SCJ429 wrote:Why are you taking the loaded cases apart? Is it possible to fire off the ammo you have? It would be good practice and save stuffing around.
gordicans wrote:SCJ429 wrote:Why are you taking the loaded cases apart? Is it possible to fire off the ammo you have? It would be good practice and save stuffing around.
yes good question ... I considered that but driving 70k's to the range firing off 100 rounds for the sake of it not my idea of fun. I'd rather collect the loaded projectiles and powder, and now that I have good case cleaning/resizing/measuring gear start from scratch and use the powder and projectiles and put some quality loads together rather than the haphazard one's I've got now. I want to do some load development with cases that are properly prepared with projectiles seated at the proper depths rather than just guessing and see if I can start putting some good groups together. They were around an inch or slightly above before but I'd like to do a bit better than that.
gordicans wrote:SCJ429 wrote:Why are you taking the loaded cases apart? Is it possible to fire off the ammo you have? It would be good practice and save stuffing around.
yes good question ... I considered that but driving 70k's to the range firing off 100 rounds for the sake of it not my idea of fun. I'd rather collect the loaded projectiles and powder, and now that I have good case cleaning/resizing/measuring gear start from scratch and use the powder and projectiles and put some quality loads together rather than the haphazard one's I've got now. I want to do some load development with cases that are properly prepared with projectiles seated at the proper depths rather than just guessing and see if I can start putting some good groups together. They were around an inch or slightly above before but I'd like to do a bit better than that.
straightshooter wrote:gordicans wrote:SCJ429 wrote:Why are you taking the loaded cases apart? Is it possible to fire off the ammo you have? It would be good practice and save stuffing around.
yes good question ... I considered that but driving 70k's to the range firing off 100 rounds for the sake of it not my idea of fun. I'd rather collect the loaded projectiles and powder, and now that I have good case cleaning/resizing/measuring gear start from scratch and use the powder and projectiles and put some quality loads together rather than the haphazard one's I've got now. I want to do some load development with cases that are properly prepared with projectiles seated at the proper depths rather than just guessing and see if I can start putting some good groups together. They were around an inch or slightly above before but I'd like to do a bit better than that.
If the ammo in question shoots acceptably and assuming you are not financially constrained then why not set it aside and save it for those uses where "bragging accuracy" isn't required. A lot of game has been shot with only average ammo.
In my opinion you would probably be better off starting with all fresh components in trying to make quality loads.
If you reuse components then you have a few more suspects, other than the usual ones, to blame if the new ammo does not meet your accuracy expectations.
Stix wrote:Hey gordigans...
Im not sure how you're pulling the projectiles, but if you're using that 'grip-n-pull'...& you intend to re-use the projectiles, especially if loaded real close to lands, be aware that the grip-n-pull may well deform the bullet & change the ogive.
...how much it changes is dependant on the neck tension the loaded rounds have now, & how hard you grip the tool.
So keep in mind, reloading these if deformed (even slightly) they may also be out of round... ... (ive never tested bullets pulled this way for concentricity, but i have measured ogive & that does change-all be it only slightly).
Also, given that, depending how long these rounds have been in existance it might be worth cracking them first with the seater die--just set the seater die so you push the bullet down (seat it deeper in case) one thou or so before pulling--it may well make it easier to pull them.
When i pull bullets (i use the grip-n-pull) i dont use the pulled bullets for load testing, but i do use them for hunting/plinking etc once load testing is done.
Also, if these cases have already been fired in that chamber, i wouldnt size the case, just graphite the necks & neck size...
TassieTiger wrote:In regards to the cases - your missing the same thing I did until it was explained.
The first firing of new cases and those cases that have been full resized - will allow the case / neck / etc to fireform specifically to your chamber.
The cases are then - tailored to your rifle and only need neck sizing to give you the best consistency / accuracy.
If your loaded ammo is new, recently resized, never fired in your rifle, etc - then there are additional benefits to simply firing the ammo to fireform those particular cases.
gordicans wrote:TassieTiger wrote:In regards to the cases - your missing the same thing I did until it was explained.
The first firing of new cases and those cases that have been full resized - will allow the case / neck / etc to fireform specifically to your chamber.
The cases are then - tailored to your rifle and only need neck sizing to give you the best consistency / accuracy.
If your loaded ammo is new, recently resized, never fired in your rifle, etc - then there are additional benefits to simply firing the ammo to fireform those particular cases.
Thanks Tassie, but I get this one. I bought most of my in the 1970's and have been used a fair bit so they are far from new cases so and that is part of the problem. I don't trust them any more in the breach. So I'll be separating the ones that need full length resizing from the others. And then case trimming will be the main job to get these cartridges into shape then I can do some load development... I suspect some of the cases have lengthened to the extent that they are pushing onto the lands.
Fortunately the .222 is a forgiving cartridge from this perspective.
gordicans wrote:Stix wrote:Hey gordigans...
Im not sure how you're pulling the projectiles, but if you're using that 'grip-n-pull'...& you intend to re-use the projectiles, especially if loaded real close to lands, be aware that the grip-n-pull may well deform the bullet & change the ogive.
...how much it changes is dependant on the neck tension the loaded rounds have now, & how hard you grip the tool.
So keep in mind, reloading these if deformed (even slightly) they may also be out of round... ... (ive never tested bullets pulled this way for concentricity, but i have measured ogive & that does change-all be it only slightly).
Also, given that, depending how long these rounds have been in existance it might be worth cracking them first with the seater die--just set the seater die so you push the bullet down (seat it deeper in case) one thou or so before pulling--it may well make it easier to pull them.
When i pull bullets (i use the grip-n-pull) i dont use the pulled bullets for load testing, but i do use them for hunting/plinking etc once load testing is done.
Also, if these cases have already been fired in that chamber, i wouldnt size the case, just graphite the necks & neck size...
Thanks Stix, good advice. I'm using one of those hammer thingos (I just looked it up, they're called a "kinetic bullet puller") and I've looked at them afterwards with a strong magnifier and there looks to be just some very minor surface scratches on the bullet after removing them. Regarding cases I now have a full length resizing die so will be testing all the cases simply by putting into the chamber and only neck size them unless there's any resistance on the bolt when I remove them from the chamber. Then I'll measure for case trimming. Some of these cases I bought in the 1970's but they haven't had a lot of rounds through them.