Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

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Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 8:58 pm

Hi All,

Just a quick one. In summary, I've had a few feed issues with my 2 month old 223 Howa 1500 (internal 5 round mag). The first couple rounds that are stacked on the right hand side of the mag are flicking up at the rear and jamming between the bolt and chamber. The dealer has swapped the internal mag out but the problem still exists (in starting to think it has something to do with the lips of the action and the round is bouncing out too early).

I am now being told that I am not cycling fast enough as it is a double stacked internal mag system (and because it's a push feed system), so I need to slam them in (and consequently have every animal in the area aware of my presence).

In short - am I being bs'd?
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by bladeracer » 06 May 2017, 9:02 pm

FlyingStick wrote:Hi All,

Just a quick one. In summary, I've had a few feed issues with my 2 month old 223 Howa 1500 (internal 5 round mag). The first couple rounds that are stacked on the right hand side of the mag are flicking up at the rear and jamming between the bolt and chamber. The dealer has swapped the internal mag out but the problem still exists (in starting to think it has something to do with the lips of the action and the round is bouncing out too early).

I am now being told that I am not cycling fast enough as it is a double stacked internal mag system, so I need to slam them in (and consequently have every animal in the area aware of my presence).

In short - am I being bs'd?



Sounds like rubbish to me.
Have you asked around any Howa-specific forums, or even Howa directly?
Have you tried different ammunition?
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by AusTac » 06 May 2017, 9:08 pm

No need to slam, but i've found some projectiles short/long different COAL etc need more force than others to hit the feed ramp at the right angles and get ramped into the chamber, my howa was a bit " agricultural " in regards to some of its machining/stamping which didn't help, can you see any burrs in the action or even odd things on the cartridges? Had chips of hornady's manufacturing machinery on my rounds before which hindered chambering once
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by pete1 » 06 May 2017, 9:17 pm

Are there any burrs on the internal magazine making it jam?

Is it when you have a full magazine or partly full or always?
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 9:21 pm

I've posted on a Howa Facebook group and it seemed to ring false, a few others were able to confirm slow feeding theirs wasn't an issue.

I have tried 4 different brands of rounds, Federal, OSA, PPU and Hornady. Same same. Has been cleaned. Same same.

The mag has been completely swapped out (I have the old one, so if this I can be sure). No change.

Should I be able to feed it via a slow bolt push? Or am I trying to do something that can't/shouldn't be done.

And it mostly happens on a fail mag/ when the mag spring is tensioned. It's all good with the last few rounds. Also - as I said, it's ALWAYS the right hand side round that does it regardless of a full or half full mag.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 9:33 pm

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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by Gwion » 06 May 2017, 9:38 pm

You are being fed a line. The internal mag itself will not make any difference as the feed assembly is part of the action. I don't recall ever having these issues with mine but I do recall rounds jamming on each other while loading the mag and had to pay close attention to the process. I ended up installing a detachable mag.
Try sending an email direct to importers or manufacturers. Tolerances may be out if rounds are popping out.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by pomemax » 06 May 2017, 9:39 pm

I ended up installing a detachable mag.243 fixed
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 9:42 pm

pomemax wrote:I ended up installing a detachable mag.243 fixed


Same issue?
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 9:45 pm

Gwion wrote:You are being fed a line. The internal mag itself will not make any difference as the feed assembly is part of the action. I don't recall ever having these issues with mine but I do recall rounds jamming on each other while loading the mag and had to pay close attention to the process. I ended up installing a detachable mag.
Try sending an email direct to importers or manufacturers. Tolerances may be out if rounds are popping out.


I've sent an email to OSA as I think they are the distributors in Oz. See how it goes.

I had a feeling they were playing. They're pushing me away grrr
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by pete1 » 06 May 2017, 9:49 pm

So does yours have a up rite plate that slots in the magazine or is it like the one in the image?

14393204.jpg
14393204.jpg (39.98 KiB) Viewed 9810 times


Mine has up rite plate, but older howa and know if its not in corect it wont work.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 9:57 pm

pete1 wrote:So does yours have a up rite plate that slots in the magazine or is it like the one in the image?

14393204.jpg


Mine has up rite plate, but older howa and know if its not in corect it wont work.


That one in the image (which was also replaced).
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by AusTac » 06 May 2017, 9:57 pm

Never seen that before, i think you've done the right thing by contacting OSA..
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by pomemax » 06 May 2017, 10:13 pm

Like image had to look in safe
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 10:17 pm

pomemax wrote:Like image had to look in safe


Were you having the same issue as i was pomemax? And a detachable mag fixed it?
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by pomemax » 06 May 2017, 10:40 pm

Yep all good now but I bought a 10 shot mag don,t get a five looks wrong too long with a ten .
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by Gwion » 06 May 2017, 10:44 pm

I've got a spare AI 10 shot mag for 223 that I don't need.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 06 May 2017, 10:54 pm

Hmm. Depending on how the next few discussions go I might just end up going with the mag system. As much as it annoys me that there is an underlying issue, I just want to enjoy the damned thing. If i go this way I will send you a msg Gwion!
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by sakoBC » 07 May 2017, 8:32 am

It may be worth checking that all rounds are sitting as far back in the mag well as possible.

One of my Howa 243s that I have had for ten years gave me to two jams in succession on a recent hunt. Never had a problem before.
On both occasions I got the first shot off and the follow up shot that came with a quick bolt cycle ended up with two cartridges trying to head into the chamber.

On the first occasion I was too focused on clearing the jam as a few more pigs were on offer. After the second jam I stopped to have a look at what was happening. It appeared that the round under the round that was being cycled had edged forward in the mag enough to angle up and interfere with the round being cycled.
I emptied the internal mag and reloaded making sure that all rounds were uniformly pushed right to the back of the mag well. Haven’t had a problem since.

If the bolt is slightly forward when loading, or if loading with cold numb fingers you may not have a uniform stack with all rounds pushed back against the rear of the mag well.

Definitely no need to slam feed a Howa.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 07 May 2017, 9:28 am

sakoBC wrote:It may be worth checking that all rounds are sitting as far back in the mag well as possible.

One of my Howa 243s that I have had for ten years gave me to two jams in succession on a recent hunt. Never had a problem before.
On both occasions I got the first shot off and the follow up shot that came with a quick bolt cycle ended up with two cartridges trying to head into the chamber.

On the first occasion I was too focused on clearing the jam as a few more pigs were on offer. After the second jam I stopped to have a look at what was happening. It appeared that the round under the round that was being cycled had edged forward in the mag enough to angle up and interfere with the round being cycled.
I emptied the internal mag and reloaded making sure that all rounds were uniformly pushed right to the back of the mag well. Haven’t had a problem since.

If the bolt is slightly forward when loading, or if loading with cold numb fingers you may not have a uniform stack with all rounds pushed back against the rear of the mag well.

Definitely no need to slam feed a Howa.


Originally - I was also having the double feed issue also. Torquing up the bottom metal (as they were extremely lose) fixed this, however left me with the current issue.

I have experimented with the positioning of the rounds while loading. Regardless of where it is placed, same problem.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by PoorShot300 » 07 May 2017, 11:25 am

FlyingStick wrote:Originally - I was also having the double feed issue also. Torquing up the bottom metal (as they were extremely lose) fixed this, however left me with the current issue.

I have experimented with the positioning of the rounds while loading. Regardless of where it is placed, same problem.

Ahhhha!!!....so you induced the issue....did you use a torque driver or just guess? What is the stock made of? Is it possible you need either MORE, or even LESS torque to solve the issue?

I'd be inclined to back off the torque again, and from a dbl feed, slowly increase torque till THAT issue is resolved, then work on the ramp feed issue....you may be just outside the sweet spot for stock/action/mag torque.

:unknown:
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 07 May 2017, 11:43 am

I had torqued the screws (not overly so) before the mag was replaced. I'm now using a mag that was installed by the dealer. Although. I'm willing to play around with the torque on the screws to see what happens, however I am worried this may impact any warranty claims I may make.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by Barrettmr » 07 May 2017, 12:18 pm

I had the same problem, and the only way I could fix it was to straighten the mag spring so that there wasn't as much upward pressure. there was a lot of trial and error involved. I didn't really have a problem until the last round that would pop out behind the bolt as it was opened, fast or slow, it didn't matter. I'm all good now.

Interestingly I didn't have the same problem with the 308 that I got last year. It could be that there was a batch of springs that were too strong?
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by Oldbloke » 07 May 2017, 12:24 pm

BS. This is not an accuracy issue. It's a faulty part or a design fault.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by superdave » 07 May 2017, 1:07 pm

I got the aftermarket 10 rd mag for mine and found that the 9th (i think) round does give problems when slow fed.

Usually helps to cycle it fast. There seems to be something about actions in general that make them prone to having problems if worked too slowly.
Some semi's tend to jam if cycled by hand, but work well if they are let cycle fast as designed.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 07 May 2017, 5:11 pm

I took the rifle to a friend today who is an experienced shooter. There is definitely something wrong with the rifle.

Going to need to visit the dealer on the weekend again. However I'm starting to consider buying a mag system to avoid the trouble, see how we go.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 08 May 2017, 6:19 pm

Just an update. I've been talking with OSA via email and it seems he may (wording was a little open to interpretation) agree I have a genuine issue.

He asked me to take a couple more videos of me cycling the bolt a little faster as he think it may help him diagnose the problem.

I'll be honest - I'm still baffled by this apparent need to cycle like lightning McQueen to get one chambered.

I haven't contacted the dealer as yet - getting informed first before my next move.

I'm slowly getting turned off this rifle however...
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by Gwion » 08 May 2017, 6:23 pm

Nope. I cycle pretty steady.
At least you're getting some traction with the supplier. Sometimes, if your retailer is making life difficult, it is well worth it to just go straight to the supplier with your issue.
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by FlyingStick » 09 May 2017, 10:13 am

Right. OSA is telling me there is no problem with the rifle, even based on the following videos. I'm getting shafted. Video 3 was one I managed to get through, the rest were as per usual with this rifle.

https://youtu.be/Nf1pzscw_4Y
https://youtu.be/hB1486vjAlQ
https://youtu.be/0q47s67aR_Q

I'm being told to go back to the vendor now.

:|
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Re: Howa 1500 "Slow feed" issue

Post by Oldbloke » 09 May 2017, 10:34 am

You are entitled to have it repaired, no question in my mind. Sounds like the LGS fobbed you off. OSA too.
Go back to where you bought, pick a busy time and complain about it in front of other customers. Don't argue but speak up. Speak your mind. Mention consumer law. Might get a better result.

Or if you know someone with an identical rifle dissemble both side by side and see what is different. Might spot the problem, could be a simple fix.

I hate bussineses that refuse to stand by their product.. Its like selling you a bucket with a hole in it. If they did that to me I would go elsewhere in future and bag the s**t out of them at every opportunity. Sell you a $700 item worth $250, next to useless like it is.
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