K98 Mausers?

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K98 Mausers?

Post by Bigjobss » 18 Nov 2017, 10:40 am

Anyone here know much about them?

I have always wanted legit WW1era Mauser and have been offered a matching number 1912 Danzig small ring karbiner.
Unmolested, not restamped etc and seems pretty legit and in great nick.

What should I look out for? Rough price guide?
Suprisingly hard to find good info on these.

Cheers
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Heckler303 » 18 Nov 2017, 12:25 pm

Just a note, they are not necessarily K98 Mausers, the one you speak of is a K98AZ. First, always look out for small ring and large ring mausers. The difference between the two being that the small ring is just a little less heavy, but at the same time doesn't have the exact same tolerances as a large ringer. However as you probably don't plan on ever rechambering it for something else than 8x57 you're all good. The majority of early model karabiner mausers were small ring models and the Danzig productions are one of them.

One thing you will want to do is quickly check over the serial numbers, as some variants will have mixed and matched parts over the course of their lifetime however this goes for pretty much any milsurp there is. You should expect to pay in today's money somewhere between 700-1000$ for a unmolested and matching parts gun, but try to heckle your way down if you can because frankly, you're not necessarily paying for something of amazing build, but a historically interesting item.

WW2 Mausers will run you a lot cheaper however and are a more updated pattern, however the originals are still a very nice piece.
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by marksman » 18 Nov 2017, 12:38 pm

“If you do not read the newspapers you are uninformed. If you do read the newspapers you are misinformed”. Mark Twain
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by No1Mk3 » 18 Nov 2017, 3:24 pm

G'day Bigjobss,
Check if the rifle has grasping grooves in the stock. For your year it should not have, and if so it has been restocked. Check also that the flattened underside of the bolt knob is checkered. If you can get it for the price Heckler quotes then you will be doing well. One sold last month for $1400. Cheers.
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Bigjobss » 18 Nov 2017, 4:54 pm

Thanks for all the info guys, really appreciate it.

Had a look and deposit is down!
Shes pretty sweet and everything matches, bore is bright and the stock hasnt been messed with and the stamps are still nice and deep, actually the amount of stamps all over it is pretty amusing.
I will post some better photos when I pick it up.
Id like to say I got if for Heckler $$ but it was a bit closer to No1MK3s estimate.
The build quality suprised me a bit, much better than expected, nicely made thing.

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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by marksman » 18 Nov 2017, 5:12 pm

very nicely made thing :thumbsup:
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Supaduke » 19 Nov 2017, 12:39 am

Good one
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Bigjobss » 19 Nov 2017, 4:39 pm

Heckler303 wrote:Just a note, they are not necessarily K98 Mausers, the one you speak of is a K98AZ. First, always look out for small ring and large ring mausers. The difference between the two being that the small ring is just a little less heavy, but at the same time doesn't have the exact same tolerances as a large ringer. However as you probably don't plan on ever rechambering it for something else than 8x57 you're all good. The majority of early model karabiner mausers were small ring models and the Danzig productions are one of them.

One thing you will want to do is quickly check over the serial numbers, as some variants will have mixed and matched parts over the course of their lifetime however this goes for pretty much any milsurp there is. You should expect to pay in today's money somewhere between 700-1000$ for a unmolested and matching parts gun, but try to heckle your way down if you can because frankly, you're not necessarily paying for something of amazing build, but a historically interesting item.

WW2 Mausers will run you a lot cheaper however and are a more updated pattern, however the originals are still a very nice piece.


Cheers you are on the money
My additional research has revealed that this particular rifle is know as a m98a or kar98a and was a carbine built off a mauser gewehr 98 for support troops, cavalry etc.
Confused me as during WW2 the updated carbine is the well known K98K.
The AZ desigantion was used during the prototype period and never officially adopted.

Fun weekend of research passing time beforen I actually get to bring it home!
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by bladeracer » 19 Nov 2017, 5:01 pm

Bigjobss wrote:The AZ desigantion was used during the prototype period and never officially adopted.


I thought the AZ (Z for stacking hook) was used right through WW1 and wasn't dropped until they started looking at further improvements in the twenties?
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by No1Mk3 » 19 Nov 2017, 5:12 pm

G'day Bigjobss,
Can you quote your sources please, as I would like to read them. Your carbine is called a Kar98AZ by every collector I know, including the likes of John Walter, Robert Ball and Hans Dieter Gotz. They were renamed as Kar98a post-war according to most sources. Would love to read your sources and learn more of their writings, Cheers.
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Bigjobss » 19 Nov 2017, 6:51 pm

bladeracer wrote:
Bigjobss wrote:The AZ desigantion was used during the prototype period and never officially adopted.


I thought the AZ (Z for stacking hook) was used right through WW1 and wasn't dropped until they started looking at further improvements in the twenties?


Youre right on that one, i was remembering a bad source, the germans redesignated it after the war to make roof for the 98b, its been a big weekend of reading from not knowing anything about these things 24 hours ago!
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Bigjobss » 19 Nov 2017, 7:04 pm

No1Mk3 wrote:G'day Bigjobss,
Can you quote your sources please, as I would like to read them. Your carbine is called a Kar98AZ by every collector I know, including the likes of John Walter Robert Ball and Hans Dieter Gotz. They were renamed as Kar98a post-war according to most sources. Would love to read your sources and learn more of their writings, Cheers.


The first 10 pages of google so far :D and John Walters German Rifle book, which has supposedly got a fair few innacuracies in it? :allegedly:

I have found searching for kar98a has yielded more info than searching for kar98az alone.
Also found this interesting refferenced "fact sheet" for kar98a that has opened the rabbit hole right up for for me, google The Kar.98a compiled by Peter Kuck and you will find a link to a YCC.org website, probably pretty basic information but the reffernces could be fruitfull.

interesting discussion here
http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread.php ... 912-Danzig
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by No1Mk3 » 20 Nov 2017, 9:30 am

G'day Bigjobss,
Good reading and well thought out assertions. As for Walters, yes, he has errors but everyone does, even (though I bite my tongue to say it) Dana Jones. most of what is said including Kuck's paper always tend to skip over the Kar98a of 1900/1902, and some do confuse this carbine with the later Kar98, especially as the Artilleriekarabiner 98 had a stacking hook! The rest is the same reasoning MauserBill was bashing us with 20 years ago, very well thought out but still skipping over other matters. For my self, I still refer to the Karibiner 98 of 1908 as the AZ due to the Imperial Order of February 6th 1908 approving "Verlangerter Karabiner 98 mit Aufpflanz und Zusammensetzeinrichtung", reading Kar98AZ. All these carbines, from Kavalleriekaribiner 98 to the start of the Kar 98b of the 1920's only had Kar 98 on the siderail (Kar 98b can be found stamped on some Weimar short rifles), and in literature of the times are not differentiated. I feel it is an argument that will never be settled, Just to finish on a note of confusion, despite my preference for "AZ", my own rifle is written in my register as "Erfurt 1917 Kar 98a". Go figure! Cheers.
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Re: K98 Mausers?

Post by Bigjobss » 20 Nov 2017, 9:53 am

Nice one No1Mk3, I think you are wise in reffering to the AZ desigantion because it cannot be confused with any other, dang Germans, for all their fastidiousness they did not anticipate the needs of collectors and enthusiasts a centry down the track!

Here is another intetesting discussion I have found:
http://www.k98kforum.com/showthread.php ... -AZ-OR-98a

Just a quick one about the Kar98a of 1900/1902 you mentioned, is that a different one to the Kar98A, with the capital A designating the early (pre AZ) carbine that was hampered by bad recoil/muzzle blast? I feel like im going in circles at times with my understanding!
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