32-20 loads?

[bigrich]

another question for those knowledgeable on 32-20 in a rifle , small pistol or small rifle primers ? i've researched this on yank forums and the consensus ranges from small pistol for small charges of really fast pistol powder like unique , to rifle primers for slower powder like 2207 . others reckon there's no difference in accuracy . i'm inclined to say there's some truth in the first view . i guess i'll have to try and see what my rifle likes , but does anyone have any opinions on this ? my savage 23c has a 25" barrel , 1-20 twist and i'll be shooting 115gn coated lead boyne bullets . i know in 22 hornets i had, small pistol primers improved accuracy . i read a article by ken waters and he used small pistol magnum primers with jacketed bullets in his savage 23c in 32-20.

[Maxjon]

I use whatever I can get.....

[stevendj]

Long time lurker here. Forgive me for making my first post such a long winded affair. I posted this on the Marlin Owners forum, but I’ll add it here as I think it provides some data that bigrich may find useful as my situation seems to be very similar.

Here is some data that I have recently collected using my Savage 23C throwing 115 grain cast lead hollow points. I read and re-read as much as I could regarding loading the 32-20 with the powders described and approached this with as much caution as I could, however I am not an experienced reloader and would very much appreciate any feedback.

One reason to undertake the experiment was to determine if the smokeless loads were quieter than my black powder loads. My experience and that of my daughter who was my record keeper was that the black powder loads are possibly louder, but that the smokeless loads have a ‘crack’. I also wanted to map the velocities for each of the powders and just accumulate some experience.

I am not interested in chasing a particular velocity, rather I am just enjoying the exercise and wondering what I can do to load this rifle with a useful smokeless round. I am more than happy enough with loading black powder as an everyday plinker. I also don’t want to push my cast lead
bullets (20:1) faster than practical. I am not about to go into gas check territory any time soon.

I’m also not chasing accuracy just yet. I am shooting open sights and find that the effect of the weather/light on the front sight has a big impact on where the bullets land. Of the three shots at each load tested, all seemed perfectly adequate for the moment at around 1.5 inches at 40m.

I have fitted a linear regression to each data set. Given that I have only used 3 shots at each loading, I have no experimentally valid reason to see that any deviation of the average velocity is caused by anything but random error. I don’t think ‘velocity nodes’ and the 32-20 belong in the same discussion with my set up and needs.

Using these linear equations, it is interesting to see that an increase in one grain of powder increased the velocity by approximately 130 fps using AR2207 and 170 fps using AR2205 powders.

Loading 11.5 and 12.0 grains of AR2205, really starts making the muzzle jump and makes it feel like you are now shooting a ‘real centrefire rifle’.

I am not an experienced reloader, but looking carefully at the primers (with a hand lens in good light), nothing seemed strange at any loading. Cartridges extracted just as they always do.

Where to next…
1) Try 9.0 and 9.5 grains in AR2207 to see if I can make a quieter load that stays subsonic when taking into account the expected spread of velocity data. I may need to add some dacron fibre to ensure the powder remains at the rear of the case as I have done with my 25-20 loads. Please share your wisdom.
2) Gather a much larger set of data for my black powder loads.
3) Build a peep sight and change the front sight to enable me to assess target accuracy with more certainty.
4) Do some stability testing with a lighter bullet (105 grain) that should hopefully arrive soon. It seems that I have marginal stability with the 120 grain solid points from this MP 340-600 mold.

Attached below is the data from my experimental loading.

Steve

[bigrich]

Long time lurker here. Forgive me for making my first post such a long winded affair. I posted this on the Marlin Owners forum, but I’ll add it here as I think it provides some data that bigrich may find useful as my situation seems to be very similar.

Here is some data that I have recently collected using my Savage 23C throwing 115 grain cast lead hollow points. I read and re-read as much as I could regarding loading the 32-20 with the powders described and approached this with as much caution as I could, however I am not an experienced reloader and would very much appreciate any feedback.

One reason to undertake the experiment was to determine if the smokeless loads were quieter than my black powder loads. My experience and that of my daughter who was my record keeper was that the black powder loads are possibly louder, but that the smokeless loads have a ‘crack’. I also wanted to map the velocities for each of the powders and just accumulate some experience.

I am not interested in chasing a particular velocity, rather I am just enjoying the exercise and wondering what I can do to load this rifle with a useful smokeless round. I am more than happy enough with loading black powder as an everyday plinker. I also don’t want to push my cast lead
bullets (20:1) faster than practical. I am not about to go into gas check territory any time soon.

I’m also not chasing accuracy just yet. I am shooting open sights and find that the effect of the weather/light on the front sight has a big impact on where the bullets land. Of the three shots at each load tested, all seemed perfectly adequate for the moment at around 1.5 inches at 40m.

I have fitted a linear regression to each data set. Given that I have only used 3 shots at each loading, I have no experimentally valid reason to see that any deviation of the average velocity is caused by anything but random error. I don’t think ‘velocity nodes’ and the 32-20 belong in the same discussion with my set up and needs.

Using these linear equations, it is interesting to see that an increase in one grain of powder increased the velocity by approximately 130 fps using AR2207 and 170 fps using AR2205 powders.

Loading 11.5 and 12.0 grains of AR2205, really starts making the muzzle jump and makes it feel like you are now shooting a ‘real centrefire rifle’.

I am not an experienced reloader, but looking carefully at the primers (with a hand lens in good light), nothing seemed strange at any loading. Cartridges extracted just as they always do.

Where to next…
1) Try 9.0 and 9.5 grains in AR2207 to see if I can make a quieter load that stays subsonic when taking into account the expected spread of velocity data. I may need to add some dacron fibre to ensure the powder remains at the rear of the case as I have done with my 25-20 loads. Please share your wisdom.
2) Gather a much larger set of data for my black powder loads.
3) Build a peep sight and change the front sight to enable me to assess target accuracy with more certainty.
4) Do some stability testing with a lighter bullet (105 grain) that should hopefully arrive soon. It seems that I have marginal stability with the 120 grain solid points from this MP 340-600 mold.

Attached below is the data from my experimental loading.

Steve

thanks for posting that data mate . very useful , data on 32-20 can be hard to find hey . it's quite relevant that your using a 23c as well . i love mine , extremely accurate , i'll stick with 2205 for mine as it shoots one ragged hole with a scope . triggers easy to tweak too . i cut back a cz 452 trigger spring for mine. the sear height could probably be reduced, but i'll leave that job for a smith. it's crisp at 2.5 lb, but has a bit of travel before breaking . i've still got open sights on mine , factory chrome front blade with semi buckhorn rear . i found for my competition use a 6'o'clock hold on the bottom of "big black dot" on the targets they use (ssaa target 13m ) it's actually spot on . if i was to use it for hunting use, i'd get it fitted with a pic rail .

they'd be rarer than rocking horse poo , but the savage 23aa 22lr NRA match spec rifles had a factory peep sight that fits the 3 holes already drilled in the top of the 23 receiver . i've thought about getting a base made up that takes a "skinner" ghost ring using those 3 factory holes . "danger noodle" products is just west of me . i've been told he can scan and 3D print just about anything. if the 3D prototype fits/works he can cad/cam machine stuff up . another project on the "to do" list cheers