Low recoil 12 g loads

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Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Bent Arrow » 24 Dec 2018, 12:01 pm

So here’s my dilemma. My 12 year old has really taken to busting clays shooting down the line trap. He’s currently shooting Winchester low velocity, low recoil loads https://www.winchesteraustralia.com.au/products/AA12FL8

The lowest price I can currently get locally is $127 per slab, as only one shop in Adelaide keeps them in stock. Works out to $0.51 per shot. Standard 12 g loads work out to $0.31 to $0.34 per shot. So I want to close the price gap without forcing him to step up and take the recoil.

1 option is to buy a press and make loads for him from scratch, but probably not going to save a huge amount???

Would buying standard rounds, breaking them down by pulling out a bit of powder and shot, and reassembling them, (probably need an overshot card), be a viable option, or am I missing something here?

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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bladeracer » 24 Dec 2018, 12:26 pm

Bent Arrow wrote:So here’s my dilemma. My 12 year old has really taken to busting clays shooting down the line trap. He’s currently shooting Winchester low velocity, low recoil loads https://www.winchesteraustralia.com.au/products/AA12FL8

The lowest price I can currently get locally is $127 per slab, as only one shop in Adelaide keeps them in stock. Works out to $0.51 per shot. Standard 12 g loads work out to $0.31 to $0.34 per shot. So I want to close the price gap without forcing him to step up and take the recoil.

1 option is to buy a press and make loads for him from scratch, but probably not going to save a huge amount???

Would buying standard rounds, breaking them down by pulling out a bit of powder and shot, and reassembling them, (probably need an overshot card), be a viable option, or am I missing something here?

Cheers


I have no idea, but I would be at least trying the second suggestion. I would leave the powder alone and just dump some shot first and try it.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bigpete » 24 Dec 2018, 12:37 pm

Blackpowder mate lol
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bladeracer » 24 Dec 2018, 1:02 pm

Bent Arrow wrote:So here’s my dilemma. My 12 year old has really taken to busting clays shooting down the line trap. He’s currently shooting Winchester low velocity, low recoil loads https://www.winchesteraustralia.com.au/products/AA12FL8


I had a closer look at the Win ammo.
980fps 26gm load of #8.
And it seems the AA wad plays a role in reducing the felt recoil as well. But if you're going to replace the wads anyway then you're basically loading from scratch so you might as well just use empty hulls.

The loads I use are 1300fps 28gm #7.5.

My entire shotshell loading experience consists of dumping the shot out of bulk loads and swapping in BB's, buck and cast slugs. Everything I read about loading shotshells is that it is totally different from normal load development - you have to stick to official recipes only, no reduced or increased loads, different hulls, wads or primers, etc.

But then I watch Taofledermaus and Demolition Ranch loading all sorts of weird s**t into shotshells... :-)

My guess for clays is you need a very dense pattern at decent range. Whether you can maintain sufficient pattern with a reduced shot load will have to be determined with patterning. Whether you can still bust the clays at range with reduced powder charges will also have to be determined. Maybe hang some clays down the paddock at 10m intervals out to maximum expected range, then fire a normal round and see how far the pellets will consistently break the clay. Then you can try reducing velocity and/or shot weight until you are consistently breaking them at maximum competition range (maybe 50m?).

You might also get better patterning by tightening the choke with a reduced shot load?

I watched Paul Harrell's video yesterday about buckshot, which is not birdshot, although he has videos about birdshot as well. Getting the best out of a shotgun looks complicated :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ny67ZNy4zwQ
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by marksman » 24 Dec 2018, 1:33 pm

I dont have any loads for you but maybe someone who you are shooting with at the club can sell you some :unknown:
reloading for a shotgun can get pretty expensive, thats why shooters stopped doing it as much when the price of lead went through the roof,
I still reload for rabbits, #4-#6 1 and 1/2 oz loads at around 1300fps and they are good loads but if my kids want a shot I load 1 oz for them with a slower powder for less recoil :thumbsup:
it would end up cheaper if you could buy off someone else I think :drinks:
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Oldbloke » 24 Dec 2018, 2:03 pm

Yep. The problem is the cost of lead. Personally I’d reload slowish 28 gram loads for him.

Two cheap options for loaders.
Lee loader
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z7URLrnUQNI#menu

Or
Lee load all
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NT5tcGiA6cc
Hunt safe, look after the bush & plug more pests. :thumbsup: Better to load on the mild side. :o The greatest invention in the history of man is beer. :drinks: "Often the written message doesn't convey all of the information"
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bladeracer » 24 Dec 2018, 2:10 pm

You could also try a muzzle brake, although I haven't found a design yet that fits double-barrel guns.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bigpete » 24 Dec 2018, 2:21 pm

Geez,its actually super easy to reload shotshells hey. You don't need special tools or anything,although a roll crimper is handy.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bladeracer » 24 Dec 2018, 2:24 pm

bigpete wrote:Geez,its actually super easy to reload shotshells hey. You don't need special tools or anything,although a roll crimper is handy.


Yep :-)
I actually bought the Lee Load All a while back and haven't taken it out of its box yet.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by TassieTiger » 24 Dec 2018, 4:14 pm

I have a 14 year old in same boat - bought him a recoil shoulder pad and he can now shoot 150 shots without too much drama....$85 for a slab locally (of 1150-1200-1300 FPS) so your getting a bit of a raw deal.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Oldbloke » 24 Dec 2018, 4:18 pm

I’ve had a lee load all (plastic fantastic) for about 25 years. Still going strong. Must have loaded at least 1500 Rounds.

Shot shells are piss easy to reload. Not like BP. Lol
Hunt safe, look after the bush & plug more pests. :thumbsup: Better to load on the mild side. :o The greatest invention in the history of man is beer. :drinks: "Often the written message doesn't convey all of the information"
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Bent Arrow » 24 Dec 2018, 4:33 pm

TassieTiger wrote:I have a 14 year old in same boat...


Recoil with the low velocity loads doesn't bother him at all, he starts to get tired of the gun weight long before the recoil, but there's a big jump in recoil and noise when going up to standard loads. I'm wanting to keep him keen so,although I could bump him up to full loads, it's probably not a good idea just yet


Club price is $80 a slab for standard rounds. They don't hold the 980 fps rounds, so the $127 per slab is full retail in one of LGS. I'll have to ask the club if they can get the low velocity rounds in.
Last edited by Bent Arrow on 24 Dec 2018, 4:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Bent Arrow » 24 Dec 2018, 4:35 pm

bigpete wrote:Geez,its actually super easy to reload shotshells hey. You don't need special tools or anything,although a roll crimper is handy.


Yeah, might actually be something else we can do together too......
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Bent Arrow » 24 Dec 2018, 4:35 pm

bladeracer wrote:You could also try a muzzle brake, although I haven't found a design yet that fits double-barrel guns.


You can get the barrels ported.
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by Bent Arrow » 24 Dec 2018, 4:40 pm

Oldbloke wrote:Yep. The problem is the cost of lead. Personally I’d reload slowish 28 gram loads for him.

Two cheap options for loaders.
Lee loader
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=z7URLrnUQNI#menu

Or
Lee load all
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=NT5tcGiA6cc


Well my birthdays not far away. A load all might be the ticket.....
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bladeracer » 24 Dec 2018, 5:41 pm

Bent Arrow wrote:
bladeracer wrote:You could also try a muzzle brake, although I haven't found a design yet that fits double-barrel guns.


You can get the barrels ported.


I have heard of that. Is porting as effective as a brake?
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by bigpete » 24 Dec 2018, 6:26 pm

No it's not. In a shotgun it's mainly to reduce muzzle rise
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Re: Low recoil 12 g loads

Post by marksman » 24 Dec 2018, 6:34 pm

this is what I started off with many years ago
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/honey-bair-s ... :rk:1:pf:0

I have had a mec 600 jnr now for over 20 years and it does the job for me,
the biggest problem you will face is that if your young fella gets right into shooting clay's its very high volume reloading and nothing that has been suggested would be what you want unless you really enjoy hours of reloading every week but I suppose this would only be for now while recoil is a problem
a better recoil pad may be the answer for now :unknown:

also my 375 H&H is ported and it makes no difference to recoil but stops the muzzle lift as much to make it safer when you have a lion coming at you for a quicker follow up shot :allegedly: :thumbsup: I love shooting that rifle :drinks:
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