Is surface rust something to be worried about?

[Bushie]

Hey fellas

I pride myself of how well I look after my own stuff so I'm sure you could understand how much this is pissing me off, is this surface rust and what do you recommend to get rid of it?

[bladeracer]

Hey fellas

I pride myself of how well I look after my own stuff so I'm sure you could understand how much this is pissing me off, is this surface rust and what do you recommend to get rid of it?

Are you cleaning with a copper solvent?

[Bushie]

Nah just g96, is that just excess copper?? That would explain eifbtheres none on my shotty

[Gun-nut]

Looks like copper to me, just use a good copper solvent and you'll be fine.

[bladeracer]

Nah just g96, is that just excess copper?? That would explain eifbtheres none on my shotty

Looks like copper fouling to me.
I use Outers Nitro Solvent.

[sungazer]

It does look very copperish and lots of it. I would go the Boretech products, Sweets and Hoopes benchrest copper remover on a more frequent use once you get it out with the first mentioned. JB's bore paste on a patch on a brush may also be needed.

[Bushie]

Thanks everyone was doing my head in thank God it's not rust

[Oldbloke]

Almost certainly copper. I use sweets. Great for removing cooper, lead & carbon.
Not cheap like all of them but u use very little. Follow instructions but leave in the bore up to 30 minutes if you want. It won't hurt the bore.

The down side is it stinks but the air born concentration will never be high enough to hurt you. Just ensure there is plenty of ventilation.

[juststarting]

Thanks everyone was doing my head in thank God it's not rust

...don't go crazy with copper solvent. Should only be used every 500 or so rounds.

[bigfellascott]

Thanks everyone was doing my head in thank God it's not rust

...don't go crazy with copper solvent. Should only be used every 500 or so rounds.

Who says? I use it every time I clean my bores.

[Oldbloke]

Thanks everyone was doing my head in thank God it's not rust

...don't go crazy with copper solvent. Should only be used every 500 or so rounds.

Who says? I use it every time I clean my bores.

I use it about every second or third clean. And I clean every time I use them. Even if it's just a couple of shots.

[juststarting]

Bah, you put me on the spot now!

Most solvent will have small amounts of coper fouling remover. However, I'm referring to stuff like Sweets and Hoppes Copper Solvent.

Something I've read a few times across different forums, that you shouldn't be using dedicated coper solvent, every time, due to its corrosive nature.

[juststarting]

...and should neutralize it with something when patching it out. That's what I've read, I'm sticking to this story

[Oldbloke]

...and should neutralize it with something when patching it out. That's what I've read, I'm sticking to this story

If you're talking about Sweet's there shouldn't be a need. Ammonia will not attack steel. But I always run a few brushes of Ed's Red through last. Gets rid of the Sweet's and prevents rust.

[marksman]

Hey fellas

I pride myself of how well I look after my own stuff so I'm sure you could understand how much this is pissing me off, is this surface rust and what do you recommend to get rid of it?

you silly bugger it is copper fouling
some people are of the belief that a rifle takes a few shots to shoot its best and leave the copper in just cleaning out the powder and carbon fouling
its what is called copper equilibrium or some thing like that, you shoot say 50 shots then your rifle is at its peak apparently then you shoot the rifle until you loose accuracy and clean the bore to pristine clean then start again I know a bloke who only uses ballistol to clean his bore, a very good shot to, I will usually clean my 30-06 properly after say 50 shots but clean powder and carbon after every use, others I will clean properly every time
I don't want to say its not right as there are some very good shooters who do this

[juststarting]

OB, I am, Sweets and Hoppe's #9 Bench Rest Copper Solvent. I've always been under the impression that this stuff will mess your bore up, if left in it for extended periods of time (e.g. didn't patch it out fully, etc). Pretty sure it says so on Sweets bottle as well, not to leave it in the bore for more than (insert amount) of minutes Perhaps I got on board of some urban myth train and didn't question it enough.

[Strikey]

Looks like a good case of copper fouling, not much to worry about as its easily removed. Use Sweets 7•62 on a patch, annoint the barrel, leave it for 10-15mins and patch out, repeat as often as necessary until you don't see any copper streaks or blue on the patches, clean out with dry patches then put a patch through with Sweets Oil for storage. Before shooting push a couple of dry patches through and you will have a clean barrel to start shooting with, thats been my barrel cleaning routine for more years than I can remember and the only thing that has damaged them is putting thousands of rounds through them

[brett1868]

Jeebus...not the "Which copper solvent works best" conundrum..

I've tried them all and by far the best is the Robla Solo Mil, made by the same company that makes Ballistol. In theory if a barrel is "Broken in" properly then copper fouling should be minimal and I've no reason to disagree. I was using solid copper projectiles in the 50's and copper fouling was virtually a non issue and the bore scope confirmed this.

Now....let the barrel break in arguments begin

http://brtshooterssupply.com.au/products/robla-solo-mil-100.html

A word of advice though, don't get any ammonia based product on your fancy timber, scope or painted surfaces.

[Oldbloke]

OB, I am, Sweets and Hoppe's #9 Bench Rest Copper Solvent. I've always been under the impression that this stuff will mess your bore up, if left in it for extended periods of time (e.g. didn't patch it out fully, etc). Pretty sure it says so on Sweets bottle as well, not to leave it in the bore for more than (insert amount) of minutes Perhaps I got on board of some urban myth train and didn't question it enough.

OK, sweets say leave no longer than 20 minutes or the bore will be damaged soposidly due to the ammonia being corrosive.
Only problem is that ammonia is transported in bulk around the country daily in steel tankers. Has been for yonks.
I might run a little test tomorrow. I should have time.

PS. See last paragraph.
https://www.corrosionpedia.com/definiti ... -corrosion

[Stix]

Im no expert here...but i prefer to clean all copper out every time i shoot...(doesnt always hapoen).

That comes from a building backround & seeing what copper does to steel--its very corrosive...
Ive seen bright (standard non-coated) nails dissolve in only months from being in contact with copper in certain form.

Ive got surface rust on blued & stainless barrels from not oiling for just a month or so during a moist winter, so im scared to think what copper could potentially do left for months...

Most of my most common shot rifles are new(ish) barrels that ive put through some form of break-in (shot/clean regime) & they dont really copper foul... (yet)...

[Gamerancher]

Dissimilar metals pose the risk of "galvanic corrosion". Some more so than others. Throw a copper washer in the bottom of an aluminium tinnie for a couple of months and see what happens. ( No, don't do this )The problem is exacerbated when an electrolytic medium is added to the mix, e.g moisture.
I've had a hole "eaten" through the side of an aluminium tipping trailer from a spot of copper concentrate that was missed and not cleaned out for a couple of months. Working in an underground copper mine really shows you how corrosive copper can be. We had to replace front ends of underground "boggers" that were unservicable due to corrosion eating through 60mm thick chassis structure. You'd cry if you saw the rust in a 3 year old Toyota chassis, we scrapped plenty of those too.
Yes, stainless rifle barrels ( or chrome moly ) should be more resistant than an alloy trailer/tinnie but the potential is still there. You still have two dissimilar metals. I've cleaned up plenty of second hand barrels to discover enough pitting under the copper to realize the potential risk.
In my experience, copper fouling is increased with higher velocities, longer bearing surfaces, high temperatures,"rough" bores and pure volume of shooting.
Best to get it out.
Sweets 7.62 is my go to, applied with a nylon brush, patched out after 10 -15 minutes. Repeat until the blue stops coming out on the patches. Then use a powder solvent on a bronze brush, patch clean and repeat the whole process until both solvents produce clean patches. Due diligence must be applied when cleaning and the use of quality, correct size rods, bore guides, brushes and jags.( More good barrels have been stuffed by sloppy cleaning practices than anything else. )
Some might say this is over the top but I apply this method to my competition rifles and they give very good barrel life and accuracy. Now all I need to do is shoot better hey Strikey.

[Strikey]

Jeebus...not the "Which copper solvent works best" conundrum..

I've tried them all and by far the best is the Robla Solo Mil, made by the same company that makes Ballistol. In theory if a barrel is "Broken in" properly then copper fouling should be minimal and I've no reason to disagree. I was using solid copper projectiles in the 50's and copper fouling was virtually a non issue and the bore scope confirmed this.

Now....let the barrel break in arguments begin

http://brtshooterssupply.com.au/products/robla-solo-mil-100.html

A word of advice though, don't get any ammonia based product on your fancy timber, scope or painted surfaces.

I had Robla Solo many years ago, have never used anything that cleans a barrel like that stuff but I thought it was discontinued, something to do with health reasons as that stuff had a strong odour I'd nearly prefer to sniff Sweets, perhaps the formula has been changed??

Gamerancher, you shoot alright sometimes One thing I have noticed in regards to barrel cleaning is people who do a bit of comp. shooting all tend to have basically the same cleaning regime just a difference in products used, possibly keeping their firearms shooting way beyond their ability

[juststarting]

I have noticed in regards to barrel cleaning is people who do a bit of comp. shooting all tend to have basically the same cleaning regime just a difference in products used, possibly keeping their firearms shooting way beyond their ability

For example?

[Gamerancher]

I think he was having a go at himself, me and other "silly-wet" shooters he knows JS. S'all good mate.

[juststarting]

[Gamerancher]

As in most of our rifles are capable of shooting way better than we are.

[juststarting]

I meant, now that this thread is going... I'm interested what is a good cleaning regime.

[Gamerancher]

Okay fair enough. Mine is as above except that I start with the powder solvent , Hoppes' No.9 for me, then go to the Sweets. I'm usually fairly tight about cleaning every 20 shots during a competition. Hunting, well, I have put over 150 rounds through in a weekend before cleaning when doing cull work. It just means more work when I get home.
Weekend before last at Canberra, I shot an 80 shot match plus about 25 sighters through my 6.5 Creedmoor without cleaning. It was stinking hot and I noticed the accuracy drop off a fair bit during my last detail. I had gotten busy with target crew duties, ( we had to set our own ) and spotting for others and just kept missing the opportunity to clean at my regular interval. While I don't usually clean to spotless each time, I find a regular scrub and patch during the day at about the 20 round count works well in my barrels. ( All stainless ) By not doing my regular thing, I not only lost accuracy but had a hell of a job getting a sh!t load of copper out at the end of the day. Of coarse this is my experience with my gear, and, as in all things to do with shooting, your results and applications may vary.

[sungazer]

I follow a very similar routine go after the powder fowling first then the copper and back to as clean as I can get it. It often means run a brass brush though then patch out then brush again then patch out. I have done a test with the sweets and have put it on both stainless and mild steel for over three days with regular top ups to keep it wet. Only on the mild steel could you barely see it had left a mark. So I am happy if I forget while watching TV and leave it one commercial break too many.
I would never clean during a days shooting though although that is not normally more than 36 shots. Then at the end of the day clean until clean. Its the best way to get repeatable results if you start from the same place each time.

[juststarting]

I thought some copper (that copper equilibrium that someone mentioned) is good... Wouldn't regular cleaning with sweets remove that?

Instructions say, keep patching until patches come out clean, so in that case, Rahat entire copper equilibrium statement is false, which means breaking in the barrel is useless.

Discuss.