Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

[sakoBC]

It may be worth checking that all rounds are sitting as far back in the mag well as possible.

One of my Howa 243s that I have had for ten years gave me to two jams in succession on a recent hunt. Never had a problem before.
On both occasions I got the first shot off and the follow up shot that came with a quick bolt cycle ended up with two cartridges trying to head into the chamber.

On the first occasion I was too focused on clearing the jam as a few more pigs were on offer. After the second jam I stopped to have a look at what was happening. It appeared that the round under the round that was being cycled had edged forward in the mag enough to angle up and interfere with the round being cycled.
I emptied the internal mag and reloaded making sure that all rounds were uniformly pushed right to the back of the mag well. Haven’t had a problem since.

If the bolt is slightly forward when loading, or if loading with cold numb fingers you may not have a uniform stack with all rounds pushed back against the rear of the mag well.

Definitely no need to slam feed a Howa.

[FlyingStick]

It may be worth checking that all rounds are sitting as far back in the mag well as possible.

One of my Howa 243s that I have had for ten years gave me to two jams in succession on a recent hunt. Never had a problem before.
On both occasions I got the first shot off and the follow up shot that came with a quick bolt cycle ended up with two cartridges trying to head into the chamber.

On the first occasion I was too focused on clearing the jam as a few more pigs were on offer. After the second jam I stopped to have a look at what was happening. It appeared that the round under the round that was being cycled had edged forward in the mag enough to angle up and interfere with the round being cycled.
I emptied the internal mag and reloaded making sure that all rounds were uniformly pushed right to the back of the mag well. Haven’t had a problem since.

If the bolt is slightly forward when loading, or if loading with cold numb fingers you may not have a uniform stack with all rounds pushed back against the rear of the mag well.

Definitely no need to slam feed a Howa.

Originally - I was also having the double feed issue also. Torquing up the bottom metal (as they were extremely lose) fixed this, however left me with the current issue.

I have experimented with the positioning of the rounds while loading. Regardless of where it is placed, same problem.

[PoorShot300]

Originally - I was also having the double feed issue also. Torquing up the bottom metal (as they were extremely lose) fixed this, however left me with the current issue.

I have experimented with the positioning of the rounds while loading. Regardless of where it is placed, same problem.

Ahhhha!!!....so you induced the issue....did you use a torque driver or just guess? What is the stock made of? Is it possible you need either MORE, or even LESS torque to solve the issue?

I'd be inclined to back off the torque again, and from a dbl feed, slowly increase torque till THAT issue is resolved, then work on the ramp feed issue....you may be just outside the sweet spot for stock/action/mag torque.

[FlyingStick]

I had torqued the screws (not overly so) before the mag was replaced. I'm now using a mag that was installed by the dealer. Although. I'm willing to play around with the torque on the screws to see what happens, however I am worried this may impact any warranty claims I may make.

[Barrettmr]

I had the same problem, and the only way I could fix it was to straighten the mag spring so that there wasn't as much upward pressure. there was a lot of trial and error involved. I didn't really have a problem until the last round that would pop out behind the bolt as it was opened, fast or slow, it didn't matter. I'm all good now.

Interestingly I didn't have the same problem with the 308 that I got last year. It could be that there was a batch of springs that were too strong?

[Oldbloke]

BS. This is not an accuracy issue. It's a faulty part or a design fault.

[superdave]

I got the aftermarket 10 rd mag for mine and found that the 9th (i think) round does give problems when slow fed.

Usually helps to cycle it fast. There seems to be something about actions in general that make them prone to having problems if worked too slowly.
Some semi's tend to jam if cycled by hand, but work well if they are let cycle fast as designed.

[FlyingStick]

I took the rifle to a friend today who is an experienced shooter. There is definitely something wrong with the rifle.

Going to need to visit the dealer on the weekend again. However I'm starting to consider buying a mag system to avoid the trouble, see how we go.

[FlyingStick]

Just an update. I've been talking with OSA via email and it seems he may (wording was a little open to interpretation) agree I have a genuine issue.

He asked me to take a couple more videos of me cycling the bolt a little faster as he think it may help him diagnose the problem.

I'll be honest - I'm still baffled by this apparent need to cycle like lightning McQueen to get one chambered.

I haven't contacted the dealer as yet - getting informed first before my next move.

I'm slowly getting turned off this rifle however...

[Gwion]

Nope. I cycle pretty steady.
At least you're getting some traction with the supplier. Sometimes, if your retailer is making life difficult, it is well worth it to just go straight to the supplier with your issue.

[FlyingStick]

Right. OSA is telling me there is no problem with the rifle, even based on the following videos. I'm getting shafted. Video 3 was one I managed to get through, the rest were as per usual with this rifle.

https://youtu.be/Nf1pzscw_4Y
https://youtu.be/hB1486vjAlQ
https://youtu.be/0q47s67aR_Q

I'm being told to go back to the vendor now.

[Oldbloke]

You are entitled to have it repaired, no question in my mind. Sounds like the LGS fobbed you off. OSA too.
Go back to where you bought, pick a busy time and complain about it in front of other customers. Don't argue but speak up. Speak your mind. Mention consumer law. Might get a better result.

Or if you know someone with an identical rifle dissemble both side by side and see what is different. Might spot the problem, could be a simple fix.

I hate bussineses that refuse to stand by their product.. Its like selling you a bucket with a hole in it. If they did that to me I would go elsewhere in future and bag the s**t out of them at every opportunity. Sell you a $700 item worth $250, next to useless like it is.

[Oldbloke]

I got the aftermarket 10 rd mag for mine and found that the 9th (i think) round does give problems when slow fed.

Usually helps to cycle it fast. There seems to be something about actions in general that make them prone to having problems if worked too slowly.
Some semi's tend to jam if cycled by hand, but work well if they are let cycle fast as designed.

BS. All my bolt actions and all I have owned feed at any speed, as they should. If they don't it's faulty.

[Gwion]

That is just not right. So it feeds ok 33.33% of the time, based on those 3 videos. No good.

Take it back and demand a refund or replacement as not fit for function or purpose.

[Gwion]

Just to add: this is very disappointing and is a blight on Howa's good reputation.

Email Howa direct with those videos.

[Oldbloke]

That is just not right. So it feeds ok 33.33% of the time, based on those 3 videos. No good.

Take it back and demand a refund or replacement as not fit for function or purpose.

I agree.

[Oldbloke]

Just to add: this is very disappointing and is a blight on Howa's good reputation.

Email Howa direct with those videos.

I agree again.

[bigfellascott]

How does it go with live rounds not empty cases?

[FlyingStick]

They are live. I've taken out the firing pin to be safe.

I'm 100% conviced it's the lips on the action. I actually tried the other bottom metal I had that was replaced, and even with the spring adjusted as to not provide much upward tension. Same problem.

Given my theory that it's the lips of the action, I'm quite confident a magazine upgrade would remedy the issue. However I feel that is simply masking the problem and I quite like the simplicity of the floor panel design.

[FlyingStick]

You are entitled to have it repaired, no question in my mind. Sounds like the LGS fobbed you off. OSA too.
Go back to where you bought, pick a busy time and complain about it in front of other customers. Don't argue but speak up. Speak your mind. Mention consumer law. Might get a better result.

Or if you know someone with an identical rifle dissemble both side by side and see what is different. Might spot the problem, could be a simple fix.

I hate bussineses that refuse to stand by their product.. Its like selling you a bucket with a hole in it. If they did that to me I would go elsewhere in future and bag the s**t out of them at every opportunity. Sell you a $700 item worth $250, next to useless like it is.

My plan is to return on the weekend and return the rifle. I'm also going to ask them to show me another Howa and prove that it suffers from the same "design flaw".

I really hate these situations. I don't want to make a fuss however at the same time I feel like I'm getting the big f$&k you... this may well be my last dealing with this joint. I actually drive past two gun shops (one is 5 mins away!) to get to this place!!!

[Oldbloke]

I would not be inclined to modify it with a magazine, would effect the warranty.

Anyway can't lose an internal magazine.

[FlyingStick]

I would not be inclined to modify it with a magazine, would effect the warranty.

Anyway can't lose an internal magazine.

They're a drop in kit. But yes. Agreed. I'd prefer the internal mag.

[Oldbloke]

After looking at the video again, you could be right. Getting fouled on the ramp as it enters the chamber.
Solution, remove sharp edges?
Again, compare with another howa.

[FlyingStick]

After looking at the video again, you could be right. Getting fouled on the ramp as it enters the chamber.
Solution, remove sharp edges?
Again, compare with another howa.

My thoughts are they've taken too much off it. So as the round travels I front of the bolt it's popping up too early where there is more tension on the ramp.

It's something on the right for sure. I can load a round from the left of the stack as slooowly as I'd like. The right. No.

[FlyingStick]

This video shows it best: https://youtu.be/YC5Z9Xv_yv4

[Oldbloke]

Just remembered. Vic consumer affairs has template letters on their web site. Perhaps send one to all 3 players.

[FlyingStick]

Just remembered. Vic consumer affairs has template letters on their web site. Perhaps send one to all 3 players.

Thanks mate, assume you are referring to: https://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/library ... mplate.doc ?

I'm going to visit the dealer, again, either tomorrow or Saturday and ask for them to return the rifle for a warranty assessment (as asked by the fellow at OSA)

That said, given I've spoken to someone at OSA already, and their assessment was "it looks ok", I don't hold much hope. I'm hoping that when they have it in their hands they will see the problem as in their defense at times it can be hard to diagnose issues via video and words (although those videos in my eyes should have been evidence enough!). Regardless - I will do the right thing and follow the process.

A great bloke from the Australian Howa facebook group was kind enough to send me a video of him slow and fast feeding his Howa without a hint of issue, I plan on using this at the shop although I'm predicting they will come up with some other excuse. He even offered to come in and make a fuss with me (which for now I will not accept), sometimes you just get lucky and meet legendary people!

Let's see how we go. I'm still baffled lol, I had just assumed one look at that video or the rifle in person would have been evidence enough...wrong! I've been nothing but polite and calm in all my dealings with everyone, to which I think they are also taking advantage of.

All else fails, I will write the letter and send away, just annoys me that I need to waste all this time and energy.

Wish me luck guys! Was meant to get out next week and try and get my first fox, can't see that happening!

Cheers!

[superdave]

I got the aftermarket 10 rd mag for mine and found that the 9th (i think) round does give problems when slow fed.

Usually helps to cycle it fast. There seems to be something about actions in general that make them prone to having problems if worked too slowly.
Some semi's tend to jam if cycled by hand, but work well if they are let cycle fast as designed.

BS. All my bolt actions and all I have owned feed at any speed, as they should. If they don't it's faulty.

I will say that to feed at any speed is the way it should be.

I have however found on occasion that bullets jump very slightly/ pitch up out of the magazine when slow fed, resulting in a misfeed.

Feeding a bolt action fast is to work around a problem, not to solve it.

[Oldbloke]

All my bolt actions and all I have owned feed at any speed, as they should. Sould be 100% If they don't it's faulty.

[POD89]

my howa .223 has the same issue.
i removed my internal mag and replaced with the 10 shot detachable.
but i ended up returning to the original due to preference.
for the life of me i can not get it to load from the internal magazine.
But i can nearly guarantee it is user error. i must of put it in wrong... or am loading it wrong??
I have a stock sock that holds about 6 rounds
i load 1 at a time as i need now.
i kind of like it though.