI rifles are glued in, again flying in the face of common wisdom that the barreled action needs some ability to recoil under battery in the bedding. This is one that i'm not so keed to play with as once it's glued properly it would be a big job to roll back if needed.

The Sporty came out pretty good. Had it re-crowned, a few old farmyard gun smithing screw-ups repaired and tried upwards of a dozen ammo types through it (as many as i could source locally). After pressure bedding it went from around 1" at 25m to one hole at 25m with Winchester PPmax. It's still no target rifle but can easily drop 5 into well under the inch at 50m. I also put a pillar in the back screw and bedded the action to just forward of the barrel lug.

I quite enjoy playing around with all these different theories that get bandied about and seeing what actually work for me and my rifles.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 30 Jan 2017, 7:52 pm

Does anyone know if these come in left handed versions?
At what point does lack of maintenance become patina?
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 31 Jan 2017, 7:45 am

in2anity wrote:Does anyone know if these come in left handed versions?


To answer my own question, no they don't, OSA got back to me. :( - my mate who is lefty really struggles with my right handed bolts...
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Gwion » 31 Jan 2017, 8:25 am

CZ & Lithgow are the cheapest lefty rimfires you can get. Unless Zasty do one, but i'm pretty sure they only do lefty centerfires. Took ages to choose a lefty 22lr. I ended up with a Browning T-bolt.

edit: Nope... Savage do the Mark II in lefty 22lr as well.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Barrettmr » 31 Jan 2017, 11:09 am

I wouldn't touch a savage rimfire again with a barge pole, the one that I do have is only marginally accurate for a about 40 rounds, and then it shotguns. A cleaning patch reveals very LARGE flake of lead stuck in the barrel. :crazy:

Hence the CZ :thumbsup:
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by happyhunter » 31 Jan 2017, 11:51 am

in2anity wrote:
in2anity wrote:Does anyone know if these come in left handed versions?


To answer my own question, no they don't, OSA got back to me. :( - my mate who is lefty really struggles with my right handed bolts...


Are you looking for a rifle for your mate? The CZ452 is still made in left hand configuration. The other option is buy a straight pull rifle. Both of you will be able to shoot it without difficulty.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 31 Jan 2017, 1:24 pm

happyhunter wrote:
in2anity wrote:Are you looking for a rifle for your mate? The CZ452 is still made in left hand configuration. The other option is buy a straight pull rifle. Both of you will be able to shoot it without difficulty.


... or a lever, although we already have levers and rolling blocks, so perhaps a straight pull for something different. Maybe something to look into cheers :drinks:
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by happyhunter » 31 Jan 2017, 4:03 pm

in2anity wrote:
happyhunter wrote:
in2anity wrote:Are you looking for a rifle for your mate? The CZ452 is still made in left hand configuration. The other option is buy a straight pull rifle. Both of you will be able to shoot it without difficulty.


... or a lever, although we already have levers and rolling blocks, so perhaps a straight pull for something different. Maybe something to look into cheers :drinks:


Lever 22s are ok for plinking, but for those longer precise head shots on bunnies a bolt gun does it better.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Oldbloke » 31 Jan 2017, 4:27 pm

"Lever 22s are ok for plinking, but for those longer precise head shots on bunnies a bolt gun does it better."

Spot on. Bolt actions are the most accurate.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 31 Jan 2017, 6:15 pm

There's a couple of 96/22s on Used Guns - they're meant to be pretty accurate for a 22 lever right?
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Buddy77 » 31 Jan 2017, 10:56 pm

Early marlin 39A's are supposed to be very accurate, before Remington took over and moved the machinery. So ive been told.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by deye243 » 01 Feb 2017, 3:12 am

I have a mate with a henry leaver 22 that damn thing will shoot .5 - .75 with ccl mini mags :roll: :crazy:

trigger is better than my LA101
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 01 Feb 2017, 6:25 am

deye243 wrote:I have a mate with a henry leaver 22 that damn thing will shoot .5 - .75 with ccl mini mags :roll: :crazy:

trigger is better than my LA101


Yeah agreed - whilst I'm definitely also guilty of making the whole "bolts are more accurate than levers" statement in the past, it's a pretty big generalisation. Stereotypically this is true, but if you take it on a gun-by-gun basis, there are always exceptions to the rule.

From what I've read, those old Marlin 39As sound like the ultimate plinker - the ergonomics of a lever with the accuracy of a bolt. Pity they're as rare as hens teeth down under... :(
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by happyhunter » 01 Feb 2017, 6:31 am

I didn't say more accurate. I said bolts are better for precise long shots. If you are going to be shooting over long distances from a supported shooting position you don't use a lever. gun. Now, before all the lever lovers start ranting about how accurate their mates john Wayne is have a think about the type of action people generally choose for long range shooting and why.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 01 Feb 2017, 6:39 am

Oldbloke wrote:"Lever 22s are ok for plinking, but for those longer precise head shots on bunnies a bolt gun does it better."

Spot on. Bolt actions are the most accurate.


in2anity wrote:
deye243 wrote:I have a mate with a henry leaver 22 that damn thing will shoot .5 - .75 with ccl mini mags :roll: :crazy:

trigger is better than my LA101


Yeah agreed - whilst I'm definitely also guilty of making the whole "bolts are more accurate than levers" statement in the past, it's a pretty big generalisation. Stereotypically this is true, but if you take it on a gun-by-gun basis, there are always exceptions to the rule.

From what I've read, those old Marlin 39As sound like the ultimate plinker - the ergonomics of a lever with the accuracy of a bolt. Pity they're as rare as hens teeth down under... :(


happyhunter wrote:I didn't say more accurate. I said bolts are better for precise long shots. If you are going to be shooting over long distances from a supported shooting position you don't use a lever. gun. Now, before all the lever lovers start ranting about how accurate their mates john Wayne is have a think about the type of action people generally choose for long range shooting and why.


Deep breaths buddy, deep breaths :drinks:
Last edited by in2anity on 01 Feb 2017, 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by happyhunter » 01 Feb 2017, 6:41 am

For what?
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 01 Feb 2017, 6:43 am

happyhunter wrote:For what?


Helps with the anger :sarcasm: :friends:
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Oldbloke » 01 Feb 2017, 5:56 pm

So, which type of rifle dominates the long range target shooting comps? Lever, pump, semi auto, or bolt action?
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by happyhunter » 01 Feb 2017, 6:02 pm

in2anity wrote:
happyhunter wrote:For what?


Helps with the anger :sarcasm: :friends:


I've been told buy a few people that I have no emotions and anger is an emotion so this is definitely a step forward :D
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Buddy77 » 01 Feb 2017, 7:24 pm

I just came back from 7 weeks the the US and the prices for bolt actions and 39A's will make you cry, there must be some kind of firearms import tax as with difference in the Australian dollar they are still very cheap.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 01 Feb 2017, 7:28 pm

Oldbloke wrote:So, which type of rifle dominates the long range target shooting comps? Lever, pump, semi auto, or bolt action?


Well it depends on the context of the "comp" and the definition of "long range". Nobody's denying F class and Fullbore demand a bolt gun OB. But how about metallic silhouette? The rams are pretty "long range" in my books. Also, a rolling-block creedmore hitting plates at 1000yds seems to defy logic :o - point is there are always exceptions to the rules...
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by in2anity » 01 Feb 2017, 7:28 pm

Buddy77 wrote:I just came back from 7 weeks the the US and the prices for bolt actions and 39A's will make you cry, there must be some kind of firearms import tax as with difference in the Australian dollar they are still very cheap.


This makes me sad :(
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Oldbloke » 01 Feb 2017, 8:50 pm

Could be tax, would not surprise me. But doesn't noia pretty much have a monopoly?

Re-most accurate. Silly discussion. Bolts r most accurate. Most suitable or preferred is different. Bolts, pumps, levers, break open all have a place. Like levers myself.
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Re: Norinco JW-15A

Post by Title_II » 02 Feb 2017, 4:26 am

Buddy77 wrote:I just came back from 7 weeks the the US and the prices for bolt actions and 39A's will make you cry, there must be some kind of firearms import tax as with difference in the Australian dollar they are still very cheap.


You mates get screwed every which way :( Remember when I posted our prices on Aussy ammo? Somebody, somewhere is laughing all the way to the bank. I don't buy their rap.

But I still want a Norinco. They cost a fortune here because we can't import them since the 90s. Thanks Clinton!
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