happyhunter wrote:Ammo for the 7.62x39 is available in bulk and really cheap. A big plus for that rifle.
bentaz wrote:Buy a ruger ranch in 300bk
Gwion wrote:Isn't the 300blk just a 30cal bullet in a 223rem case???
Look up case specs and the internal mag length of the Howa Mini in 223. I'd imagine it's just a straight rebarrelling job as long as the mag is long enough to house the longest round you want to load.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/.300_AAC_Blackout
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/.223_Remington
Edit: same COAL for both rounds so the 223 mag should be fine.
Rebarrel to a 308cal barrel and have it chambered in 300blk. Depending on barrel cost, should be between $500-800 to do the conversion. My smith is quick, good and affordable. Cost me about $350 to have action trued, barrel chambered and fitted. Not including barrel cost. Usually does work for me within the week he receives my rifle. He accepts postal deliveries so if your keen to do it i can give you his details. He has rebarrelled two rifles for me and both shoot consistent sub 0.5MOA with properly tuned loads. He has also done various other small jobs for me with great results.
in2anity wrote:Here you go straight from the horse's mouth:
(for Howa rifles)
7.62 x 39:
land to land = 0.308"
groove to groove = 0.312"
308 win:
land to land = 0.300"
groove to groove = 0.308"
What does this mean? In short you are ok to use .30cal projectiles with the only variance you’ll get will be velocity. No guarantee when it comes accuracy however.
in2anity wrote:Agreed. If only Howa offered 300blk... I just like the idea of a smaller case matching reduced loads (which I predominantly shoot); I'm not a big fan of case filler.
bladeracer wrote:in2anity wrote:Agreed. If only Howa offered 300blk... I just like the idea of a smaller case matching reduced loads (which I predominantly shoot); I'm not a big fan of case filler.
I'm a huge fan of reduced loads myself, loading every caliber subsonic, including 7.62x54R and 8x57mm - without any fillers. You don't need small case capacity to shoot reduced loads.
in2anity wrote:Yeah and I don't currently used fillers with my 30/30, and they shoot lead fine with a half-case of mid burn like 2207 or 2206H. But if i push lead too fast particularly over 2206, I start to get a few semi-burnt granules popping out. Now I know this can be to do with crimp-weight, but a bit of research and reading this particular article: http://www.reloadammo.com/rel-location.htm and also http://www.reloadammo.com/liteload.htm made me question whether it's really a good idea to have empty space. In theory you could get some slight inconsistencies depending on how the powder is stacked inside the case. That's why Trail Boss sounds good in theory - due it's much lower density.
bladeracer wrote:in2anity wrote:Yeah and I don't currently used fillers with my 30/30, and they shoot lead fine with a half-case of mid burn like 2207 or 2206H. But if i push lead too fast particularly over 2206, I start to get a few semi-burnt granules popping out. Now I know this can be to do with crimp-weight, but a bit of research and reading this particular article: http://www.reloadammo.com/rel-location.htm and also http://www.reloadammo.com/liteload.htm made me question whether it's really a good idea to have empty space. In theory you could get some slight inconsistencies depending on how the powder is stacked inside the case. That's why Trail Boss sounds good in theory - due it's much lower density.
Fastest I've pushed lead is 2570fps out of the 8x57mm - way too fast for lead.
I never crimp, although I think I'll have to in the Carcano as the bullets tend to come loose in the mag.
Trailboss isn't just good in theory, it's awesome in practise too
Saves you money as well. If you're shooting light loads TB loads will be close to half of what you need of the standard powders for similar velocities. I use 30gn of AR2206H for 4400fps in the 204 and 8.5gn of TB for 2400fps. I need 15.8gn of AR2206H to get it down to 2400fps.
in2anity wrote:Yeah I'm not a huge fan of TB - sure it's economical as hell, but it's dirty, and genuinely not as accurate as the traditional mid-burns (at least in my Marlin). I want to love it, but if you look at the data, it's just does not group like the traditional powders. Hence why I question the significance of a half-empty case - despite reading about the negatives, I've none of my own data to prove that it's truly a bad thing. Hence why I really have no argument against a Howa 308w vs the 7.62x39.
bladeracer wrote:in2anity wrote:Yeah I'm not a huge fan of TB - sure it's economical as hell, but it's dirty, and genuinely not as accurate as the traditional mid-burns (at least in my Marlin). I want to love it, but if you look at the data, it's just does not group like the traditional powders. Hence why I question the significance of a half-empty case - despite reading about the negatives, I've none of my own data to prove that it's truly a bad thing. Hence why I really have no argument against a Howa 308w vs the 7.62x39.
I haven't noticed it being dirty or inaccurate, and I shoot it in everything I own.
Any reduced load tends to leave some soot around the case neck, but that's due to the lower pressure, not the powder.
in2anity wrote:Do you always use it with jacketed projectiles? Have you tried it with lead?
bladeracer wrote:I'd love to see some real-world experience of 7.62x39mm against .308 reduced loads.
Homer's groups aren't bad for 7.62x39mm so it seems to be capable of some degree of accuracy, at least from a non-military bolt-gun.
But can it compete head to head with a .308 loaded to similar ballistics?
The '39 shoots 0.312" 150gn bullets at around 2150fps, so you'd only be reducing the .308 loads by about 600fps or so.
ADI lists a Trailboss load for the .308 at 1400fps.
I'm still inclined toward .308 reduced loads as the better choice, even if you only shoot it at '39 levels, and especially if you want to shoot much further than a couple hundred meters.
in2anity wrote:Yep I'm hearing you - perhaps if I had a walk-in safe and a bottomless pit of cash, I might consider something unique like the 7.62x39 or the 300blk, but that's not the case (mortgage/kids), so it's looking I'd have to go with the 308winnie all-rounder for now. In any case, the Howas definitely have my attention!
bladeracer wrote:I'm hoping my next Ruger American will be the 450 Bushmaster
in2anity wrote:Here you go straight from the horse's mouth:
(for Howa rifles)
7.62 x 39:
land to land = 0.308"
groove to groove = 0.312"
308 win:
land to land = 0.300"
groove to groove = 0.308"
What does this mean? In short you are ok to use .30cal projectiles with the only variance you’ll get will be velocity. No guarantee when it comes accuracy however.
Homer wrote:in2anity wrote:Here you go straight from the horse's mouth:
(for Howa rifles)
7.62 x 39:
land to land = 0.308"
groove to groove = 0.312"
308 win:
land to land = 0.300"
groove to groove = 0.308"
What does this mean? In short you are ok to use .30cal projectiles with the only variance you’ll get will be velocity. No guarantee when it comes accuracy however.
G'Day Fella's,
If some of you had read the very first post of mine on this thread (the one with the link to the Nosler forum), you would have seen that this Howa Mini's, Bore and Groove dimensions.
They are as follows;
Bore Diameter= 0.300"
Groove Diameter= 0.310"
Twist rate= 1 in 9 1/2" (approximate).
Doh!
Homer
Homer wrote:G'Day Fella's,
If some of you had read the very first post of mine on this thread (the one with the link to the Nosler forum), you would have seen that this Howa Mini's, Bore and Groove dimensions.
They are as follows;
Bore Diameter= 0.300"
Groove Diameter= 0.310"
Twist rate= 1 in 9 1/2" (approximate).
Doh!
Homer
Homer wrote:G'Day Fella's,
Yes I did In2anity and apart from around 100fps drop in velocity with the Speer 130grn HP, accuracy at 110 meters, was great!
I was able to put 5 shots into 21mm at 110meters, with three of these shots, almost thru the same hole.
Doh!
Homer
in2anity wrote:
And the 30/30 and 170gr.30cal projectiles, did they group? Thanks.