CZ and Custom Chassis to suit SA mauser

[Gwion]

Hehe...

Well, get in contact with Wombat. I'm sure a custom chassis is well and truly doable but the cost might make you think twice.
Also, depending on your twist rate and what length bullets you want to shoot, you may find the mini-Mauser limiting to get the most from your rifle. I have a Zastava mini Mauser and a slightly long throat on my chamber; I find loading out to the lands is beyond what feeds well from the magazine.

[bladeracer]

The 527 'mini-mauser' is for 223, hornets and the 204. The 308 family live in a bigger action.

Is this a chassis you are looking for for a action you currently own or one you are looking to buy?

Thanks Gwion, I'd figured the "mini" mean't more compact. It never occurred to me anybody would have built an action even shorter than the Short Action

[bladeracer]

Well that's what i was originally thinking as there is a lot written about feed limitations in the breech on the CZ SA (COAL)...it appeared to me that it was different to most push-feed actions where 'size' is concerned...thanks for verifying.

*[EDIT]...Per CZ USA..."Whether you’re after varmints, medium game or just like to punch holes in paper, our micro-Mauser 527 can do the job. Built on a .223-length action, the tiniest of our centerfire platforms is also one of the most beloved by CZ fans. Chambered in a number of cartridges from .17 Hornet and .204 Ruger up to 6.5 Grendel and 7.62×39, it’ll take everything from small game to deer'

I'm looking for a chassis suitable in fit for a 'donor' rifle/action i'm yet to purchase, but bare actions (little work) are thin on the ground.

I need to find a new home for a [NIB] .300RUM first, that i bought for a project that i have decided against, before i start this one...

Thanks for responding.

Cheers

You're welcome to have a look at my Ruger Americans in their MDT LSS chassis - currently the .243 and 7mm-08 as I've put the .204 into the bullpup. I also have my Ruger American Rimfire Compact in an MDT LSS-22 chassis. And I also have two more centrefires and a rimfire chassis empty just now.

I wouldn't think you'd save much by buying just a barreled action over a complete rifle, and it doesn't hurt to have the original stock on hand for emergencies.

Coincidentally, my local dealer received a .300RUM on Friday sent down from Queensland.

[PoorShot300]

Hehe...
Well, get in contact with Wombat.
I have now done so (email), and had thought to use him in the past for my .300RUM project, but it wasn't easy for those of us who don't do FB...sheesh.

I'm sure a custom chassis is well and truly doable but the cost might make you think twice.
This is becoming my reasoning, but a bloke wants what a bloke wants...
Shouldn't be a problem to get a Boyd's and check the layout for machining?? An off the rack can be as much as a few grand as well, so $$$ (to a degree) is a bit of a straw-man in this case...without checking out my options, i may be able to do it cheaper than i think as well.

Also, depending on your twist rate and what length bullets you want to shoot, you may find the mini-Mauser limiting to get the most from your rifle. I have a Zastava mini Mauser and a slightly long throat on my chamber; I find loading out to the lands is beyond what feeds well from the magazine.

I.m looking to put a custom design Kreiger on it with a 1:7.7 or 1:7 for the heavier pills....preferred for 5-600m energy/accuracy loaded with home rolled recipes for that 'sweet' load.
It seems that, even though the CZ can handle the 5.56 ammo, it's not as accurate as some EU ammo, or roll your own, due to the 'jump' required and tolerance differences...trial & miss to get the 'right' load. Not that this will be an issue as they use lighter pills than i'm going for, but for the northerners that may come here, it's info. perhaps unknown.

Cheers

[PoorShot300]

You're welcome to have a look at my Ruger Americans in their MDT LSS chassis - currently the .243 and 7mm-08 as I've put the .204 into the bullpup. I also have my Ruger American Rimfire Compact in an MDT LSS-22 chassis. And I also have two more centrefires and a rimfire chassis empty just now.
Thank-you for that generous offer, though i rarely get to the Big Smoke or Sth/E/W thereof either...too much fun in the bush (Nth Cen Vic or the GT as it's also known)

I wouldn't think you'd save much by buying just a barreled action over a complete rifle, and it doesn't hurt to have the original stock on hand for emergencies.
I tend to agree, and my searches have revealed only one barreled action/bare action....I am leaning towards finding a 2014 Varmint Thumbhole (1st in 1:9) and just replacing the bbl initially after having some plinking fun with it. That way, i have an OEM Boyds stock to get the measurements from, and perhaps use that info. for a chassis base at a later time. (Projects for me can last over a cpl yrs so URGENCY is not at play here....just fyi )

Coincidentally, my local dealer received a .300RUM on Friday sent down from Queensland.

Lovely (just my luck),...ask him if he needs a pretty sister with her own food to match it lmao...

Cheers

[Gwion]

Hey, if cash isn't too much of an issue then go for your life and get what you want but with a 1:7 to shoot 80-90gn bullets I really think the mini-Mauser is going to be counter productive for your end goal. Sure, you will be able to single feed it but you won't get the most out of mag fed rounds. In fact, in instances where you want to go the long pills I think a 223 built on a standard short action is probably the way to go. A CZ 527 is, what: about $1500??? Then you have re-barrelling costs of about $6-800. For about that you can get a Montana short action which is based on the Win M70, a CRF action in a Rem 700 form factor. Then your choice of chassis will expand considerably and you'll have one sweet sweet rifle.

Just ideas to toss around.

[bladeracer]

Hey, if cash isn't too much of an issue then go for your life and get what you want but with a 1:7 to shoot 80-90gn bullets I really think the mini-Mauser is going to be counter productive for your end goal. Sure, you will be able to single feed it but you won't get the most out of mag fed rounds. In fact, in instances where you want to go the long pills I think a 223 built on a standard short action is probably the way to go. A CZ 527 is, what: about $1500??? Then you have re-barrelling costs of about $6-800. For about that you can get a Montana short action which is based on the Win M70, a CRF action in a Rem 700 form factor. Then your choice of chassis will expand considerably and you'll have one sweet sweet rifle.

Just ideas to toss around.

I think the 7" twist is also likely to rule out using the lighter bullets too unless you give up significant velocity.
I would agree with the Remington 700 base, the vast majority of chassis inevitably cater for the 700 receiver.

[Gwion]

Bugger..... Montana don't seem to do a 223 boltface.

[Gwion]

I think the 7" twist is also likely to rule out using the lighter bullets too unless you give up significant velocity.
I would agree with the Remington 700 base, the vast majority of chassis inevitably cater for the 700 receiver.

[/quote]

True. A 1:7 twist rate will limit you to heavier rounds as much as a 1:12 will limit you to lighter ones.

[PoorShot300]

Hey, if cash isn't too much of an issue then go for your life and get what you want but with a 1:7 to shoot 80-90gn bullets I really think the mini-Mauser is going to be counter productive for your end goal. Sure, you will be able to single feed it but you won't get the most out of mag fed rounds. In fact, in instances where you want to go the long pills I think a 223 built on a standard short action is probably the way to go. A CZ 527 is, what: about $1500??? Then you have re-barrelling costs of about $6-800. For about that you can get a Montana short action which is based on the Win M70, a CRF action in a Rem 700 form factor. Then your choice of chassis will expand considerably and you'll have one sweet sweet rifle.

Just ideas to toss around.

And it is appreciated as well Gwion (and others contributing)...fresh eyes (and more informed) add value to the assessment, and like many, YES, $$$ is an issue, that's why it takes me a cpl yrs bhahahah.

Regarding Montana....i hear what your saying (using 'New' buy prices, and why i'm leaning to a used 2014 model) but i am cautious where they are concerned. CZ contracted them to make a 'cast' SS mini action in 2003 for the CZ Model3...it was a Mauser based action and utilized the Win70 style 3pos safety and a three lug bolt(iirc).....it wasn't well received, and the 'finish' left much to be desired by many.

Now, i do concede there was a conflict from the beginning, and in the end, the 'marriage' didn't end well, and Montana does have it's own good reputation,...but that is a different issue.

I understand the throat/lands issue, and as a result i am basically sitting on the 1:7.7 and using the 79-82g projy's...the rifle will let me know what it likes best, lighter or heavier than anticipated, and i am also not a 'velocity' chaser, just what works best balanced in 'my' platform...(if it hits what i'm aiming at, I'm happy, the chrono could read 100fps for all my ignorance....)

I'm also a responsible hunter suiting range/ammo/target for humane hit, but this will mostly be for paper ~90%...most my 'varminting' will be with my Levers, .22 for the littluns, and the .30.30 up to goat/pigs...i don't stalk, or Deer hunt, much as i am open to try some time on the horizon...the CZ is for another side of the sport, as much as there may be better, i'm liking this little set-up for it's 'differences'...

[bladeracer]

I.m looking to put a custom design Kreiger on it with a 1:7.7 or 1:7 for the heavier pills....preferred for 5-600m energy/accuracy loaded with home rolled recipes for that 'sweet' load.
It seems that, even though the CZ can handle the 5.56 ammo, it's not as accurate as some EU ammo, or roll your own, due to the 'jump' required and tolerance differences...trial & miss to get the 'right' load. Not that this will be an issue as they use lighter pills than i'm going for, but for the northerners that may come here, it's info. perhaps unknown.

Cheers

.223 has been shooting F-Class out to 1000yds for a long while now and I don't think most of them are using the 90gn bullets yet. I would go 8" and stay with 80gn or less. I think the tighter rates tend to chew up the lighter varmint bullets if you push them too hard.

I really can't see any benefit at all to a 5.56mm chamber.

[PoorShot300]

.223 has been shooting F-Class out to 1000yds for a long while now and I don't think most of them are using the 90gn bullets yet. I would go 8" and stay with 80gn or less. I think the tighter rates tend to chew up the lighter varmint bullets if you push them too hard.
I was drawn to this project from reading LR shooting forums and a shooter stretching his .223 out to a mile, and iirc his results gel with your assessment, though this was an older article perhaps before the 90's were available?....I originally was looking at the 1:8 (then saw the 7.7 & 7 twists on Kreigers site....i tend to lean to over compensation hence the change) but some 90's do better with that higher twist. I may re-evaluate that choice based on your feedback and from further 'ammo' test reading. CZ only do a 1:9 so am limited to high 70's, low 80's at best,..where 'stability' is concerned.

I really can't see any benefit at all to a 5.56mm chamber.

Fair call, i gain comfort in the higher CIP chamber rating...i hope it may never be an issue.
It was the plethora of choice that led me to the 700 for my .300 build...i just like having that little something 'uglifferent'...

[bladeracer]

Fair call, i gain comfort in the higher CIP chamber rating...i hope it may never be an issue.

If you're loading so hot that it would matter, I would expect your brass is probably coming apart with every shot anyway

[PoorShot300]

Fair call, i gain comfort in the higher CIP chamber rating...i hope it may never be an issue.

If you're loading so hot that it would matter, I would expect your brass is probably coming apart with every shot anyway

For the loads, i don't think there's enough case capacity either lol... i'm of the ...'better to have and not need'.. family of thinking...
It really is irrelevant in the scheme of things i agree, just my reading on mini actions puts CZ above, or at minimum equal to, most available,...being EU built rather than US, or Aus built, that was just an added, albeit unnecessary, bonus. I see the Wylde wildcat also promotes it's 5.56 capability, but that's likely due to use in semi auto/auto firearms...

[Gwion]

So you aren't wanting to mag feed 80gn bullets?

[PoorShot300]

So you aren't wanting to mag feed 80gn bullets?

The CZ 527 does come with a 5x shot mag, and there is a mag block also available for single feed. As this will likely do most service off a rest, i don't see that as an issue.

I have read of 80g being box fed on the US site, it can be done if your happy to sacrifice velocity, and a tweak on the feed ramp from what i read...?

[Gwion]

Seems counter productive to go a fast twist for long bullets and then not be able to push them fast enough to take advantage of them at longer ranges. But you know, it's your time, money and rifle.

Is the controlled feed a main reason why you want the 527?

[PoorShot300]

Seems counter productive to go a fast twist for long bullets and then not be able to push them fast enough to take advantage of them at longer ranges. But you know, it's your time, money and rifle.

I understand that, and as noted, my initial interest was in the 1:8 twist and 82g...or 'there-abouts'...the rifle will choose what it likes...if that's not maximum, i can work with what it likes best, or will 'limit' me to loading...it is what it is, and i will be happy with any limits it presents.

Is the controlled feed a main reason why you want the 527?

Essentially...and as I can't afford to 'comfortably' feed >.22 cal, a full size sporterised 98 is out of the question, and the 527 fits the bill....

Id have an M03 in a heartbeat, but that will remain my 'Lotto' rifle....

[PoorShot300]

It appears XLR at least cater to the CZ per;.. https://forum.snipershide.com/forum/sni ... for-cz-550

Admittedly, it is for the LA's but it's a glimmer...

Otherwise i may have to do the same as the last post in this... https://forum.snipershide.com/forum/sni ... cs-223-mag

More research underway.

Cheers

[Gwion]

You will be fine to single feed for target and load to any length you like. Maybe you can get your smith to enlarge the feed port to accomodate AI max mag length. Only concern is if that will compromise the rigidity of the action but it shouldn't require too much material removal.

Still, I'd email Montana and see what the cost on a 223 bolt face would be.

[PoorShot300]

You will be fine to single feed for target and load to any length you like. Maybe you can get your smith to enlarge the feed port to accomodate AI max mag length. Only concern is if that will compromise the rigidity of the action but it shouldn't require too much material removal.

Still, I'd email Montana and see what the cost on a 223 bolt face would be.

All just early days yet... i will look about more at platforms, just thought i might have got more recommendations from 'builders' who have been through the process (CZ or otherwise)....as mentioned, it's looking like it will be on the Boyd's stock to begin with and take it from there...

Thanks for presenting some thoughtful, and thought provoking, points of view and suggestions...

Gypsy

[Gwion]

No worries. I also have s build on hold using th mini-Mauser (though mine is the Zastava version) so it peaked my interest. Good luck with it!

[PoorShot300]

No worries. I also have s build on hold using th mini-Mauser (though mine is the Zastava version) so it peaked my interest. Good luck with it!

Thanks Gwion,... the Z's were on the initial list of contenders as well;;;

What sort of build are you doing?,..and do the Z's have the same issues as the CZ where 'feeding' is concerned? (i imagine so...)

I look forward to reading your experience & journey with it.

Cheers

[Gwion]

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=4297
All details of my build are in that linkedthread. Cash and supplier issues have the project stalled for the last while.

The Zastava is rather rough build and the internal mag is very short.

[PoorShot300]

https://enoughgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=4297
All details of my build are in that linkedthread. Cash and supplier issues have the project stalled for the last while.

The Zastava is rather rough build and the internal mag is very short.

Would i be correct in that some have built custom rigs off Z's and use AI mags?

I will have a read of your thread...thanks.

[Gwion]

I couldn't answer that question. I think there would be quite a bit of mucking around to make AI mags work on such a short action in as far as setting up a chassis system. Would definitely be a custom job and probably expensive due to stuff around tax. I was looking at a detachable mag option but the project has dragged on so long I'd have to do some real digging to find the suggested platform but that also required some skilled customising.


I chose the mini Mauser because it is the shortest action available for a repeater and others who have built 223 shorts have had issues feeding from ordinary short action platforms and Tikkas, etc.. If I was going your path I would definitely take the easier road of a standardised action to drop into a chassis and have a mag system that just works without the screw around factor. Would be interested to know if Montana would do a custom 223rem bolt face for you.

[PoorShot300]

I had actually read yours before i started mine...

One ?.... i see you just bought the bare action yes?,.. how did you go about that (without going through the whole thread if you mention it) and did you get it local?

I might get in touch with Winchester (CZ Importers) and see if i can just get an action that way...

Sorry yours has taken so long, you must be really frustrated with it all by now?...

I may have been confused/incorrect about the Z and AI mags... it does sound like a lot of jigging about.

Cheers

[PoorShot300]

Bladeracer,... just regarding the LSS chassis, do you find the width of the fore-end wide enough for 'bag' work off a bench, or are they better off the pod?

With Thanks

[Gwion]

Zastava sell the action alone. Couldn't tell you if CZ do the same thing or not but easy to ask the importers.

I'm kind'a resigned to this taking quite some time because my cash flow is spread pretty thin across a lot of more important projects.

[PoorShot300]

I hear you Gwion, i have other hobbies and they all get in the way of each other for my hobby funds...

This is looking encouraging... http://masterpiecearms.com/shop/mpa-ba- ... uth-model/

Maybe a pretty Orange or Red one will help me skip a bullet in the eyes of the 'big black gun brigade'...