Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Reloading equipment, methods, load data, powder and projectile information.

Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Vince24 » 13 May 2022, 8:28 pm

Hi guys

This is probably one of my first posts, so as a brief presentation, I am a shooter and collector, I am French (nobody's perfect) but my wife is Australian, we have moved into Australia in 2020 with the kids.

I have managed to import my collection from France to Australia (was an "interesting" experience going through the custom...) and I have purchased a few more since then. Mostly service rifles, i can introduce some of them if people are interested. I shoot at the Canberra SSAA range.

Long story short, I have quickly discovered that handloading is an absolute necessity in Australia, so I have gathered some ADI powders (quite painfully) and been helped into learning the handloading thing, which I must say, is a pretty interesting, and even addictive, activity.

Now the question, which powder for which rifle?
I get that we can experiment, but just to have a starting point.

I have gathered the following powders:

AR 2206H
AR 2208
AR 2209
AR 2213SC.

I have the following rifles and projectiles

6.5x55 => M96, M38 => 120 to 140gn pills
7.5 x 55 => K11, K31 => 168gn
308W => FR8, 98K, SMLE, Lee No4, Ruger Scout => 150gn
30-06 => Spg 1903, Mauser FN => 150 to 168gn
7.62*54R -> Mosin M44, M91/30 and hopefully one day M39 => 150 to 174gn
303 British => SMLE, No4, No5, P14 => 150 to 174gn
8mm Mauser => M1904/39, Kar98az, 98K => 196/200gn (what a pain to find those!)

So, I am calling to your long experience of shooting with the ADI powder, which one would you use for which rifle?
I do have a preliminary idea after a bit of googling and searching, but i don't want to influence your answers!

Thanks for your help!
Cheers,
Vince
Last edited by Vince24 on 13 May 2022, 8:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Vince24
Recruit
Recruit
 
Posts: 9
Australian Capital Territory

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by LawrenceA » 13 May 2022, 8:39 pm

http://www.adiworldclass.com.au/

All you could want to know.
One well placed shot is all it takes.
LawrenceA
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 399
New South Wales

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Vince24 » 13 May 2022, 8:46 pm

Yes I know the ADI load data and I know that nearly any of those powders could work on any of those rifles, but I would like something more refined from people’s experience if possible.

For instance I have heard the 6.5x55 loves the slow powders like 2213SC.

Cheers,
Vince24
Recruit
Recruit
 
Posts: 9
Australian Capital Territory

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bladeracer » 13 May 2022, 9:09 pm

Vince24 wrote:Hi guys

This is probably one of my first posts, so as a brief presentation, I am a shooter and collector, I am French (nobody's perfect) but my wife is Australian, we have moved into Australia in 2020 with the kids.

I have managed to import my collection from France to Australia (was an "interesting" experience going through the custom...) and I have purchased a few more since then. Mostly service rifles, i can introduce some of them if people are interested. I shoot at the Canberra SSAA range.

Long story short, I have quickly discovered that handloading is an absolute necessity in Australia, so I have gathered some ADI powders (quite painfully) and been helped into learning the handloading thing, which I must say, is a pretty interesting, and even addictive, activity.

Now the question, which powder for which rifle?
I get that we can experiment, but just to have a starting point.

I have gathered the following powders:

AR 2206H
AR 2208
AR 2209
AR 2213SC.

I have the following rifles and projectiles

6.5x55 => M96, M38 => 120 to 140gn pills
7.5 x 55 => K11, K31 => 168gn
308W => FR8, 98K, SMLE, Lee No4, Ruger Scout => 150gn
30-06 => Spg 1903, Mauser FN => 150 to 168gn
7.62*54R -> Mosin M44, M91/30 and hopefully one day M39 => 150 to 174gn
303 British => SMLE, No4, No5, P14 => 150 to 174gn
8mm Mauser => M1904/39, Kar98az, 98K => 196/200gn (what a pain to find those!)

So, I am calling to your long experience of shooting with the ADI powder, which one would you use for which rifle?
I do have a preliminary idea after a bit of googling and searching, but i don't want to influence your answers!

Thanks for your help!
Cheers,
Vince


I have all of those except the 7.5x55mm and .308 and all work very well with AR2206H, with cast and jacketed bullets. The AR2208 would probably work well also but I prefer AR2206H.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 10142
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bladeracer » 13 May 2022, 9:12 pm

Vince24 wrote:Hi guys

This is probably one of my first posts, so as a brief presentation, I am a shooter and collector, I am French (nobody's perfect) but my wife is Australian, we have moved into Australia in 2020 with the kids.

I have managed to import my collection from France to Australia (was an "interesting" experience going through the custom...) and I have purchased a few more since then. Mostly service rifles, i can introduce some of them if people are interested. I shoot at the Canberra SSAA range.


If you are a collector, and these are held on a collectors licence, then you can only shoot them at approved collector club shoots, not recreationally at the range. You need to transfer them to your CatB shooter's licence to be able to use them whenever you wish to.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 10142
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Vince24 » 13 May 2022, 9:24 pm

OK, pardon my French, by "collector", I just mean I like them. Formally, they are all under a cat B license, I am a member of SSAA, part of a military firearm club, with a range pass.
Vince24
Recruit
Recruit
 
Posts: 9
Australian Capital Territory

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by LawrenceA » 13 May 2022, 9:34 pm

Vince24 wrote:Yes I know the ADI load data and I know that nearly any of those powders could work on any of those rifles, but I would like something more refined from people’s experience if possible.

For instance I have heard the 6.5x55 loves the slow powders like 2213SC.

Cheers,

Yeah but each gun is its own rules.
My 6.5x55 loves 2208 and shoots under 1/4MOA.
Like you say 2206H and 2208 are very universal powders and they both will probably shoot OK but which will shoot best will only be discovered through trial and error.
One well placed shot is all it takes.
LawrenceA
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 399
New South Wales

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Blr243 » 13 May 2022, 9:52 pm

2208 is used in 303. I have used a stack of 2208 in my 308 , but I’m not sure if it’s still appropriate in a 308 built on a smle action
Blr243
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3821
Queensland

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by No1_49er » 13 May 2022, 9:57 pm

Would love to hear what your load data is for the 6.5x55.
2208 shoots < 1/4moa !
Military M96 / 38, or a modern sporter?
Projectile?
Powder charge?
Proud member of "the powerful gun lobby" of Australia :)
No1_49er
Sergeant
Sergeant
 
Posts: 657
Queensland

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by No1Mk3 » 14 May 2022, 12:45 am

G'day Vince24,
Welcome to Aus, I am a member of SSAA Military Rifle Club also, but here in Melbourne and also have all the calibers, and rifles, you mention.
My preferred powders,
6.5x55 = AR2209 140g FMJ
7.5x55 = AR2209 168g HPBT
308W = AR2208 155g HPBT (Dyer)
30-06 = AR2208 155g HPBT (Dyer)
7.62x54R = AR2209 174g HPBT Hornady .3105"
303 = AR2206H 174g FMJ
8x57 IS = AR2208 198g FMJ (S&B)

As for 8mm .323 projectiles, if needed contact Bruce Bertram at Bertrams Bullets, Seymour, Victoria as he is making 8mm projies now which friends have been shooting in Mauser, Lebel and Berthier with good results. I haven't tried them yet, but am about to reload 8mm Lebel with them for both rifle and carbine.
Bon Chance mate!
No1Mk3
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1589
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by LawrenceA » 14 May 2022, 2:24 am

No1_49er wrote:Would love to hear what your load data is for the 6.5x55.
2208 shoots < 1/4moa !
Military M96 / 38, or a modern sporter?
Projectile?
Powder charge?

37.5grains 2208
Nosler competition 140grain pill set way out.
Tikka T3 Varmint

Shoots .22 with 5 shots at 100
One well placed shot is all it takes.
LawrenceA
Corporal
Corporal
 
Posts: 399
New South Wales

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bigrich » 14 May 2022, 11:02 am

Vince24 wrote:Hi guys

This is probably one of my first posts, so as a brief presentation, I am a shooter and collector, I am French (nobody's perfect) but my wife is Australian, we have moved into Australia in 2020 with the kids.

I have managed to import my collection from France to Australia (was an "interesting" experience going through the custom...) and I have purchased a few more since then. Mostly service rifles, i can introduce some of them if people are interested. I shoot at the Canberra SSAA range.

Long story short, I have quickly discovered that handloading is an absolute necessity in Australia, so I have gathered some ADI powders (quite painfully) and been helped into learning the handloading thing, which I must say, is a pretty interesting, and even addictive, activity.

Now the question, which powder for which rifle?
I get that we can experiment, but just to have a starting point.

I have gathered the following powders:

AR 2206H
AR 2208
AR 2209
AR 2213SC.

I have the following rifles and projectiles

6.5x55 => M96, M38 => 120 to 140gn pills
7.5 x 55 => K11, K31 => 168gn
308W => FR8, 98K, SMLE, Lee No4, Ruger Scout => 150gn
30-06 => Spg 1903, Mauser FN => 150 to 168gn
7.62*54R -> Mosin M44, M91/30 and hopefully one day M39 => 150 to 174gn
303 British => SMLE, No4, No5, P14 => 150 to 174gn
8mm Mauser => M1904/39, Kar98az, 98K => 196/200gn (what a pain to find those!)

So, I am calling to your long experience of shooting with the ADI powder, which one would you use for which rifle?
I do have a preliminary idea after a bit of googling and searching, but i don't want to influence your answers!

Thanks for your help!
Cheers,
Vince


i'll offer some of my experience with loading for the calibers you list

i never had much luck with ADI in the 6.5x55 , RE22 is THE accuracy powder for the swede . if you can get it :roll: 140 SST's, speer 140's and 120 nosler BT's used to shoot rediculously small groups out of my MODERN model 70 winchester with madco barrel . 46.5 gn for the 140 sst, 46 gn for the 140 speer and 48.5gn for the 120 noslers . 2209 was a good powder with 140's and 2208 was good with the 120's . but the ADI powder did not match RE22 for speed and small groups . my m38's and m96 used to like 44gn of re22 with 140 speers for outstanding accuracy . it's basically a starting load , but low preasure , accurate and pleasant to shoot

2208 in your 308 ruger scout would be on the money , but some 308's shoot 165gn projectiles much better . my ruger scout did

30-06 , 2208 for 150 gn projectiles , 2209 for 165's has worked for me . again, 165's are that bit more accurate with the slower 2209

i haven't much experience with enfeilds, but p14's are incredibly strong and smooth feeding .i had it's cousin , the m17 30-06 , and is the best controled round feed rifle i've owned . good scope clearance with the standard bolt too . BUT , the receiver is that long, getting good eye relief with scopes can be a issue . the 303 p14 has a loose chamber according to some people , a new barrel with a modern tight chamber would make a p14 a very nice rifle . i,m planning on using 2208 or 2209 in a 303 martini i'm building up . i have a mate who swears by 2206h with the 303 round in enfields

8x57 with 170 SST's and 2206h was a very good combination in my rifle , but a mate of mine had better luck with 2208 in his . 200gn speers shot okay , but the SST was really good

i hope this info helps , as a rule , i've always found better accuracy with slower powders . as always , start with low preasure loads and work up .
good luck with your reloading . cheers :thumbsup:
User avatar
bigrich
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3812
Queensland

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Vince24 » 14 May 2022, 1:59 pm

thank you guys, this is really helpful, I'll see if there are more opinions and then I''ll try a synthesis.

Note it also depends on the rifle in the given calibre.
E.g. No1Mk3 said he likes 2209 in a 7.62*54R.
I can believe that in a 91/30, but how about an M44? I am going to set fire to the bush with the muzzle flame if I use 2209 in this short barrel?;)
The biggest surprise so far is the relatively fast 2206H for 303 British.
Is that because of the shape of the 303 case, i.e. large calibre but a relatively low capacity and slim case, a bit like a pistol case, compared to e.g. 6.5x55 or 7.5x55 which are just the opposite?
I am certainly happy to start with 2206H in the short barrelled Jungle!
Vince24
Recruit
Recruit
 
Posts: 9
Australian Capital Territory

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bladeracer » 14 May 2022, 3:57 pm

Vince24 wrote:OK, pardon my French, by "collector", I just mean I like them. Formally, they are all under a cat B license, I am a member of SSAA, part of a military firearm club, with a range pass.


I figured that was what you meant, but it never hurts to check :-)
I'm the same, I just love owning and shooting them.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 10142
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bladeracer » 14 May 2022, 4:04 pm

Vince24 wrote:thank you guys, this is really helpful, I'll see if there are more opinions and then I''ll try a synthesis.

Note it also depends on the rifle in the given calibre.
E.g. No1Mk3 said he likes 2209 in a 7.62*54R.
I can believe that in a 91/30, but how about an M44? I am going to set fire to the bush with the muzzle flame if I use 2209 in this short barrel?;)
The biggest surprise so far is the relatively fast 2206H for 303 British.
Is that because of the shape of the 303 case, i.e. large calibre but a relatively low capacity and slim case, a bit like a pistol case, compared to e.g. 6.5x55 or 7.5x55 which are just the opposite?
I am certainly happy to start with 2206H in the short barrelled Jungle!


Some powders are harder to find currently so you might not be able to use the optimal choice. I buy AR2206H in 4kg bottles so I always start with that in everything, if it doesn't give me satisfactory results then I start trying others. The 29" barrels can certainly make good use of slower powders, but most of the milsurp carbines still have reasonable barrel length compared to modern hunting rifles.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 10142
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by No1Mk3 » 14 May 2022, 4:27 pm

G'day Vince24,
I load 7.62x54R for use in M91, M91/30, PU, M44, and M39. What I load replicates Rumanian surplus and yes, the 44 flashes! But it does so with Wolf, PPU, S&B, etc. Just enjoy the show! (Especially at night). But then my 30-06 load is spectacular in the 20" Columbian Police Carbine. The accuracy in the 44 is good, a friend has top scored in 3P a couple of times with his Nagant M38 using the same load (he batch weighs cases and projectiles though, I don't) As for 303, quite a number have run around the circle with this calibre, and it really is a personal preference or particular rifle thing, but mosyt of us have come back to 2206H for consistency of performance. Again I load over a wide range of models from short barrel Egyptian Citadel Carbine to long barrel LE1 MkII, No1, No4, No5, P'14, L42 replica and really can't specialize the load so make a good generic load that equals MkVII performance.

PS: You sure your French, without a MAS36?? Not even a Berthier Carbine?
No1Mk3
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1589
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Vince24 » 14 May 2022, 5:06 pm

lol yes I am French and I purposefully did not import any MAS 36 with me, because I was affraid I would not find ammo and that it would not go through the custom given the MAS 36 have no safety at all (cost cutting measure in the post 1929 crisis:), and the customs are crazy about safety, I was told I had to paint red marks everywhere on the safeties for the fire position! which I did.

It went further, the border force found that the trigger on my original unmodified CZ 455 Camp was too light, had to get the spring replaced and re-sent the rifle to them for testing... Also I imported around 2,200 PPU cases in different calibres, they have counted them one by one, just to be sure, LOL!

So yeah I have no French rifles. A shame, they are not that bad and, as nasty people say, they generally haven't been fired, just dropped once;) - which is certainly not true for Lebels and Berthier btw.

Have no Italian, Japanese or Nazi rifle (except one redeemed through Israeli service) either, it's a matter of choice! I still wanted a nice 98K in original calibre for curiosity, so I have a mint Portuguese 1941 I got in Europe - not as desirable as a 1937 which has better sights, but anyway.

Back in France my shooter's life was easy: you can order ammo online and it gets delivered by regular post, so I was just shooting the regular PPU which are cheap and abundant in Europe, and good enough for this kind of rifle - the PPU also exist in "Match" versions in Europe, barely more expensive than the regular ones.

Here of course, no mail delivery for ammo, Canberra is f.cking far from Cleavers so I had to go into handloading, but handloading for 30 rifles requires time and a business-like organisation, especially if you want to keep the price at around $1 per round or less.

I will buy the 4kgs of ADI powder if and when I find them at reasonnable prices.

Was thinking only 2208 but given the results of this thread I'll probably get the 2206 and 2209 in 4kgs as well!

thanks everyone for your experiences, keep them coming!

I think that going forward, I will only be looking for 308W rifles, original or converted.
Even the 303 projectiles are hard to get, 30-06 or 7.5x55 are powder guzzlers, and 6.5x55 is so perfect that it gets boring ;)
While the 30 cal pills are everywhere and cheap!

Cheers,
Vince
Last edited by Vince24 on 14 May 2022, 5:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Vince24
Recruit
Recruit
 
Posts: 9
Australian Capital Territory

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bladeracer » 14 May 2022, 5:21 pm

Vince24 wrote:Back in France my shooter's life was easy: you can order ammo online and it gets delivered by regular post, so I was just shooting the regular PPU which are cheap and abundant in Europe, and good enough for this kind of rifle - the PPU also exist in "Match" versions in Europe, barely more expensive than the regular ones.

Here of course, no mail delivery for ammo, Canberra is f.cking far from Cleavers so I had to go into handloading, but handloading for 30 rifles requires time and a business-like organisation, especially if you want to keep the price at around $1 per round or less.


Until September last year we could still order ammo online also. I was looking at European ammo prices a couple weeks ago and was surprised to find they pay similar prices to us.

Primer supplies are the biggest issue here currently.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 10142
Victoria

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by Vince24 » 14 May 2022, 5:28 pm

Ordering ammo online until last september? With the regular mail in Australia??

When I say ordering online in France, I mean the regular stuff, like the books for your kids. Just need to show a licence.

I was paying between 70 cents and 1 euro in France or in Luxembourg, just need to know the good places.
https://armurerie.lu/430-prvi-partizan?p=3

that being said, I don't complain, it got me into reloading, and I find it incredibly interesting - and addictive!!
Vince24
Recruit
Recruit
 
Posts: 9
Australian Capital Territory

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by dnedative » 14 May 2022, 6:44 pm

TNT used to ship ammo; $60 flat rate for dangerous goods.
That all ended when TNT did.
dnedative
Private
Private
 
Posts: 78
New South Wales

Re: Which ADI powder for which Rifle?

Post by bladeracer » 14 May 2022, 8:11 pm

Vince24 wrote:Ordering ammo online until last september? With the regular mail in Australia??

When I say ordering online in France, I mean the regular stuff, like the books for your kids. Just need to show a licence.

I was paying between 70 cents and 1 euro in France or in Luxembourg, just need to know the good places.
https://armurerie.lu/430-prvi-partizan?p=3

that being said, I don't complain, it got me into reloading, and I find it incredibly interesting - and addictive!!


Not regular mail, it had to be couriered. But if you ordered enough of it the $60 fee disappeared to nothing. $20,000rds of .22LR last year was $2200 plus $60 freight. Now it's $2500 and your dealer has to be close enough to warrant you making the trip to collect it.

I like reloading so I don't buy any centrefire ammo other than the odd bit of milsurp when I come across it.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 10142
Victoria


Back to top
 
Return to Reloading ammunition