Actual reloadable .22LR.

Reloading equipment, methods, load data, powder and projectile information.

Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 21 Apr 2019, 4:53 pm

Attachments
22-LR-CF-289x300.jpg
22-LR-CF-289x300.jpg (19.4 KiB) Viewed 5834 times
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by Wm.Traynor » 21 Apr 2019, 7:33 pm

Some topics on another forum deal with rimfire ammo and the velocity spreads of various types, brands, descriptions and whathaveyou. Those tests have been related to group size.
The point I am laboriously trying to make is that maybe, by reloading, we will have a chance to achieve uniformity instead of being slaves to the random whims of lot numbers.
And may doG have mercy on us all.
Wm.Traynor
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1644
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by No1Mk3 » 21 Apr 2019, 8:06 pm

What do you shoot them in? You going to make or modify a rimfire bolt to centrefire? Modify the breech block of a Martini converted rimfire back to centrefire would seem easiest, or a rolling block Savage perhaps? Perhaps sleeve and chamber a 297/230 Francotte or make a 22 long Rifle version of a Morris Tube? They just seem to me to be a very sweet solution looking for a problem to solve!
No1Mk3
Second Lieutenant
Second Lieutenant
 
Posts: 2090
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigrich » 21 Apr 2019, 8:34 pm

Wm.Traynor wrote:Some topics on another forum deal with rimfire ammo and the velocity spreads of various types, brands, descriptions and whathaveyou. Those tests have been related to group size.
The point I am laboriously trying to make is that maybe, by reloading, we will have a chance to achieve uniformity instead of being slaves to the random whims of lot numbers.
And may doG have mercy on us all.


this is precisely why i'm experimenting with reduced 22 hornet loads at the moment. supposedly you can get a hornet sub sonic with the right load and dacron as a filler . :thumbsup:
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 22 Apr 2019, 1:57 am

No1Mk3 wrote:What do you shoot them in? You going to make or modify a rimfire bolt to centrefire? Modify the breech block of a Martini converted rimfire back to centrefire would seem easiest, or a rolling block Savage perhaps? Perhaps sleeve and chamber a 297/230 Francotte or make a 22 long Rifle version of a Morris Tube? They just seem to me to be a very sweet solution looking for a problem to solve!


They require modifying the firing pin or strike to center fire - move it to centre and round the blade off to a dome.

I think the sensible thing to do is get another bolt and modify it so you can swap between these and rimfire. I'd happily modify one of my Ruger bolts.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 22 Apr 2019, 1:59 am

bigrich wrote:this is precisely why i'm experimenting with reduced 22 hornet loads at the moment. supposedly you can get a hornet sub sonic with the right load and dacron as a filler . :thumbsup:


You can load anything down to subsonic without needing fillers, use Trailboss.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by on_one_wheel » 22 Apr 2019, 2:05 am

It's likely to be considered modifying it to the point it's considered a CAT B center fire.

Definitely worth investigating the legalities.

I'm interested 8-) I'll be following this thread :thumbsup:
Gun control requires concentration and a steady hand
User avatar
on_one_wheel
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3561
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigrich » 22 Apr 2019, 7:45 am

bladeracer wrote:
bigrich wrote:this is precisely why i'm experimenting with reduced 22 hornet loads at the moment. supposedly you can get a hornet sub sonic with the right load and dacron as a filler . :thumbsup:


You can load anything down to subsonic without needing fillers, use Trailboss.


Already using trail boss blade, the issue I think is not enough fill in the case to get a uniform ignition. Varying speed has been the result. On some yank forums they talk about using Dacron to fill the case and keep the powder uniformly in front of the primer. Apparently this idea has been around for at least 60 years. For those that don’t know, Dacron is that light fluffy fabric they put on the outside of cushions and such in upholstery. It’s made of nylon and exits the barrel like the plastic cup in a shotgun. This is something I’m going to experiment with as I get the time, some forum posters report 2.6-2.8 gn of TB giving 1250FPS . I suppose I could just buy a $6 box of 22lr and go shoot, but getting repeatable accuracy as opposed to varying results from 22lr is more desirable. And I just like to tinker, doesn’t matter how old you get, ya never stop learning
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigpete » 22 Apr 2019, 6:48 pm

You can buy 22 rim fire reloading kits anyway...
bigpete
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3577
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigrich » 22 Apr 2019, 7:28 pm

bigpete wrote:You can buy 22 rim fire reloading kits anyway...


enlighten me pete, i haven't heard of this before

:drinks: :drinks: :thumbsup:
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by Sergeant Hartman » 22 Apr 2019, 7:46 pm

Heard that as wil... not seen any though.

I wonder if a 223 bolt in a custom barrel... but that would raise the cost.

Still the rangers that only allow 22lr will not be very happy. I am experimenting with TB as I write.

I did find strange that changing loads moved the impact point both with regards to extension and windage
Sergeant Hartman
Sergeant Major
Sergeant Major
 
Posts: 1722
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigpete » 22 Apr 2019, 8:13 pm

Screenshot_20190422-194205_Google.jpg
Screenshot_20190422-194205_Google.jpg (439.54 KiB) Viewed 5574 times


Boom. Been around for years...
bigpete
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3577
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by wanneroo » 23 Apr 2019, 12:44 am

bigpete wrote:
Screenshot_20190422-194205_Google.jpg


Boom. Been around for years...


Yes, someone did a YT video on it I recall, seems to work ok.

I can't see the point in reloading 22LR but I guess it's a skill one can learn how to do.
wanneroo
Warrant Officer C1
Warrant Officer C1
 
Posts: 1412
United States of America

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 23 Apr 2019, 12:48 am

bigpete wrote:You can buy 22 rim fire reloading kits anyway...


Yes, but far from practical, reliable, or cheap, compared to simply priming these.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 23 Apr 2019, 12:50 am

Ziad wrote:I did find strange that changing loads moved the impact point both with regards to extension and windage


That's why when making reduced loads you want to try t find a load that drops vertically under your full-power loads, no windage difference if possible.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigrich » 23 Apr 2019, 4:49 am

bladeracer wrote:
Ziad wrote:I did find strange that changing loads moved the impact point both with regards to extension and windage


That's why when making reduced loads you want to try t find a load that drops vertically under your full-power loads, no windage difference if possible.


With the 22 hornet loads the full power loads at 2750fps are about 2” dead vertical point of impact to the 1550 trail boss loads, and that’s using different projectiles as well.
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by straightshooter » 23 Apr 2019, 7:30 am



I agree, an interesting curiosity.
But I think I will be fitting an ashtray to my motorbike before I dabble with any of those cases.
"Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about."
"There is no expedient to which a man will not resort to avoid the real labor of thinking." Sir Joshua Reynolds
straightshooter
Warrant Officer C1
Warrant Officer C1
 
Posts: 1263
New South Wales

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigrich » 23 Apr 2019, 8:04 am

straightshooter wrote:


I agree, an interesting curiosity.
But I think I will be fitting an ashtray to my motorbike before I dabble with any of those cases.


Should give up smoking then ya wouldn’t need a ashtray for ya bike :D mind you, a mates father years ago had a plastic stubbie holder and a plastic pub ashtray glued to the engine cover of his ride on lawn mower :lol:
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigpete » 23 Apr 2019, 9:00 am

bladeracer wrote:
bigpete wrote:You can buy 22 rim fire reloading kits anyway...


Yes, but far from practical, reliable, or cheap, compared to simply priming these.


You know this for a fact ?
I think,if you were going to bother arsing around at all with reloading a 22lr,this would at least be as good or better than mucking around with a centrefire 22lr....
bigpete
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3577
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 23 Apr 2019, 9:26 am

bigpete wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
bigpete wrote:You can buy 22 rim fire reloading kits anyway...


Yes, but far from practical, reliable, or cheap, compared to simply priming these.


You know this for a fact ?
I think,if you were going to bother arsing around at all with reloading a 22lr,this would at least be as good or better than mucking around with a centrefire 22lr....


I have never seen a great degree of success from anybody that has tried to reload rimfire ammo, and it is far more involved than loading centrefire ammunition. Some of the more successful efforts I've seen were still under-powered and with poor accuracy, with a 50/50 chance of ignition. It's basically a last-resort SHTF type scenario. I don't know that we could legally make or even possess the priming compound here in Oz anyway.

If you want "better" ammo you can disassemble loaded ammo and load your own charges and bullets, which is an expense on top of buying the ammo to begin with.

I have thought that it wouldn't be all that difficult to punch the rim out a touch to allow removing the dead priming compound and allowing the new liquid to better fill the rim, but it does add even more work to the job.

Using a small-rifle primer you could probably have quite serviceable plinking ammunition without adding any powder. I can see that I'll have to machine some brass.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigpete » 23 Apr 2019, 9:36 am

See,I'd just as soon buy a 22 hornet and load down or just about any other 22 centrefire than root around trying to make a centrefire 22lr which will technically be changing the category of the rifle it's firing in.
Now,a reloadable 17hmr...
bigpete
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3577
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigrich » 23 Apr 2019, 12:25 pm

17hmr , trail boss load in a 17 hornet would be worth investigating
User avatar
bigrich
Brigadier
Brigadier
 
Posts: 4483
Queensland

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by wanneroo » 23 Apr 2019, 11:13 pm

Aguila makes two different 22LR cartridges that uses priming compound only for shooting pests up close with little noise. I'd imagine a small rifle primer would provide enough oomph to do the same.
wanneroo
Warrant Officer C1
Warrant Officer C1
 
Posts: 1412
United States of America

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by on_one_wheel » 23 Apr 2019, 11:44 pm

Why haven't I seen a .22 LR rimfire round that better reflects our aerodynamic centrefire projectiles with ballistic tips ?
Gun control requires concentration and a steady hand
User avatar
on_one_wheel
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3561
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bigpete » 24 Apr 2019, 2:50 am

wanneroo wrote:Aguila makes two different 22LR cartridges that uses priming compound only for shooting pests up close with little noise. I'd imagine a small rifle primer would provide enough oomph to do the same.

A mate does that with 22 hornet and air rifle pellets...
bigpete
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3577
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 24 Apr 2019, 6:53 am

on_one_wheel wrote:Why haven't I seen a .22 LR rimfire round that better reflects our aerodynamic centrefire projectiles with ballistic tips ?


Primarily due to cost I'd say. WMR uses better bullets, but the cost is higher than some centrefire ammo.
I've pulled .22LR bullets and used the charged brass to fire .224" jacketed bullets in .22LR. Accuracy is excellent, but it's still so much easier to download something bigger.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 24 Apr 2019, 6:54 am

bigpete wrote:
wanneroo wrote:Aguila makes two different 22LR cartridges that uses priming compound only for shooting pests up close with little noise. I'd imagine a small rifle primer would provide enough oomph to do the same.


A mate does that with 22 hornet and air rifle pellets...


I've done it with empty .22LR brass and air-rifle pellets. Haven't tried it in the .223 as yet.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by on_one_wheel » 24 Apr 2019, 7:24 am

bladeracer wrote:
on_one_wheel wrote:Why haven't I seen a .22 LR rimfire round that better reflects our aerodynamic centrefire projectiles with ballistic tips ?


Primarily due to cost I'd say. WMR uses better bullets, but the cost is higher than some centrefire ammo.
I've pulled .22LR bullets and used the charged brass to fire .224" jacketed bullets in .22LR. Accuracy is excellent, but it's still so much easier to download something bigger.


Your right....Cost would be a killer, I guess that's why that HMR stuff is so pricey.

.224 bullets sounds like fun, I might get adventurous enough one day to look into that.

I guess we're limited to the mag length too if you don't want to single load them.
Gun control requires concentration and a steady hand
User avatar
on_one_wheel
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 3561
South Australia

Re: Actual reloadable .22LR.

Post by bladeracer » 24 Apr 2019, 8:21 am

on_one_wheel wrote:
bladeracer wrote:
on_one_wheel wrote:Why haven't I seen a .22 LR rimfire round that better reflects our aerodynamic centrefire projectiles with ballistic tips ?


Primarily due to cost I'd say. WMR uses better bullets, but the cost is higher than some centrefire ammo.
I've pulled .22LR bullets and used the charged brass to fire .224" jacketed bullets in .22LR. Accuracy is excellent, but it's still so much easier to download something bigger.


Your right....Cost would be a killer, I guess that's why that HMR stuff is so pricey.

.224 bullets sounds like fun, I might get adventurous enough one day to look into that.

I guess we're limited to the mag length too if you don't want to single load them.


The biggest problem is the .22LR is a healed bullet, the base of the bullet needs to be under bore size to fit in the case. Boat tails would likely work okay for seating, but are probably too long for the 16"-twist rate. I drop the bullet into the chamber, then seat the case behind it. A cast gas-check bullet would work okay, but doesn't offer any advantage over the standard bullet. If you seriously wanted to use jacketed bullets you'd probably put them in the lathe and turn the base down to about .220" to be able to seat them.
Practice Strict Gun Control - Precision Counts!
User avatar
bladeracer
Field Marshal
Field Marshal
 
Posts: 12655
Victoria


Back to top
 
Return to Reloading ammunition